POTUS TFR
- Thread starter Tommar98
- Start date
champ driver
Line Up and Wait
Inside the 30 mile ring is ok, inside the 10 mile ring is NOT ok.
Don't cancel IFR until on the ground.
Don't cancel IFR until on the ground.
luvflyin
Touchdown! Greaser!
Yes. Any requirements that are in the TFR. Read it
Tommar98
Pre-takeoff checklist
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Tommar98
Rgbeard
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rgbeard
You’re IFR. Fly.
Morgan3820
En-Route
I have seen this before, but why is it important to not cancel IFR until you are on the ground.?
bflynn
Final Approach
because if you're in the TFR and IFR, you're ok. If you cancel, you become a VFR flight in a TFR. Someone may or may not care, your fate depends on how bad a day he had.
champ driver
Line Up and Wait
I was thinking more in line with the DCA SFR where if you cancel early, you can screw yourself.
But with the standard POTUS TFR, you have to be on a flight plan, cancelling early may or may not technically get you in trouble, but why take a chance.
I have more to lose than some of you Private pilots, I won't take the chance.
In the 10-30 nm outer ring of the TFR, the follow policies apply:
But with the standard POTUS TFR, you have to be on a flight plan, cancelling early may or may not technically get you in trouble, but why take a chance.
I have more to lose than some of you Private pilots, I won't take the chance.
In the 10-30 nm outer ring of the TFR, the follow policies apply:
- Outer ring traffic is limited to aircraft arriving to or departing from local airports
- Overflights may be approved based on ATC workload and other conditions
- Aircraft may not loiter and must fly point-to-point:
- On an aircraft flight plan (IFR or VFR)
- Squawking ATC-assigned discrete code
- Remain in radio contact with ATC
Ryan F.
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Ryan Ferguson 1974
Be "squawking and talking" anytime you're within the 30nm ring. That includes all the way to the ground for landing, and before takeoff if you're departing from an airport within the 30nm ring.
If VFR, you need a VFR flight plan on file whether you're entering the TFR from outside or taking off within it to depart the TFR. You don't need to activate the VFR flight plan -- just have it on file.
If VFR, you need a VFR flight plan on file whether you're entering the TFR from outside or taking off within it to depart the TFR. You don't need to activate the VFR flight plan -- just have it on file.
George Mohr
Line Up and Wait
^^ That's the key thing. Inside the 30nm but outside the 10nm, don't launch without a code from CD, either VFR or IFR. No picking up your IFR in the air. And of course, no flying at all inside the 10nm.
Also, if you are IFR ATC instructions will be an extra layer of protection to keep you where you are supposed to be and not bust airspace where you aren't supposed to go, as well as provide some defense against the enforcement action in the event that you do accidentally bust the wrong airspace.
PaulS
Touchdown! Greaser!
I saw a guy fly into and out of a presidential tfr last week. Not sure if he was talking to them, I tend to doubt it. He landed downwind, stuck it to the numbers, then proceeded to porpoise twice, smoke show each bounce. Then around the middle of the 2700 foot runway, finally landed, and smoked the tires down to the cords for the last 1300 feet of runway. He made it though, didn't see the prop hit. Good news is he parked it, I assume to get new tires. I felt kind of bad for him.
N1120A
Pattern Altitude
If you're IFR, then you should have no issue. They will tell you where to go and where not to go.
You can fly VFR in a TFR and you are still on a flight plan. That said, there is zero reason to cancel till you are on the ground anyway.
I’ve received calls from Homeland Security AMOC when one of my neighbors took off into a presidential TFR. They tracked him. Oddly, the TSA quickly dismissed it as not his fault but the FAA continued to take him over the coals for several months.
Take these seriously.
Take these seriously.
If I recall correctly, 39N you shouldn't have an issue staying IFR. 47N however, at least when I was flying out that way 2 years ago, didn't have an approach or DP that could get you in or out of the airport without entering the 10NM ring since they were all pretty much entirely reliant on SBJ VOR for the departure, approach and/or missed and the 10NM ring was so close on the west-side of the airport that an overshooting turn from base to final would put you in the TFR.
I know there was a lot of talk about the FAA doing something to fix it to make 47N more accessible, especially since Trump's summer trips to Bedminster shut down Solberg and Somerset for weeks at a time making flying in the area a royal pain and interfering with planned events such as Solberg's annual balloon festival. Looking at the procedures now, it looks like they changed the DP to use Yardley (ARD) and I think they modified the GPS approaches; you're still SOL though if you are in actual IMC and arent a /G (or rather the ICAO equivalent) since the VOR approach still uses SBJ.
There's no issue cancelling IFR in the air and finishing VFR though. In fact as illustrated by the 47N, it might even be necessary if you aren't a /G. I do however recommend staying IFR for as long as possible going into the TFR which means if flying into a towered airport, finishing the flight IFR and letting tower close your flight plan for you.
With a non-towered airport, I'd wait until I have a good solid visual on the field and ATC is telling me to change to CTAF. ATC is pretty good about reminding you to keep your squawk code until you're on the ground but still remember not to change it out of habit and to reject the instruction if ATC accidentally tells you to squawk 1200; I doubt that close to the airport TSA, Secret Service and the military would make a big deal of it if you did accidentally switch but as others have noted, the FAA will still take any sort of non-compliance like that very seriously so they might try to violate your ticket.
Getting out of the TFR, I'd say just file how you are going to file (VFR or IFR). Except for your specific departure instructions, the radio-contact procedure will be the same regardless of IFR vs VFR or towered vs non-towered. No sense filing IFR if the entirety of the flight after clearing the TFR is going to be VFR and ATC will tell you when you are clear and able to squawk 1200.
I know there was a lot of talk about the FAA doing something to fix it to make 47N more accessible, especially since Trump's summer trips to Bedminster shut down Solberg and Somerset for weeks at a time making flying in the area a royal pain and interfering with planned events such as Solberg's annual balloon festival. Looking at the procedures now, it looks like they changed the DP to use Yardley (ARD) and I think they modified the GPS approaches; you're still SOL though if you are in actual IMC and arent a /G (or rather the ICAO equivalent) since the VOR approach still uses SBJ.
There's no issue cancelling IFR in the air and finishing VFR though. In fact as illustrated by the 47N, it might even be necessary if you aren't a /G. I do however recommend staying IFR for as long as possible going into the TFR which means if flying into a towered airport, finishing the flight IFR and letting tower close your flight plan for you.
With a non-towered airport, I'd wait until I have a good solid visual on the field and ATC is telling me to change to CTAF. ATC is pretty good about reminding you to keep your squawk code until you're on the ground but still remember not to change it out of habit and to reject the instruction if ATC accidentally tells you to squawk 1200; I doubt that close to the airport TSA, Secret Service and the military would make a big deal of it if you did accidentally switch but as others have noted, the FAA will still take any sort of non-compliance like that very seriously so they might try to violate your ticket.
Getting out of the TFR, I'd say just file how you are going to file (VFR or IFR). Except for your specific departure instructions, the radio-contact procedure will be the same regardless of IFR vs VFR or towered vs non-towered. No sense filing IFR if the entirety of the flight after clearing the TFR is going to be VFR and ATC will tell you when you are clear and able to squawk 1200.