Plans for ADS-B out

I dunno, plans to have everyone using tech in 6 years that right now is vaporware seems like a really bad idea.
 
steingar said:
I dunno, plans to have everyone using tech in 6 years that right now is vaporware seems like a really bad idea.
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What is currently installable is not vaporware and works well, mostly Garmin. There is a fair amount of vaporware in announced but undelivered equipment. All the benefits that will be available in 2020 are essentially available now with a handful of states still being installed. Portable weather is in place today. I would expect prices to come down, but not in a major way other than by the inclusion of GPS position sources within transponders for those that merely are equipping to satisfy the rule.
 
John Collins said:
What is currently installable is not vaporware and works well, mostly Garmin. There is a fair amount of vaporware in announced but undelivered equipment. All the benefits that will be available in 2020 are essentially available now with a handful of states still being installed. Portable weather is in place today. I would expect prices to come down, but not in a major way other than by the inclusion of GPS position sources within transponders for those that merely are equipping to satisfy the rule.
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I have a VFR ship that ain't worth a heck of a lot. Tell me something that I can put in that doesn't cost my hull value that's 2020 compliant and likely to stay that way. Good luck.
 
steingar said:
I have a VFR ship that ain't worth a heck of a lot. Tell me something that I can put in that doesn't cost my hull value that's 2020 compliant and likely to stay that way. Good luck.
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$2500 to $3500 is probably in the cards for ADS-B Out with position source, but not available today.

Separate question, do you have a need or desire to operate in the ADS-B required airspace with your aircraft?
 
peerlesscowboy said:
Will my existing KT76A mode C transponder be compatable with a Garmin GDL88 UAT?
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"Patent-pending technology allows the GDL 88 to be compatible with a wide range of general aviation transponders — synchronizing squawk code and ident to eliminate the need to install a dedicated UAT control panel."

They have a receiver that reads the transmitted code and altitude from your transponder. You have to really dig though the documentation to find that out.
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
"Patent-pending technology allows the GDL 88 to be compatible with a wide range of general aviation transponders — synchronizing squawk code and ident to eliminate the need to install a dedicated UAT control panel."

They have a receiver that reads the transmitted code and altitude from your transponder. You have to really dig though the documentation to find that out.
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Actually, they have a low power 1030 MHz interrogator that interrogates the KT76A and receives its response with the built in 1090 MHz receiver.
 
I obviously have some reading to do, thanks Ron, Neal, John.
 
John Collins said:
$2500 to $3500 is probably in the cards for ADS-B Out with position source, but not available today.
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i.e. vaporware.

John Collins said:
Separate question, do you have a need or desire to operate in the ADS-B required airspace with your aircraft?
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Because as I understand it ADS-B required airspace after 2020 will be all controlled airspace, and like many others I do have the occasional need to traverse it.
 
steingar said:
I dunno, plans to have everyone using tech in 6 years that right now is vaporware seems like a really bad idea.
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Vaporware? How do you figure? The stations exist, and the hardware is available to pilots. Just because not many people are using it doesn't make it vapor. That term refers to something planned that does not and may never exist...ADS-B does not meet the criteria for "vaporware".
 
bullwinkle said:
Vaporware? How do you figure? The stations exist, and the hardware is available to pilots. Just because not many people are using it doesn't make it vapor. That term refers to something planned that does not and may never exist...ADS-B does not meet the criteria for "vaporware".
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Because the $2500-$3000 solution mentioned in the post above does not yet exist.
 
jsstevens said:
Because the $2500-$3000 solution mentioned in the post above does not yet exist.
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And the intelligent guy nails it! Boxes worth the whole airplane are too expensive. Nothing else available. i.e. what is now vaporware will be needed in 6 years. Why anyone has a tough time understanding this is beyond me.

Yeah, they can broadcast the signal in lots of places. But without a receiver in the aircraft they might as well not bother. Sure, airliners can afford this stuff. But without an affordable box many of us will be out of luck.

I've got to replace the transponder this year in my aircraft. So I have to put in something that might be useless in 6 years. Great.
 
steingar said:
i.e. vaporware.



Because as I understand it ADS-B required airspace after 2020 will be all controlled airspace, and like many others I do have the occasional need to traverse it.
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If you are willing to pay $5500 now it isn't vaporware. If you aren't willing to fork over that much, then it is still vaporware.

Your understanding as to where ADS-B is required after 2020 isn't even close. Class C and B airspace, Class B 30 NM veil, above 10,000 MSL is where it is required. If you are based in or near class C or B airspace, then it is required. If you are just an occasional user of a Class C or B airspace, then you can get one off permission to fly into and out of the airspace. If you regularly need to fly above 10,000 MSL (or 2500 feet AGL which ever is higher), then ADS-B is required. Many airplanes have difficulty operating at that altitude even if their service ceiling is above 10,000 feet. There are exceptions for aircraft that don't have and never have had an electrical system.
 
John Collins said:
If you are willing to pay $5500 now it isn't vaporware. If you aren't willing to fork over that much, then it is still vaporware.
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...and if your airplane isn't worth $5500, it is not now going in any of the areas where ADS-B will be required in 2020.
 
steingar said:
Show me a $5500 box that will do it without additional components.
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GDL88 with built in GPS position. It does not need a WAAS receiver as one is built in. It does not need to connect to any display. If you have an audio panel, it can provide verbal traffic call outs, although even this isn't required to be hooked up.
 
By the way, I just used ForeFlight to plan a coast to coast flight that does not require an ADS-B between KCRE (Grand Strand, North Myrtle Beach, SC) to my old stomping grounds at Ried Hillview Airport KRHV in San Jose, CA. I would stay below 10000 MSL except over the high country where I would have to stay 2500 AGL or 10,000 MSL, which ever is higher. I would fly a similar route if ADS-B was required or not.
 
Ron Levy said:
...and if your airplane isn't worth $5500, it is not now going in any of the areas where ADS-B will be required in 2020.
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Really??????

Now, my ride is worth a bit more than $5500 (I hope), but how would the value of the aircraft change the fact that it's 50 minutes (on a good day with no construction) to the nearest airport outside the 30nm ring and only 10-15 minutes to where the airplane is now?

It would be great if ADS-B were only required inside the actual class B, but it's not. You can't even get in and out of a little farm strip if it's less than 30nm away. That's 3739 square miles (statute) of no fly zone for each and every one of those things if you don't flush enough money down the toilet.
 
steingar said:
Show me a $5500 box that will do it without additional components.
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The Garmin GDL88 seems to not require anything else beyond antenna's and cables.

For the exact cost, or to find out if it really works with my installed avionics, Garmin says to contact your dealer. When I try to locate a dealer near me, they point me towards the local Radio Shack :rofl:

Garmin also says "Simply put, anyone who flies in controlled airspace will need an ADS-B “Out” solution." http://www.garmin.com/us/intheair/ads-b

They also claim "you’re not seeing any meaningful benefit in the cockpit for the additional investment you’re making in avionics." http://www.garmin.com/us/intheair/ads-b/compliance/


So, how much do you want to believe?
 
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