Let'sgoflying!
Touchdown! Greaser!
....undetected for 18? years! Sounds like not a bad dude, except for that one little white lie!
Pilot poses as MD
- Thread starter Let'sgoflying!
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gprellwitz
Touchdown! Greaser!
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Grant Prellwitz
Can't help but make one think of Frank Abagnale, Jr. in its audacity.
Steve Foley
Pattern Altitude
Maybe the gubmint should require photos on medical licenses too.
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Bob Noel
EppyGA
Touchdown! Greaser!
rpadula
En-Route
Did he own a Bonanza?
John Baker
Final Approach
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John Baker
I'm thinking that although his credentials were fake, from what I am reading, his doctoring wasn't. The article points out that his fellow doctors are going to miss his input, that they even wanted him to continue teaching. Apparently he was an asset to the medical community.
Have we become so dependent on "certification", and "diplomas" that we can no longer judge a person on their own merit? How many lives did he save while committing this dastardly deed?
There are a whole lot of doctors out there who posess all the proper credentials, yet have no business practicing medicine.
Could it be that good medicine is also an "art", that some folks are just naturals at it?
To arbitrarily throw out a genuine contributer to the field seems downright stupid.
Someday, many years from now, our great universities and their lockstep bureaucracies, might someway start to understand that thought should also be employed, along with their coveted diplomas.
John
Have we become so dependent on "certification", and "diplomas" that we can no longer judge a person on their own merit? How many lives did he save while committing this dastardly deed?
There are a whole lot of doctors out there who posess all the proper credentials, yet have no business practicing medicine.
Could it be that good medicine is also an "art", that some folks are just naturals at it?
To arbitrarily throw out a genuine contributer to the field seems downright stupid.
Someday, many years from now, our great universities and their lockstep bureaucracies, might someway start to understand that thought should also be employed, along with their coveted diplomas.
John
Last edited:
ScottM
Taxi to Parking
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iBazinga!
The guy is a UAL pilot out of KORD BTW. I know he is on non-flying status because that is what was reported. I wonder what he said to his employer about his medical quals and if they even bothered to do a background check.
Dr. O
Pattern Altitude
Seems much safer than Doctors posing as pilots....
***************************************
Wait a durn minute - I resemble that remark...
Been posing as a pilot for over 50 years!
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Well first, he was not practicing medicine... He was not laying hands on patients, drawing blood, making diagnosis, writing prescriptions, and certainly was not doing pelvic exams on ladies...
He was a proponent of working from guide lines and protocols (check lists, if you will) and at the airline, being that he was an M.D., he got put on their medical committee for developing an equipment list and first aid training methods for cabin crew... From there he went to seminars and made contacts within the medical training community that got him invites here and there... He published some papers and all of a sudden he was 100 miles from home and had a briefcase, so he was an expert on "how you train people"...
There is a cynical old saying in medicine that every doctor has heard, and it goes:
Those who can, do
And those who can't, teach
It is not accurate at all, but there is just enough of a grain of truth contained to make us nod in agreement when we hear it...
He had a couple of years of medical school and washed out, so he had inside knowledge that the general public does not as far as how the medical training system works - he had been lectured to by traveling 'experts'... He also knew that lots of folks get into the hospital teaching system without being a physician - the hip joint company has a representative that teaches the surgeons on how that company's hardware works, the drug company has a salesman/rep who "details" the pharmacists, residents, doctors, nurses on that company's new drug, and so on...
This is just the same that we as pilots know how flight training as actually done at the airport versus some non pilot / MS Flight X aficionado, who is trying to lay down a heap of BS... Sooner or later his mouth will give him away and every pilot in the room will catch it instantly because we have been there and done that and he hasn't...
He got into the medical training/lecture circuit by the back door through the airline and he was invited here and there and eventually reached the point where his name was familiar to people in the medical training circles to the point that he was offering teaching seminars on how to do procedures more safely via 'check lists' and 'protocols'... Apparently he was thought to be quite good at it by some - there were other highly experienced physicians who were not impressed with him, according to reports...
( which is how politicians get elected - on name familiarity by the voters even though the voter hasn't a clue what the pol stands for)
What he was doing up to that point did not expose him to a credentials check... The person in charge of finding people to provide training/lectures for that institution invited him and that was that... Non physicians als are invited to lecture in their field of expertise, microbiology, HAZMAT procedures, etc...
BTW, you can order a medical degree from the internet - anyone can be a 'doctor'...
Where he let his ego run away was in applying for federal grant monies... These grants are awarded to a researcher in the name of an institution, be it a university or a hospital...
Anyway, this was the first time he went to have his name formally associated with a hospital - and that will get you a credentials check, guaranteed... Had he ever actually been on a hospital or university medical staff he would have known that - hadn't been there, hadn't done that; oops...
At my institution I have been on staff for 30 years, been chairman of the department of medicine (and other officer positions), sat on the Executive Committee of the hospital which voted docs on or off the staff/set the staff rules, etc., and every two years I still go through a formal credentials check as though the the staff secretary's (who recognize my voice on the phone) had never heard of me before... And it is the way it should be done...
denny-o and Fat Albert the Apache
now Albert does have a briefcase and can get 100 miles from home so if anyone wants to offer us money to lecture, we'll be there...
***************************************
Wait a durn minute - I resemble that remark...
Been posing as a pilot for over 50 years!= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Well first, he was not practicing medicine... He was not laying hands on patients, drawing blood, making diagnosis, writing prescriptions, and certainly was not doing pelvic exams on ladies...
He was a proponent of working from guide lines and protocols (check lists, if you will) and at the airline, being that he was an M.D., he got put on their medical committee for developing an equipment list and first aid training methods for cabin crew... From there he went to seminars and made contacts within the medical training community that got him invites here and there... He published some papers and all of a sudden he was 100 miles from home and had a briefcase, so he was an expert on "how you train people"...
There is a cynical old saying in medicine that every doctor has heard, and it goes:
Those who can, do
And those who can't, teach
It is not accurate at all, but there is just enough of a grain of truth contained to make us nod in agreement when we hear it...
He had a couple of years of medical school and washed out, so he had inside knowledge that the general public does not as far as how the medical training system works - he had been lectured to by traveling 'experts'... He also knew that lots of folks get into the hospital teaching system without being a physician - the hip joint company has a representative that teaches the surgeons on how that company's hardware works, the drug company has a salesman/rep who "details" the pharmacists, residents, doctors, nurses on that company's new drug, and so on...
This is just the same that we as pilots know how flight training as actually done at the airport versus some non pilot / MS Flight X aficionado, who is trying to lay down a heap of BS... Sooner or later his mouth will give him away and every pilot in the room will catch it instantly because we have been there and done that and he hasn't...
He got into the medical training/lecture circuit by the back door through the airline and he was invited here and there and eventually reached the point where his name was familiar to people in the medical training circles to the point that he was offering teaching seminars on how to do procedures more safely via 'check lists' and 'protocols'... Apparently he was thought to be quite good at it by some - there were other highly experienced physicians who were not impressed with him, according to reports...
( which is how politicians get elected - on name familiarity by the voters even though the voter hasn't a clue what the pol stands for)
What he was doing up to that point did not expose him to a credentials check... The person in charge of finding people to provide training/lectures for that institution invited him and that was that... Non physicians als are invited to lecture in their field of expertise, microbiology, HAZMAT procedures, etc...
BTW, you can order a medical degree from the internet - anyone can be a 'doctor'...
Where he let his ego run away was in applying for federal grant monies... These grants are awarded to a researcher in the name of an institution, be it a university or a hospital...
Anyway, this was the first time he went to have his name formally associated with a hospital - and that will get you a credentials check, guaranteed... Had he ever actually been on a hospital or university medical staff he would have known that - hadn't been there, hadn't done that; oops...
At my institution I have been on staff for 30 years, been chairman of the department of medicine (and other officer positions), sat on the Executive Committee of the hospital which voted docs on or off the staff/set the staff rules, etc., and every two years I still go through a formal credentials check as though the the staff secretary's (who recognize my voice on the phone) had never heard of me before... And it is the way it should be done...
denny-o and Fat Albert the Apache
now Albert does have a briefcase and can get 100 miles from home so if anyone wants to offer us money to lecture, we'll be there...
PittsDriver
Cleared for Takeoff
Ain't that the truth! We rave about the sharks that circle around malpractice litigation but if the medical profession had any effective way of policing itself to some modicum of standard there'd be way less need for litigation and I suspect our healthcare situation would be less in crisis mode.
Let'sgoflying!
Touchdown! Greaser!
John, I am having a hard time imagining a world without those pesky certifications & diplomas. Or at least one that would be tolerable.
Yes, the process is not perfect but consider the alternative.....no one is required to have a medical degree, a pilot's license, a driver's license, a dental diploma, attorney's degree, a real estate license, a policeman's diploma, etc etc.
I mean, that would be ug-LY.
I also think we have to consider that being a liar is not socially acceptable. It would not be right to gloss over that fact.
However in deference to your arguments.....once the suspect has been proven guilty, punished, made amends....then - let's look at what he has to offer society, maybe there is some place that his knowledge and skills are useful. (the statements presume guilt which may not be true in this case)
Yes, the process is not perfect but consider the alternative.....no one is required to have a medical degree, a pilot's license, a driver's license, a dental diploma, attorney's degree, a real estate license, a policeman's diploma, etc etc.
I mean, that would be ug-LY.
I also think we have to consider that being a liar is not socially acceptable. It would not be right to gloss over that fact.
However in deference to your arguments.....once the suspect has been proven guilty, punished, made amends....then - let's look at what he has to offer society, maybe there is some place that his knowledge and skills are useful. (the statements presume guilt which may not be true in this case)
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe
Touchdown! Greaser!
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Light and Sporty Guy
Round here, you see lots of pictures of the "founding father" of the company and some of his buddies.
My favorite is one with him, Thomas Edison, and Harvy Firestone on a camping trip (Harvy is obscured by me - sorry but this is all I had handy)
Of the three of them, Harvy Firestone is the only one who graduated from high school.
Henry Ford and Thomas Edison probably couldn't get a job emptying the waste baskets here...
Attachments
JeffDG
Touchdown! Greaser!
Drivers/Pilots licenses are different than most you have specified. You can flunk out of high-school, yet still obtain an ATP by demonstrating the appropriate skill level and focused training on that skill set. Same with CDL. You don't need to graduate from an Ivy to be a truck driver, but you do need to demonstrate the skill.
It wasn't that long ago that you could become an attorney in most states (a few are still left) without any kind of law degree...again, by demonstrating the skills necessary, however obtained.
Might that be possible in medicine? I haven't a f'ing clue. Would it be easy to acquire the skills without a medical degree...hell NO. But there are some who thrive on that type of challenge and learn things better in different ways.
Gary F
Final Approach
The biggest reason the medical community cannot police itself is due to the fear of a libel or antitrust lawsuit brought by the physician whose medical judgment or skills are being questioned.
Doggtyred
En-Route
My experience has been that medicine is one of the few fields where that does NOT hold true..
Big difference between posing and "acting" as a pilot...I suspect the latter in your case sir!Seems much safer than Doctors posing as pilots....
***************************************
Wait a durn minute - I resemble that remark...
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe
Touchdown! Greaser!
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Light and Sporty Guy
Big difference between posing and "acting" as a pilot...I suspect the latter in your case sir!
NO!!! NO!!!
Don't tell me that in addition to the differences between logging and acting as PIC we also have to worry about POSING!!??
LearDriver
Line Up and Wait
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Gdriver
Seems much safer than Doctors posing as pilots....
***************************************
Wait a durn minute - I resemble that remark...
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Do you own a Bonanza?
Ghery
Touchdown! Greaser!
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Ghery Pettit
Veterinary medicine, as well. But Dad did have a framed Peanuts cartoon with the saying posted outside his office at WSU for years.
