Skycatcher - Good as first aircraft for raking up hours?

Kenny Phillips said:
Which cannot be done to a Skycatcher, which is an LSA. But I would do that if I had an SLSA.
Click to expand...

I’m pretty sure that’s not right. What makes the SkyCatcher different from the myriad S-LSA’s, including my Sky Arrow, that are routinely taken to E-LSA status?

I can probably quickly verify that with a DAR if you can’t come up with something definitive.
 
21.191 Experimental certificates.
Experimental certificates are issued for the following purposes:
(i) Operating light-sport aircraft. Operating a light-sport aircraft that—
(3) Has been previously issued a special airworthiness certificate in the light-sport category under §21.190.


https://www.faa.gov/aircraft/gen_av/light_sport/media/LSA_Cert_8July2013.pdf

"Aircraft previously issued an SLSA airworthiness certificate under 14 CFR § 21.190 may be eligible under 14 CFR § 21.191(i)(3). (Ref. Order 8130.2G CHG 1, 4081.a.(2))This may occur when - •The owner/applicant elects to no longer perform the LSA maintenance or service directives, in accordance with the manufacturer’s instructions and the applicable FAA-accepted consensus standards. •The LSA manufacturer’s continued airworthiness operations/continued airworthiness system is not maintained or no longer exists. This causes a condition of LSA ineligibility and a reduction in continued operational safety that may invalidate this special airworthiness certificate, causing it to no longer be in effect. That aircraft may be eligible in another experimental purpose with modified conditions of operation. "

"Aircraft previously issued an SLSA airworthiness certificate under 14 CFR § 21.190 that are now operating as an ELSA under 14 CFR § 21.191(i)(3). oThese aircraft have previously been flight tested and are not required to have additional flight testing unless they have been altered from their original configuration.oFor a major change to the aircraft (such as an alteration, modification, addition, or deletion), the FAA may modify the ELSA operating limitations with special restrictions for flight testing due to the aircraft modification.oThese aircraft cannot be used for flight instruction for compensation or hire or fortowing for compensation or hire."
 
jrcox19 said:
What? The Skycatcher is on the SLSA list from the FAA. And there's other examples of ELSA Skycatchers
Click to expand...
Yeow; I see that it is indeed an ASTM consensus airplane. I didn't think that Cessna would ever do that. And they didn't, for long.
What's the upside of going ELSA for that bird? I'd not carry more weight, unless I knew that Cessna had tested it for a larger gross.
 
[According to the internet]

The Skycatchers are/were SLSA so could be changed to ELSA.

That won't work for @texasclouds' club plane because ELSA cannot be rented.
 
Kenny Phillips said:
Yeow; I see that it is indeed an ASTM consensus airplane. I didn't think that Cessna would ever do that. And they didn't, for long.
What's the upside of going ELSA for that bird? I'd not carry more weight, unless I knew that Cessna had tested it for a larger gross.
Click to expand...

Nearly all factory built LSA's are S-LSA.. There was no real value to certify under Normal/Primary for LSA and it was more work, so of course Cessna went S-LSA. ELSA doesn't get you any more weight, since it still has to remain an LSA. But it greatly expands what you can do for maintenance, upgrades, etc. Which is especially helpful if the manufacturer has abandoned the airframe.
 
jrcox19 said:
ELSA doesn't get you any more weight, since it still has to remain an LSA. But it greatly expands what you can do for maintenance, upgrades, etc. Which is especially helpful if the manufacturer has abandoned the airframe.
Click to expand...

E-LSA permits anyone to do maintenance on the aircraft, and with a 16-hour course lets the owner do Annual Condition Inspections. A HUGE benefit for those mechanically inclined. Since 2009 I’ve made maybe a dozen minor modifications to my Sky Arrow, such as installing an LED landing light, a lithium-iron battery and replacing the Ducati voltage regulator with a cheaper and more reliable John Deere. And more recently adding ADS-B out via a Garmin GDL 82.

As important, with an S-LSA, no modifications or parts substitutions are allowed without a Letter of Authorization from the manufacturer. That includes something as simple as a different brand of tire or battery, let’s say. And LOA’s from some manufacturers can be very difficult or impossible to get, as with the 162. I can say from experience getting needed LOA’s is widely ignored, but does in fact render the plane unairworthy.

If there’s no need to rent the plane or provide it for instruction, E-LSA is a great way to go.
 
FastEddieB said:
E-LSA permits anyone to do maintenance on the aircraft, and with a 16-hour course lets the owner do Annual Condition Inspections. A HUGE benefit for those mechanically inclined. Since 2009 I’ve made maybe a dozen minor modifications to my Sky Arrow, such as installing an LED landing light, a lithium-iron battery and replacing the Ducati voltage regulator with a cheaper and more reliable John Deere. And more recently adding ADS-B out via a Garmin GDL 82.

As important, with an S-LSA, no modifications or parts substitutions are allowed without a Letter of Authorization from the manufacturer. That includes something as simple as a different brand of tire or battery, let’s say. And LOA’s from some manufacturers can be very difficult or impossible to get, as with the 162. I can say from experience getting needed LOA’s is widely ignored, but does in fact render the plane unairworthy.

If there’s no need to rent the plane or provide it for instruction, E-LSA is a great way to go.
Click to expand...
:yeahthat:
I recertificated my AMD Zodiac S-LSA to E-LSA in 2016 since it was an orphan (AMD went out of business in 2010), so there was no way to get an LOA to install ADS-B or make other modifications like replacing the bungee cord nose gear strut with a Viking spring strut.

The conversion was done through Rainbow Aviation DAR and A&P/IA Brian Carpenter in Corning, CA., and the cost was $400. Doing the conversion from S-LSA to "Experimental Operating Light-Sport previously issued Certificate under 21.190" is a straightforward, well documented process. The downsides of converting are the inability to rent the airplane or use it for paid instruction, and you may take a small hit on resale value and/or insurance premiums. The upsides are that you can perform your own maintenance, and if you take the FAA approved 16 hour LS repairman-inspection class, you can apply for an FAA Light Sport Repairman - Inspection (LSR-I) certificate and perform/sign off annual condition inspections.

Like Fast Eddie, it made sense for me and I'd do it in a heartbeat with a Skycatcher.
 
I owned one for a year. I strongly recommend it, especially if you can find a clean one that was never used as a trainer. The 162 has a terrible reputation but I frankly couldn’t think of a better first airplane. The G300 is amazingly powerful. I was lucky to buy one of the few with the Garmin fully integrated autopilot.

I flight planned at 6 GPH/105 kts and as for parts, it is so simple there isn’t anything to break so don’t worry about it. The O-200 is bulletproof.

Insurance was cheap even though I had very low time.

The only real quirk was the castering nosewheel which makes taxiing a frustrating experience. I never could figure it out without riding the brakes.

I flew my 162 all over California from north to south and back for a year. It’s cramped (I’m 6 feet tall) but a totally doable cross country plane for 2-3 hour legs.

And oh yah, it is a very loud plane at full throttle. Never had a problem with ATC but my 182 seems like a library in comparison. There is absolutely no insulation which is the cause for the noise and it’s also a very cold plane up at altitude.
 
The school I'm currently doing my BFR with has a skycatcher. I was looking forward to getting checked out in it some day....but I got a chance to look in it after my flight last weekend.... it's ragged out. Such a shame.
 
You can do better for the money.

Frankly if you’re looking to build hours


Get a N3 pup for 5k and burn 2gph of auto fuel.
 
Last edited:
If someone was looking to build quality hours, save TONS of money and learn a little...

E5-E26-E2-D-A8-B7-44-AD-93-E8-6-FD80-AF4-F1-AA.jpg
 
If you’re stuck on having glass, you can always buy an iPad and a stratux...
buying something like that over the good trainer options out there is kind of like getting a Pontiac Aztek in lieu of a Yukon. ...good luck to you though, doesn’t really matter much as long as you like what you choose
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top