Raptor Aircraft

Never flown a canard and I appreciate that "won't stall" is a great characteristic in some circumstances, but I always wonder whether if I was forced to land off-field I'd prefer to be in an airplane that stalls at say 45 knots vs one that just won't let you fly slower than say 65.
 
Racerx said:
Just trying to give the guy a little credit. He largely built something by himself without a background in anything mechanical or related to fluid dynamics. It's lasted way longer than I and many others thought he would. Would I fly in it? I'll pass. But with all the beatings he's taken here I'll give him that one. Did he completely miss his target speeds and specs wise in every facet? You bet. But he's still faster and more roomy than my Cherokee 180 and probably the Cherokee Six I also fly. And if the chute is installed he's got that on me too. I would say the Cherokee with the STOL kit stalls at a much lower speed, but lest I forget the Raptor won't stall.

Until Van's comes out with a 6 place RV, with a chute, and the ie2. I'll happily putt around in the 180 and the longer trips in the Six.

I also said months ago the best thing he could do for the project, his sanity, and probably his safety would be to lay off the YouTube and social media. Actually, I could say the same for a lot of people. I swear social media is the root cause of the rise in self diagnosed anxiety, depression, and PTSD.
Click to expand...
Not sure it’s faster and more roomy than your Cherokee. Remember he’s flying it practically empty.
 
tiger said:
Never flown a canard and I appreciate that "won't stall" is a great characteristic in some circumstances, but I always wonder whether if I was forced to land off-field I'd prefer to be in an airplane that stalls at say 45 knots vs one that just won't let you fly slower than say 65.
Click to expand...
On the other hand, you see fatalities due to accidental stalls when an engine-out pilot tries to stretch a glide or turns too tight to try to make the runway. Sure, landing under control at 45 knots vs. 65 knots is better, but if that 45 knots is pointed straight down.....

Ron Wanttaja
 
wanttaja said:
On the other hand, you see fatalities due to accidental stalls when an engine-out pilot tries to stretch a glide or turns too tight to try to make the runway. Sure, landing under control at 45 knots vs. 65 knots is better, but if that 45 knots is pointed straight down.....

Ron Wanttaja
Click to expand...
Entirely fair, and perhaps an opportune moment to link to some of your work on canard safety: https://www.kitplanes.com/safety-is-no-accident-canards/
 
Racerx said:
Just trying to give the guy a little credit. He largely built something by himself without a background in anything mechanical or related to fluid dynamics. It's lasted way longer than I and many others thought he would. Would I fly in it? I'll pass. But with all the beatings he's taken here I'll give him that one. Did he completely miss his target speeds and specs wise in every facet? You bet. But he's still faster and more roomy than my Cherokee 180 and probably the Cherokee Six I also fly. And if the chute is installed he's got that on me too. I would say the Cherokee with the STOL kit stalls at a much lower speed, but lest I forget the Raptor won't stall.

Until Van's comes out with a 6 place RV, with a chute, and the ie2. I'll happily putt around in the 180 and the longer trips in the Six.

I also said months ago the best thing he could do for the project, his sanity, and probably his safety would be to lay off the YouTube and social media. Actually, I could say the same for a lot of people. I swear social media is the root cause of the rise in self diagnosed anxiety, depression, and PTSD.
Click to expand...

I don't know if I would say that he built it "largely by himself". He had two other people involved in the designing. Jeff Kerlo and crew did almost all the fabrication.

Faster and more roomy than a Cherokee 180? Load that pig up with fuel and just two people and bet that by the time he makes 6,000' a Cherokee will be 30nm ahead of him and doing the same speed if not faster.

And the Raptor will definitely stall. I don't know why that keeps popping up. It won't spin, but the canard will most definitely stall. Of course nobody knows what speed it will stall at since PM doesn't see any need to determine that.
 
Salty said:
Not sure it’s faster and more roomy than your Cherokee. Remember he’s flying it practically empty.
Click to expand...
I'm trying not to be negative today. It's a weird feeling.
 
donjohnston said:
I don't know if I would say that he built it "largely by himself". He had two other people involved in the designing. Jeff Kerlo and crew did almost all the fabrication.

Faster and more roomy than a Cherokee 180? Load that pig up with fuel and just two people and bet that by the time he makes 6,000' a Cherokee will be 30nm ahead of him and doing the same speed if not faster.

And the Raptor will definitely stall. I don't know why that keeps popping up. It won't spin, but the canard will most definitely stall. Of course nobody knows what speed it will stall at since PM doesn't see any need to determine that.
Click to expand...
The not stalling part was making fun of Peter since he's said it won't stall. As far as loaded, you bet the 180 would win. Raptor would have to stop every 20 minutes for fuel. And there I go being a negative. Sorry Peter, I tried.
 
UngaWunga said:
How does one get out of a deep stall?
Click to expand...
In a swept wing turbojet I turned off the yaw damp, full left rudder, when it got close to knife edge the nose fell through the horizon for normal recovery. Took about 9,000 ft. total and in all fairness, it was a level D simulator.
 
Raptor passed 40 hours today, so now he can continue his "production plan" or whatever is next. I'd be surprised if they ever get to production, but I'm pretty surprised that it's gotten this far.
 
231TC said:
Raptor passed 40 hours today, so now he can continue his "production plan" or whatever is next. I'd be surprised if they ever get to production, but I'm pretty surprised that it's gotten this far.
Click to expand...
Did you get that number by adding up the FlightAware totals or some other source?
 
iamtheari said:
Did you get that number by adding up the FlightAware totals or some other source?
Click to expand...
Yes, FA totals out to 40:26. Not the most accurate, but close enough. Peter's total last time he said one was slightly higher than the FA total at that point, probably including more taxi time.
 
I guess the hemispherical rule does not apply since he is always slowly climbing. Just like me in my 150. I am getting to 6500' for cruise, it just takes a looooong time......5700, 5800, 5900.
 
Anybody want to try and guess his first (planned) stop?

I'm thinking something around NW Alabama or NE Mississippi.
 
He's already going the wrong direction to get to CA if it were me, so I'm not going to guess anything about this guy.
 
Salty said:
He's already going the wrong direction to get to CA if it were me, so I'm not going to guess anything about this guy.
Click to expand...
I don't know about that. Looks like his current route would put him in Northern California. But there's no way he could clear the mountains on this route.
 
donjohnston said:
I don't know about that. Looks like his current route would put him in Northern California. But there's no way he could clear the mountains on this route.
Click to expand...
That's my point.
 
On the ground in NW Alabama. About 2:30 enroute.

Now the question is, did he get someone to meet him there with diesel? Or is he going to fuel up with Jet-A?
 
FastEddieB said:
Did he just do a 180° and begin a rapid descent?
Click to expand...
It looks more like he landed at M95 and there isn't ADS-B coverage at pattern altitude there.

donjohnston said:
On the ground in NW Alabama. About 2:30 enroute.

Now the question is, did he get someone to meet him there with diesel? Or is he going to fuel up with Jet-A?
Click to expand...
That's an interesting question. For all we know, he did test the plane on Jet-A during the hours he flew without posting on YouTube.
 
FastEddieB said:
Whew! I was honestly concerned there for a minute.
Click to expand...
The turn is not entirely consistent with that theory, so it's okay to remain honestly concerned.
 
It will be interesting to follow his journey to California. I hope he stops in North Texas so can get a sneak peek of the Raptor!
 
iamtheari said:
The turn is not entirely consistent with that theory, so it's okay to remain honestly concerned.
Click to expand...

The descent rate was only around 300 fpm, much less than his usual approaches into Valdosta. I therefore think that this is an indication for a planned stop.
M95 also doesn't have weather, I would therefore guess that he overflew the airport to check on the windsock, followed by a teardrop entry into the left downwind for runway 1.
 
German guy said:
The descent rate was only around 300 fpm, much less than his usual approaches into Valdosta. I therefore think that this is an indication for a planned stop.
M95 also doesn't have weather, I would therefore guess that he overflew the airport to check on the windsock, followed by a teardrop entry into the left downwind for runway 1.
Click to expand...
The nearest weather I saw was calm. He is going to be in for a treat as he continues west. Higher field elevations and nonstop winds.
 
It looks like he's going to fly in 2 hr segments as that's what he's been testing with recently.
 
MacFlier said:
It will be interesting to follow his journey to California. I hope he stops in North Texas so can get a sneak peek of the Raptor!
Click to expand...
Considering that he's never flown that thing any higher than 6,000' (probably because he couldn't keep the temps down... in the winter), how do you suppose he's going to get to California without climbing higher than 6,000'?
 
Racerx said:
Just trying to give the guy a little credit. He largely built something by himself without a background in anything mechanical or related to fluid dynamics. It's lasted way longer than I and many others thought he would. Would I fly in it? I'll pass. But with all the beatings he's taken here I'll give him that one. Did he completely miss his target speeds and specs wise in every facet? You bet. But he's still faster and more roomy than my Cherokee 180 and probably the Cherokee Six I also fly.
…
I also said months ago the best thing he could do for the project, his sanity, and probably his safety would be to lay off the YouTube and social media. Actually, I could say the same for a lot of people. I swear social media is the root cause of the rise in self diagnosed anxiety, depression, and PTSD.
Click to expand...

Also, he got here with 100’s of people routinely throwing metaphorical knives across several platforms. Yes, he invited critique conducting his development work publicly.

We know the plane has problems. I’ve found his work interesting from the perspective of “average guy with some knowledge” trying to make something new. More “garage” projects fail than succeed.

The odds were against him from the start, but admire his courage opening himself to criticism, even if his own hubris blinded him to his or projects own deficits.
 
Last edited:
donjohnston said:
Considering that he's never flown that thing any higher than 6,000' (probably because he couldn't keep the temps down... in the winter), how do you suppose he's going to get to California without climbing higher than 6,000'?
Click to expand...

He’s going to taxi it on the highway for a portion of the trip. :)
 
donjohnston said:
Considering that he's never flown that thing any higher than 6,000' (probably because he couldn't keep the temps down... in the winter), how do you suppose he's going to get to California without climbing higher than 6,000'?
Click to expand...
It will definitely be a challenge for him as he hasn't tested the plane at above 6k for long stretches
 
NordicDave said:
Believe the consensus a few pages back, Peter is flying to OSH to make a splash or statement.

Who knows? Maybe he dreams of a best builders award. :goofy:
Click to expand...
I think he'll just soak in all the attention he can get. I guess he earned it. After that, who knows.
 
Idk. I was at OSH to see some "jet pack" thing get booed off the stage. OSH could be a very tough audience for Peter.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top