Self insure and have renter provide their own rental insurance?

[k9medic]

My new to me AA5 gets only a little usage. I bought it to teach my son to fly and actually have it posted for sale.

I looked into commercial insurance for the AA5 to rent it out and that is going to run about $4500/ year.

Could I not just self insure and have the renters provide a rental policy with me as named insured?

 

[brcase]

You could but the renter insurance only protects the renter from you or your insurance company from suing him for damages. So if a deer runs out of in front of him, he or his renter insurance company might likely claim it wasn’t the pilots fault and not pay unless you try to sue, and even then the renters insurance may try to defend the pilot rather than pay.

The better plan is take on 3 or 4 small percentage partners in the airplane. You still maintain majority owner ship in the airplane, but you can name the partners on the airplane and then the insurance is protecting all the owners from loss. This does assume you are carrying full coverage, most insurance plans will allow up to 4 partners with very little increase in insurance based on the lowest experience pilot.

Brian

 

[k9medic]

I have a couple of friends on as named insured already so they can use it if they want to. They are also named on my 310Q. I was trying to come up with some ideas to generate additional $$ or at very least cover some of the expenses for that particular plane.

 

[Sierra_Hotel]

Where's it listed for sale?

 

[Jeff Oslick]

They don't need to be equity partners to be named insured on a business & recreation policy. Talk to an agent about the number of names insured you can list on your policy.

 

[flyingron]

Note that while self-insuring for the hull is feasible if you're prepared to lose that money, you likely don't want to self-insure for liability. If the person crashes the plane injuring a third party (or kills himself and the family comes hunting) and the allegation that it was due to your negligence (maintenance or whatever), you will be into it for big $$$

 

[weilke]

As mentioned, you can get 4 others as approved pilots on your policy. Depending on how the policy is written, they may also be considered 'additional insured'. Depending on your state, that may give them the same rights as an insured as the owner. Depending on the state, the insurance could still subrogate against them, but that is a risk they can cover with a non-owned policy.

 

[ktup-flyer]

Where’s it located? I’d be down to fly it regularly to keep it running well if you’re close-ish

 

[airdale]

Note that while self-insuring for the hull is feasible if you're prepared to lose that money, you likely don't want to self-insure for liability. If the person crashes the plane injuring a third party (or kills himself and the family comes hunting) and the allegation that it was due to your negligence (maintenance or whatever), you will be into it for big $$$

This. When the SHTF, the lawyers sue everybody. Even if you beat it, you'll be down the road big bucks for lawyering. The sometimes-unrecognized beauty of having insurance is that they pay the lawyers. Not aviation-related but I got sued in my company one time and our insurance paid for an attorney to defend the company and another one to defend me, since I was also sued as an individual. We beat it and the insurance company picked up the tab.

 

[MauleSkinner]

they may also be considered 'additional insured'. Depending on your state, that may give them the same rights as an insured as the owner.

Possibly also diluting the owner’s coverage by spreading it among more pilots?

 

[Warlock]

Note that while self-insuring for the hull is feasible if you're prepared to lose that money, you likely don't want to self-insure for liability. If the person crashes the plane injuring a third party (or kills himself and the family comes hunting) and the allegation that it was due to your negligence (maintenance or whatever), you will be into it for big $$$

What Flyingron said is the answer…and if not convinced I would be happy to discuss the downside of this happening even with the proper insurance…

 

[Snowmass]

Note that while self-insuring for the hull is feasible if you're prepared to lose that money, you likely don't want to self-insure for liability. If the person crashes the plane injuring a third party (or kills himself and the family comes hunting) and the allegation that it was due to your negligence (maintenance or whatever), you will be into it for big $$$

Liability can greatly exceed the value of almost any small GA airplane. Liability first.

 

[weilke]

Possibly also diluting the owner’s coverage by spreading it among more pilots?

Not really. The coverage the approved pilots / addtl insureds receive is limited to that aircraft. Claims are paid per instance, so if you chew up a landing light now and your passenger falls off the wing 6 months from now, the insurance payout for the second claim is not capped at 'whats left'.
If one of your pilots has non-owned coverage that 'stacks' with the primary (e.g. Avemco), an incident that happens to one or the approved pilots may have more coverage available than an incident involving the owner

 

[MauleSkinner]

Not really. The coverage the approved pilots / addtl insureds receive is limited to that aircraft. Claims are paid per instance, so if you chew up a landing light now and your passenger falls off the wing 6 months from now, the insurance payout for the second claim is not capped at 'whats left'.
If one of your pilots has non-owned coverage that 'stacks' with the primary (e.g. Avemco), an incident that happens to one or the approved pilots may have more coverage available than an incident involving the owner

So what if you have a $1 million dollar policy, and someone sues both the pilot and the owner for $1 million each?

 

[Jeff Oslick]

So what if you have a $1 million dollar policy, and someone sues both the pilot and the owner for $1 million each?

While this can happen, it is very rare for claims to exceed the value of the policy. Also, the value of the legal defense is separate from the policy limits.

 

[MauleSkinner]

While this can happen, it is very rare for claims to exceed the value of the policy.

Sounds like not having insurance is the way to go.

 

[Snowmass]

I take no passengers unless the are in my close family. $100,000/pax barely covers an ingrown toenail.