Private checkride went horribly wrong!

Jeanie said:
I have read a fair amount of this to have a feel for the waters... I'm surprised that the CFI didn't work with you about the paper/navlog planning issue more clearly.....
You're freaked out and upset and mad. I suggest that now you've vented that you take a week or two to settle down and revisit your concerns including trying to be honest with yourself about what you know you can improve. Then work with your CFI, assuming they haven't been turned off by any attitude you've displayed and are willing to help you finish.

Young men, you're youngish right?, are just full of themselves sometimes... Take a break, step back and try to view the situation through the more experienced eyes of your mentors.
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They're full of something...

-Rich
 
pflemming said:
Andrew, tell me honestly. If you had a recording of yourself FAILING, would you post it? Didn't think so. I would like to humiliate myself for your enjoyment, but perhaps some other time okay?
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Yes, you weren't afraid to point out you failed anyway
 
pflemming said:
okay, I hear what you're saying, but I was right and he was wrong. Nobody flies the BS way he was pushing. Do any of you do that paper crap and haul out 100 square feet of paper in the cockpit? And you call ME dangerous and unsafe? While you're folding and unfolding that junk?

My lesson from this is to bite my tongue and do that BS knowing inside I am right and he is wrong, but he is the one with the power to pass or fail me. Okay got it.
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Pete, most of us are willing to give you the benefit of doubt most of the time. But with this statement you have lost any opportunity of redemption.

Promise me you will never fly in Colorado, Nebraska, Kansas, New Mexico, Arizona, Wyoming or South Dakota. I really don't want to be flying anywhere near you.
 
pflemming said:
Yes, it has been established that my spelling is not quite there. And sometimes iPad's substitute the incorrect spelling.

Apologies for my offense.

Moving on... Sadly, you do share your airspace with me. Just because I don't have my ticket doesn't mean I don't fly. I will continue to practice my flying, and will pass my next oral with flying colors because I have learned from all of you, to basically bend over and take it no matter how painful or wrong, because that is what we do as pilots.
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No! don't give in! Fight the good fight! You will eventually prevail! Just keep telling the DPEs how things should be done and eventually they will believe! It is up to you to free us all!


gawd, what a troll
 
Incredibly attitude gone horribly right= FAIL

[B said:
pflemming[/B]
okay, I hear what you're saying, but I was right and he was wrong. Nobody flies the BS way he was pushing. Do any of you do that paper crap and haul out 100 square feet of paper in the cockpit? And you call ME dangerous and unsafe? While you're folding and unfolding that junk?

My lesson from this is to bite my tongue and do that BS knowing inside I am right and he is wrong, but he is the one with the power to pass or fail me. Okay got it.
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Dude, thanks for the entertainment. Try some Lithium. Might do you some good.

Sectionals are 9 square feet fully extended.
Since you know you know it all anyway, you should just be granted an honarary certificate. Why don't you write the administrator and demand it?

pflemming said:
For someone who looks like you do, you have a lot of nerve to criticize me
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For someone who acts like you do, you have a lot of nerve to criticize anybody.
 
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pflemming said:
okay, I hear what you're saying, but I was right and he was wrong. Nobody flies the BS way he was pushing. Do any of you do that paper crap and haul out 100 square feet of paper in the cockpit? And you call ME dangerous and unsafe? While you're folding and unfolding that junk?

My lesson from this is to bite my tongue and do that BS knowing inside I am right and he is wrong, but he is the one with the power to pass or fail me. Okay got it.
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Here's a trick. You can actually pre-fold your maps! I amaze my family when I do that for a driving trip as well, where a completely unfolded map interferes with your forward vision, and could be even more hazardous to your health than unfolding a chart in a cockpit.

Why don't you just go back to playing World of Warcraft in your parents basement and stay out of the skies. We'd all feel safer.
 
After reading this thread, all I can say is wow....and still trying to figure out why an oral exam would be recorded. I can understand recording ground school sessions, but not an exam. I teach part time, and never let my students take exams out of the class. Has to do with academic integrity. While I don't know the OP, I am thinking that he should regroup, relax, and perhaps reflect.
 
pflemming said:
okay, I hear what you're saying, but I was right and he was wrong. Nobody flies the BS way he was pushing. Do any of you do that paper crap and haul out 100 square feet of paper in the cockpit? And you call ME dangerous and unsafe? While you're folding and unfolding that junk?

My lesson from this is to bite my tongue and do that BS knowing inside I am right and he is wrong, but he is the one with the power to pass or fail me. Okay got it.
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Pete,

iPads, tablets, GPS devices etc. are great. But, for several decades pilots flew XC with the paper stuff. I am thankful to have learned the concepts from planning with the paper stuff, and am even more thankful that the paper crap will not suffer from potential battery or other mechanical failure. And there is no need to haul out "100 feet" of paper if it is folded correctly.

While pilots should not be timid, there is something to be said for humility. With that said, I suggest you reflect on the situation and learn from the experience. Best wishes in the future.
 
Matthew said:
One that was getting tired of his attitude and wanted to teach him a lesson?
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Wouldn't blame him, but it could be a career limiting event if his student somehow made it through the oral and killed himself and the DPE in the flight portion of the check ride.

I wonder if that's ever happened before.
 
nddons said:
Wouldn't blame him, but it could be a career limiting event if his student somehow made it through the oral and killed himself and the DPE in the flight portion of the check ride.

I wonder if that's ever happened before.
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Doubtful, DPEs are all high time CFIs, they know how to take over if it gets dangerous. Flying though is the easiest part, that's why they save it for last.
 
nddons said:
Holy crap. You've got to be a troll. I hope you continue to fail. I don't wish to share the skies with you.
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He is a troll.
I don't believe a single word in his story, that his examiner demanded $400 cash, something about initial altitude in his flight plan, what were the true reasons of his failure, etc. Not a single word rings true here. Total poppycock.
 
Somewhere, there is a DPE forum in which this guy's examiner has started a thread titled "I swear I'm not making this up"

If you are not a troll, I am sure we will all one day see the video on youtube of you smacking into some powerlines because your iPad died and that is where you saved your engine out checklist.
 
Henning said:
Doubtful, DPEs are all high time CFIs, they know how to take over if it gets dangerous. Flying though is the easiest part, that's why they save it for last.
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I know of one (ex) DPE who almost killed a fairly experienced pilot in a seaplane. The DPE (actually they were called DEs then) shut the fuel off at 200 ft above the water on a glassy water landing.
 
DPE wanting payment in cash is pretty much a normal procedure. I paid mine 450 in nice 10 dollar notes, because thats all the ATM gave me.

My checkride was, by a considerable margin, the best flying/learning experience I have had so far. My DPE (Larry Thomas, in Florida) was highly experienced and fair, and tested me until he saw where the limits of my knowledge was, and then taught me more (no, I did not know isogonic lines or the different kinds of hypoxia, nor was I supposed to know, but now I know!). I spent about 6 hours planning the XC, with the old **** papyrus 100 square foot ****, which I still enjoy using and have as backup.
I am voting troll on this one, and if he is not, I would like to know who is his instructor, so we can all avoid that CFI who endorses his students to the checkride with that kind of attitude.
 
register@teamandras.com said:
I'm a student too, but I really do. Honestly, it's way fun to plan my flight and then fly my plan. Magic. You're skipping over what you should savor.
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Agreed. I love learning the paper maps, knowing how much history is behind that type of navigation. I've got a tablet and I can appreciate the e-planning, but I also relish knowing how to plan it out on paper like generations before me.
 
gismo said:
I know of one (ex) DPE who almost killed a fairly experienced pilot in a seaplane. The DPE (actually they were called DEs then) shut the fuel off at 200 ft above the water on a glassy water landing.
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threadjack/

:confused: Losing an engine at 200ft on approach will "almost kill" somebody? Other than a brand-new student?

/threadjack
 
All, unfortunately I just read this thread from beginning to this point and it was quite obvious less than a third into it that this kid, is not going to learn, does not want to learn, and knows better than everyone on this forum. I would humbly suggest that you did what you could to try to bring him to his senses and it failed miserably! Any further attempts at discussion/communication is a complete waste of time and effort.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 
pflemming.png


Truer words were never printed...
 
Man I'm not even a pilot and I can say this guy made some moronic mistakes just with his attitude let alone the fly incident.
 
A number of years ago, a satirical story about a student pilot that basically did everything wrong all in one solo flight (brought a passenger, flew into IMC, etc.) was circulated on the internet. Anyone have a copy?
 
pflemming said:
okay, I hear what you're saying, but I was right and he was wrong. Nobody flies the BS way he was pushing. Do any of you do that paper crap and haul out 100 square feet of paper in the cockpit? And you call ME dangerous and unsafe? While you're folding and unfolding that junk?

My lesson from this is to bite my tongue and do that BS knowing inside I am right and he is wrong, but he is the one with the power to pass or fail me. Okay got it.
Click to expand...

Reading down to this post (still getting to the rest of it)... we've jumped on Pete quite a bit, but I'd call the CFI into the office to find out more details about how Pete was deemed eligible for the checkride signoff.

Pete, as far as "folding and unfolding" a chart, you're making a mountain range out of not even a molehill. And your CFI should have covered proper CRM (Cockpit Resource Management) with you. If you set up your charts right for the trip, there is minimal folding/unfolding while in flight. You already did the bulk of it before departure.

But in general, what I infer about you as I read from your posts is what most of the gang are saying, you have a persona and attitude has "unsafe pilot" smell all over it.

Which is why I'd want to question your CFI about signing off for the ride being as you are.
 
Pete's gotta be a troll... but if anyone with the attitude Pete has presented here manages to get a CFI to sign them off for a check ride, failure within 20 minutes of starting the oral sounds exactly right.

Pete, if you're not trolling... in life, it doesn't matter how right you are in any given situation. What matters is how you approach being right. Regarding flight planning and electronics vs paper... you might be right that you'll never intentionally use paper -- but if you land at some back woods landing strip and your iPad breaks, I bet you want to know how to use that paper to get yourself home. Regardless of what you think of that, I would strongly suggest you put your flying aspirations on hold for a few years. As others have pointed out, if you fly with the attitude you've presented here, you will surely kill yourself and possibly others in the process. This is not a hobby to take lightly and it is not one that is very forgiving to those who think they know everything they need to know.


Big Bang Theory said:
Mary: Now, you listen here. I have being telling you since you were four years old, it's okay to be smarter than everybody but you can't go around pointing it out.
Sheldon: Why not?
Mary: Because people don't like it. You don't remember all the ass kickings you got from the neighbor kids. Now lets get cracking. Shower, shirt, shoes and let's shove off.
Sheldon: There wouldn't have been any ass kickings if that stupid death ray had worked.
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Nothing people here love more than to have someone show up with an attitude or any strong opinion and then blast them out of the water.
 
When there's at least a 50% chance you're being scammed anyway, it's like getting a small bucket of range balls for free.

Alexb2000 said:
Nothing people here love more than to have someone show up with an attitude or any strong opinion and then blast them out of the water.
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To the OP:

Make sure you have an appropriate aviation life insurance policy, so you don't leave the wife and kids high and dry.

Change your attitude or you *will* be an NTSB report. Preferably, the next DPE spots your attitude and fails you again.

I pray you're really a troll.
 
Uhhhh... 'scuze me. Wrong thread.

P-U, it smells fishy in here. Bye.

dtuuri
 
dtuuri said:
Uhhhh... 'scuze me. Wrong thread.

P-U, it smells fishy in here. Bye.

dtuuri
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He who detected it, ejected it.

Thanks for coming, thanks for leaving, thanks for having nothing of substance to add here.

Bye bye
 
Jesus Christ, what is with you people and trolls? So you don't like what I have to say? You don't agree with me? Therefore "he must be a troll". If I'm a troll, ignore me, go elsewhere and play your games.

I've had time to reflect on what happened, and am meeting my CFI today to go over the oral. My HUGE mistake was recording the session. Bad, BAD IDEA! That was my mistake. He then decided to fail me and teach me a lesson. That much is clear.

So I'm going to regroup, and do this again with a different DPE. I will swallow my pride and sprout all that retarded 1940s crap they teach you, and if necessary haul NINE square feet of papyrus. Doesn't it strike you as odd that all you bozos defending the manuscript approach are pretty much doing things the way the Phoenicians navigated? i.e. Hauling out some dirty chart with symbols, squinting, etc. RETARDED! And yes iPads fail, that's why you take a back up. Like your iPhone. It is also running the same software. Not good enough? Really? Then why do you fly with only TWO magnetos?

You're a bunch of hypocrites.

And sorry to disappoint, but I will be flying with y'all. Flying circles around you in fact.

I'm off to fly now. Hope to see none of you plodding fools out there.
 
Jeanie said:
I have read a fair amount of this to have a feel for the waters... I'm surprised that the CFI didn't work with you about the paper/navlog planning issue more clearly.....
You're freaked out and upset and mad. I suggest that now you've vented that you take a week or two to settle down and revisit your concerns including trying to be honest with yourself about what you know you can improve. Then work with your CFI, assuming they haven't been turned off by any attitude you've displayed and are willing to help you finish.

Young men, you're youngish right?, are just full of themselves sometimes... Take a break, step back and try to view the situation through the more experienced eyes of your mentors.
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Thank you, I took all of what you said to heart. Thank you for actually listening and trying to help, instead of enjoying kicking me from afar behind the safety of a computer screen.

The rest of you? Cowards, all cowards.
 
If you're still thinking your major issue is just the recording, then your CFI is part of the problem.

Since you're so committed to the world of EFBs, then you should at least be prepared to answer this question:

What does it mean to you to pre-flight your EFB?
 
Jeff Oslick said:
Make sure you have an appropriate aviation life insurance policy, so you don't leave the wife and kids high and dry.
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Best advice in this thread.

Read the fine-print about pre-existing conditions though.

nddons said:
Look for Captain to post a thread entitled "is this student pilot a jerk?"
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No need for a poll, this question has been answered over and over again.
 
http://www.faa.gov/regulations_poli...on/pilot_handbook/media/PHAK - Chapter 17.pdf

17-5.

Anti-Authority: Don’t tell me.
This attitude is found in people who do not like anyone telling them what to do. In a sense, they are saying, No one can tell me what to do. They may be resentful of having someone tell them what to do, or may regard rules, regulations, and procedures as silly or unnecessary. However, it is always your prerogative to question authority if you feel it is in error.

Impulsivity: Do it quickly.
This is the attitude of people who frequently feel the need to do something, anything, immediately. They do not stop to think about what they are about to do; they do not select the best alternative, and they do the first thing that comes to mind.

Invulnerability: It won’t happen to me.
Many people falsely believe that accidents happen to others, but never to them. They know accidents can happen, and they know that anyone can be affected. However, they never really feel or believe that they will be personally involved. Pilots who think this way are more likely to take chances and increase risk.

Macho: I can do it.
Pilots who are always trying to prove that they are better than anyone else think, I can do it - I'll show them. Pilots with this type of attitude will try to prove themselves by taking risks in order to impress others. While this pattern is thought to be a male characteristic, women are equally susceptible.

Resignation: What’s the use?
Pilots who think, What’s the use? do not see themselves as being able to make a great deal of difference in what happens to them. When things go well, the pilot is apt to think that it is good luck. When things go badly, the pilot may feel that someone is out to get me, or attribute it to bad luck. The pilot will leave the action to others, for better or worse. Sometimes, such pilots will even go along with unreasonable requests just to be a "nice guy."
 
wabower said:
When there's at least a 50% chance you're being scammed anyway, it's like getting a small bucket of range balls for free.
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I apologize, Sir, for being rude to you earlier. I really do respect the elderly. I help old men like you hobble across the street. If you ever need someone to help you climb up into you plane, Sir, I'd be happy to help you.
 
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