Snow in Atlanta

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kyleb

Final Approach
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Drake the Outlaw
Why is it that every time it snows here I feel like Lewis Hamilton in the Mercedes surrounded by a bunch of drunk Eastern Europeans driving Trabants with bald tires?

Jeez people, it ain't hard. Energy management, don't pull too many G's in the corners, and pretend there's an egg between your foot and the brake and/or throttle pedal.
 
Welcome to the south dude. It’s always been the same here in SE Tennessee. A dusting of snow and the grocery stores are cleaned out of eggs, bread and milk!
 
I think the only smart drivers in snow are the ones going slow. It is hard. You don’t know it until the back end slides it the brakes don't brake.
Thinking you can drive somewhat normally is what causes the accidents.
In Atlanta I’m guessing even moreso, as the closer the temp is to 32, the slicker the snow.
 
Hunker down ,relax ,the snow won’t last long.
 
Seems like the general population forgets what driving on snow is like around here and needs to relearn it every year....:)
 
AKBill said:
Seems like the general population forgets what driving on snow is like around here and needs to relearn it every year....:)
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It's just the same here, every 4 or 5 years when we get snow, it's like nobody knows how to drive in it . . . .
 
Ryanb said:
Welcome to the south dude. It’s always been the same here in SE Tennessee. A dusting of snow and the grocery stores are cleaned out of eggs, bread and milk!
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I've always lived in Atlanta. We had a thing here called Snowjam in 1980 where a storm showed up about 4 hours earlier than projected and hit right at the beginning of rush hour. I was a new driver, at a movie (Taps, BTW) with a date, and spent the next 8 hours driving home. No runs, hits, or errors. If it wasn't for all of the boneheads, I'd have made it home in 45 minutes.

Pretty much the same today except I'm driving a FWD vehicle with ABS, traction control, and all season tires as opposed to a RWD Datsun 210 wagon with little bitty slick tires.
 
Hank S said:
It's just the same here, every 4 or 5 years when we get snow, it's like nobody knows how to drive in it . . . .
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One good thing is when the snow flies around here the bears hibernate..:)
 
AKBill said:
One good thing is when the snow flies around here the bears hibernate..:)
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I spent several winters in Alaska.

Now when the snow flies, so do I.... But lately it has been colder in Gallup than in Juneau. I think we get a reprieve this weekend. Temps up in the mid 50s during the day, but lows in the single digits at night. Must be the 6000+ feet difference in elevation.

But at least no snow here, yet.
 
We had our chapter Christmas Party tonight, maybe half of those that RSVPed didn't come. We still had a good group and had a great time. My commute from home to the airport took the usual amount of time.
 
kyleb said:
Why is it that every time it snows here I feel like Lewis Hamilton in the Mercedes surrounded by a bunch of drunk Eastern Europeans driving Trabants with bald tires?

Jeez people, it ain't hard. Energy management, don't pull too many G's in the corners, and pretend there's an egg between your foot and the brake and/or throttle pedal.
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Speaking of, what happened at PDK?
OIS has it listed as closed due to aircraft incident?
 
Plane slid off the runway, apparently no injuries.
 
I just checked the notam and didn't see anything about an incident. I do know that the county doesn't plow until they finish the roads.
 
Kritchlow said:
I think the only smart drivers in snow are the ones going slow. It is hard. You don’t know it until the back end slides it the brakes don't brake.
Thinking you can drive somewhat normally is what causes the accidents.
In Atlanta I’m guessing even moreso, as the closer the temp is to 32, the slicker the snow.
Click to expand...

It's quite complex to understand driving in ice and snow, but fairly easy to actually do. When newcomers from The City move up here and ask me about how we get around in the winter, I tell them to practice driving a few specific mountain routes, all around 25 to 35 miles in length, without using the brakes except for emergencies or coming to final stops at stop signs. They also have to keep at least six seconds of distance between themselves and the vehicle in front of them, but they have to do it without braking. Once they can do that consistently, they're ready for winter.

Rich
 
Dave Theisen said:
I just checked the notam and didn't see anything about an incident. I do know that the county doesn't plow until they finish the roads.
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Only notam I see:

PDK 12/013 PDK AD AP CLSD EXC HEL 171208
 
RJM62 said:
It's quite complex to understand driving in ice and snow, but fairly easy to actually do. When newcomers from The City move up here and ask me about how we get around in the winter, I tell them to practice driving a few specific mountain routes, all around 25 to 35 miles in length, without using the brakes except for emergencies or coming to final stops at stop signs. They also have to keep at least six seconds of distance between themselves and the vehicle in front of them, but they have to do it without braking. Once they can do that consistently, they're ready for winter.

Rich
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Right... but the folks that *think* they can drive in the winter are the ones screwing it up. Not the the ones using the techniques you are suggesting, but rather the folks driving like it’s no big deal.
I’d rather have an overly cautious person over a 4WD guy thinking he can drive like normal. He can’t. Last I checked braking action and spin g’s were the same regardless of how many wheels drive you have.
 
Had a rare snow storm when I lived in Oklahoma. I didn't have any problem in our Dodge Grand Caravan, but the drainage ditches were filled with 4WD pickups and SUVs. What they forgot was that all cars have four-wheel brakes; having power to all four wheels merely gets them to the scene of the accident.
 
RJM62 said:
It's quite complex to understand driving in ice and snow, but fairly easy to actually do. When newcomers from The City move up here and ask me about how we get around in the winter, I tell them to practice driving a few specific mountain routes, all around 25 to 35 miles in length, without using the brakes except for emergencies or coming to final stops at stop signs. They also have to keep at least six seconds of distance between themselves and the vehicle in front of them, but they have to do it without braking. Once they can do that consistently, they're ready for winter.

Rich
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Know exactly what you mean..I grew up in Hamden, did a milk route, (picking up cans of milk). back when we didn't have many city folks
 
Kritchlow said:
Right... but the folks that *think* they can drive in the winter are the ones screwing it up. Not the the ones using the techniques you are suggesting, but rather the folks driving like it’s no big deal.
I’d rather have an overly cautious person over a 4WD guy thinking he can drive like normal. He can’t. Last I checked braking action and spin g’s were the same regardless of how many wheels drive you have.
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Yep. Braking is perilous no matter how many wheels are under power. Most of winter driving comes down to energy management without braking, anticipating maneuvers, and maintaining adequate following distance.

Rich
 
Tom-D said:
Know exactly what you mean..I grew up in Hamden, did a milk route, (picking up cans of milk). back when we didn't have many city folks
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The first route I tell people to practice driving without brakes is Delaware County 2 from Andes to Delancey. County 26 between Hawleys and Downsville is the next assignment. The Final Exam, as it were, is County 6 between NY 28 in Bovina and NY 28 by Palmer Hill. If they can drive all three of those routes without using their brakes, they'll have mastered the energy management part of winter driving. They may not understand why it's important, but they'll be able to do it.

Pretty much everyone moving into this area are retirees from The City, Long Island, and New Jersey. The Millennials are moving out because there's no future for them here unless they're farmers, are self-employed, or can work out of their homes. The latter is getting easier because both Margaretville Telephone Company and Frontier Communications are buying up and upgrading Verizon POTS franchises and bringing high-speed Internet into the boonies (which Verizon has zero interest in doing, despite having been offered generous subsidies by the State). But for most young people, their futures are elsewhere. There's nothing here for them. :(

Rich
 
There isn't anything particularly difficult about driving on snow, you just need to take a little easier, make sure all control inputs are smooth, know your car, and anticipate what is coming up. Put some good snow tires on and it becomes even easier.

One thing I like to do when it has been snowing is to do a few tests before I get onto a main road (or even on a main road if there aren't any other cars around). Try mashing your foot down on the accelerator. What does it take to break the wheels loose? Break harder than you should. Again what does it take to break the car loose. Those give you an idea for the limits of the car's capabilities on that day in that weather.

I also frequently take the car into an empty parking lot to test the car's limits. What does it take to get the car to start sliding? How do I recover from it? etc.

In addition to making you learn your car better, the above tests are just fun. Kind of like doing stalls, steep turns, etc. in your plane.
 
Kritchlow said:
Last I checked braking action and spin g’s were the same regardless of how many wheels drive you have.
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Winner, winner, chicken dinner. 4wd helps when you need to apply power. That's all.

I came home yesterday to find that SWMBO had taken our Jeep Wrangler to run an errand rather than her Toyota Highlander. The Highlander has all season tires, ABS, traction control, steel doors, steel roof, and a gazillion airbags. The Jeep has a short wheelbase, a torquey drive train, a canvas top, and a seatbelt. The only redemption is 4WD. I haven't bothered having the discussion that the Toyota would have been a better choice...
 
kyleb said:
Winner, winner, chicken dinner. 4wd helps when you need to apply power. That's all.

I came home yesterday to find that SWMBO had taken our Jeep Wrangler to run an errand rather than her Toyota Highlander. The Highlander has all season tires, ABS, traction control, steel doors, steel roof, and a gazillion airbags. The Jeep has a short wheelbase, a torquey drive train, a canvas top, and a seatbelt. The only redemption is 4WD. I haven't bothered having the discussion that the Toyota would have been a better choice...
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Yup. 4WD's are the towing industries bread and butter. AWD's to. At least that's what the driver said who pulled me out once when I stuck my 'I am invincible because I have 4WD' head up my azz and went somewhere I shouldn't have.
 
luvflyin said:
Yup. 4WD's are the towing industries bread and butter. AWD's to. At least that's what the driver said who pulled me out once when I stuck my 'I am invincible because I have 4WD' head up my azz and went somewhere I shouldn't have.
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That's what I see in Atlanta. I got around in a front wheel drive Altima with a manual transmission much better than the yahoos driving 4WD trucks with an auto transmission.

Downtown Atlanta is hilly. Not huge climbs, just not flat with lots of low rolling hills. You see people pull up behind another vehicle car at a red light with snow/ice on the road and stop right behind them and then wait for the light to change. Then they wonder why they can't get moving. o_O Their warm tires have created a slick spot on the snow/ice by sitting there. I just downshift and slow down to a crawl and kick in the clutch where needed to keep rolling slow enough and then start moving again when the light is green and traffic is moving. Easy peasy.
 
I grew up in Illinois and moved here when my father got transferred to Atlanta in '78. Driven in the snow many times up north, but last night was a long trek home from Gainesville to Roswell (visiting my father). We had 7.5", when they predicted 1". LoL
 
RJM62 said:
The first route I tell people to practice driving without brakes is Delaware County 2 from Andes to Delancey. County 26 between Hawleys and Downsville is the next assignment. The Final Exam, as it were, is County 6 between NY 28 in Bovina and NY 28 by Palmer Hill. If they can drive all three of those routes without using their brakes, they'll have mastered the energy management part of winter driving. They may not understand why it's important, but they'll be able to do it.

Pretty much everyone moving into this area are retirees from The City, Long Island, and New Jersey. The Millennials are moving out because there's no future for them here unless they're farmers, are self-employed, or can work out of their homes. The latter is getting easier because both Margaretville Telephone Company and Frontier Communications are buying up and upgrading Verizon POTS franchises and bringing high-speed Internet into the boonies (which Verizon has zero interest in doing, despite having been offered generous subsidies by the State). But for most young people, their futures are elsewhere. There's nothing here for them. :(

Rich
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Delaware County 2 from Andes to Delancey. That's the cabin hill road.
County 26 between Hawleys and Downsville. I was raised on the McDonald Rd (first farm up). and went to the 1 room school on the river road .
You should have them drive the Brambley Mountain road from Bovina center to Bloomville. my sister lived all her married life on the first farm up the bloomville side.
 
Driving on fresh snow is easy, it gets nasty after it gets packed into white ice.
 
In the Pacific Northwest there are a lot of 4WD vehicles. We know, because when they're overturned in the ditch you can see the 4WD mechanism very clearly. o_O

RJM62 said:
They also have to keep at least six seconds of distance between themselves and the vehicle in front of them, but they have to do it without braking. Once they can do that consistently, they're ready for winter.
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Here in PHX, people drive like their lives are unfulfilled unless they can reach out and touch the vehicle ahead, regardless of speed. Not complaining, though ... in my former life I was a personal injury attorney, and that driving style put my kids through college.
 
wayne said:
Downtown Atlanta is hilly. Not huge climbs, just not flat with lots of low rolling hills. You see people pull up behind another vehicle car at a red light with snow/ice on the road and stop right behind them and then wait for the light to change.
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People have no concept that in slick conditions, you don't stop halfway up a hill. You either arrange spacing or speed so you make it to the top without stopping, or you stop before the hill and wait until you can go all the way up in one move. There is nothing more pitiful than a line of cars stuck on a hill because none of 'em can get enough traction to do anything but slide around and play bumper cars.
 
Tom-D said:
Driving on fresh snow is easy, it gets nasty after it gets packed into white ice.
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Ice is nasty. When things get tough, I aim for the buildups of slush. Bad traction there, but better than on the ice.

Dropping a wheel into the grass is an option too, sometimes.
 
kyleb said:
Dropping a wheel into the grass is an option too, sometimes.
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Best look at that one close,, Grass this time of year can mean bottomless mud
 
When I lived north of the arctic circle, snow was like sand, and driving on it was like driving on sand.

And landing on snow covered runways were usually no problem. But if the snow was light and fluffy, don't use the brakes because it will melt the snow, refreeze while stopped and then the wheels don't turn.

Having a four wheel drive usually means I am stuck twice as bad as I would be in a two wheel drive....
 
Pilawt said:
In the Pacific Northwest there are a lot of 4WD vehicles. We know, because when they're overturned in the ditch you can see the 4WD mechanism very clearly. o_O
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Most with California plates. :) Driven by South easy asian or Islander immigrants.
 
kyleb said:
Ice is nasty. When things get tough, I aim for the buildups of slush. Bad traction there, but better than on the ice.

Dropping a wheel into the grass is an option too, sometimes.
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Ice hidden under fresh snow is even worse. Studded tires help a lot in that situation if one can deal with the noise.

Rich
 
Kritchlow said:
Right... but the folks that *think* they can drive in the winter are the ones screwing it up. Not the the ones using the techniques you are suggesting, but rather the folks driving like it’s no big deal.
I’d rather have an overly cautious person over a 4WD guy thinking he can drive like normal. He can’t. Last I checked braking action and spin g’s were the same regardless of how many wheels drive you have.
Click to expand...

I tell people that cars have had four wheel brakes since 1910 (+/-) and no 4 wheel drive vehicle can stop faster than an equivalent 2 wheel drive. Speed is what causes accidents in the winter... generally speaking.

-Skip
 
Thanks to the snow, in stuck up here at work instead of at home with my family.

All of the flights were oversold. Trying to commute home would have been a nightmare. Even the flight up to ABE was delayed big time.
 
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