TMetzinger
Final Approach
Not in the US, perhaps, but I believe there are 121-equivalent operations in other countries using PC-12s.
Single Engine ATP?
- Thread starter taters
- Start date
RotorAndWing
Final Approach
- Joined
- Sep 5, 2008
- Messages
- 8,496
- Location
- Other side of the world
- Display Name
Display name:
Rotor&Wing
Do you actually understand the difference between Part 135 and Part 121? Since this thread was discussing a US ATP Rating I assumed we're talking US operations, not foreign.
Last time I looked you couldn't get 20 passengers in a PC12 (legally).
Last edited:
TMetzinger
Final Approach
Let's see, the question was about the potential use for an ATP with an SEL rating. Might be useful if a US pilot wanted to go fly for a foreign airline operating PC-12s. It could be the basis for him getting whatever certificate is required by that foreign carrier.
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
I didn't think we were allowed to use that word!!
You can pull things out of your *** here just fine, but you'll get spanked if you pull anything out of your ___.
mcmanigle
Line Up and Wait
- Joined
- Mar 4, 2013
- Messages
- 525
- Display Name
Display name:
John McManigle
If I can resurrect this thread again, and I know this is a bit off topic for Pilots of America, but:
For those of you who travel for long periods, is an ATP certificate 'more transferrable' than a PPL or CPL? I have no reason to ever think about getting an ATP, but given my background I may wind up living in the UK or Europe for a few years at some point.
They're getting very picky about flying even N-registered aircraft on an FAA license if you're 'resident' (whether that complies with ICAO is a whole other topic). And transferring a PPL+IR or CPL+IR is a process that involves something like 14 written exams and a few checkrides.
But I've heard wholly unsupported rumors that an ATP (and maybe even an ATP ASEL) can be transferred much more easily, and therefore potentially worth it, even if you only want PPL+IR privileges, if you think you might be moving around quite a bit.
Anybody know if there's truth to that? (Even if it would be years before it applied, and surely the rules will change many times by then...)
For those of you who travel for long periods, is an ATP certificate 'more transferrable' than a PPL or CPL? I have no reason to ever think about getting an ATP, but given my background I may wind up living in the UK or Europe for a few years at some point.
They're getting very picky about flying even N-registered aircraft on an FAA license if you're 'resident' (whether that complies with ICAO is a whole other topic). And transferring a PPL+IR or CPL+IR is a process that involves something like 14 written exams and a few checkrides.
But I've heard wholly unsupported rumors that an ATP (and maybe even an ATP ASEL) can be transferred much more easily, and therefore potentially worth it, even if you only want PPL+IR privileges, if you think you might be moving around quite a bit.
Anybody know if there's truth to that? (Even if it would be years before it applied, and surely the rules will change many times by then...)
Neil Rubin
Pre-takeoff checklist
As far as I can tell, there is no possible operation that one can perform today that requires the privileges of a U.S. single-engine ATP.
The ATP is required in Part 121 operations, and in certain Part 135 and Part 91(k) operations. Part 121 prohibits the use of single-engine aircraft (14 C.F.R. 121.159). Part 135 requires an ATP only for the PIC of (1) turbojet airplanes, (2) airplanes with 10 passenger seats or more, (3) multi-engine airplanes in commuter operation, or (4) helicopters. (14 C.F.R. 135.243(a)). Part 91(k) requires an ATP only for the PIC of multiengine turbine-powered fixed-wing and powered-lift aircraft. (14 C.F.R. 91.1053(a)(2)).
So, the only way you would need a single-engine ATP is if you were flying Part 135 in a turbojet or an airplane with 10 passenger seats or more. But, to be flying in Part 135, the aircraft needs a standard airworthiness certificate. Aircraft with special airworthiness certificates can't be used to carry persons or property for compensation or hire. (14 C.F.R. 91.313 - 91.327). Transport and commuter category aircraft must have at least two engines. (E.g., 14 C.F.R. 23.3(d)). Normal, utility, and acrobatic category aircraft can have at most 9 passenger seats. (14 C.F.R. 23.3(a)-(c)).
So, unless there is some screwy old airplane that has a standard airworthiness certificate but has more seats than allowed under Part 23, the only operation that would require an ATP is a Part 135 operation using a single-engine turbojet with a standard airworthiness certificate. I don't believe that any such jets currently exist.
That will change, once the Cirrus SF50 is certified. No idea if the FAA will allow them to be used in Part 135 operations, but I can't see why not. Then you all can dust off your ASEL ATP certificates and actually use them!
The ATP is required in Part 121 operations, and in certain Part 135 and Part 91(k) operations. Part 121 prohibits the use of single-engine aircraft (14 C.F.R. 121.159). Part 135 requires an ATP only for the PIC of (1) turbojet airplanes, (2) airplanes with 10 passenger seats or more, (3) multi-engine airplanes in commuter operation, or (4) helicopters. (14 C.F.R. 135.243(a)). Part 91(k) requires an ATP only for the PIC of multiengine turbine-powered fixed-wing and powered-lift aircraft. (14 C.F.R. 91.1053(a)(2)).
So, the only way you would need a single-engine ATP is if you were flying Part 135 in a turbojet or an airplane with 10 passenger seats or more. But, to be flying in Part 135, the aircraft needs a standard airworthiness certificate. Aircraft with special airworthiness certificates can't be used to carry persons or property for compensation or hire. (14 C.F.R. 91.313 - 91.327). Transport and commuter category aircraft must have at least two engines. (E.g., 14 C.F.R. 23.3(d)). Normal, utility, and acrobatic category aircraft can have at most 9 passenger seats. (14 C.F.R. 23.3(a)-(c)).
So, unless there is some screwy old airplane that has a standard airworthiness certificate but has more seats than allowed under Part 23, the only operation that would require an ATP is a Part 135 operation using a single-engine turbojet with a standard airworthiness certificate. I don't believe that any such jets currently exist.
That will change, once the Cirrus SF50 is certified. No idea if the FAA will allow them to be used in Part 135 operations, but I can't see why not. Then you all can dust off your ASEL ATP certificates and actually use them!