Pilot Lies to ATC

Pilot was definitely jacked up but his original request made sense to me. Clip the airspace on the westside and stay south of the airport. No brainer. Why the controller took it upon himself to take him north made no sense. Then the usual arguing over the air which has become common these days in ATC.
 
But he did lie to ATC. He never flew a heading of 070 as suggested (instructed??) early oon and after he got too close to the pattern he was instructed to immediately turn left to heading 360 but he didn't. He never uttered the magic word...'unable'. Unknow if he was a relatively low-hour pilot but he did say he'd been in the area for 25-years. His radio work was sloppy, too.
 
Here's a better video with the uninterrupted track- think you can see why the initial suggestion the tower made was very sensible.

 
Hang 4 said:
Here's a better video with the uninterrupted track- think you can see why the initial suggestion the tower made was very sensible.

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Thanks. Turned the first one off as soon as I saw a talking head.
 
I don't think that the controller understood what the pilot was asking for. His initial request sounded to me like he was planning to fly south along the highway that grazes the west edge of the class D, prior to going over to the beach. His reference to the beach probably contributed to the misunderstanding. In that context, the 070 heading assignment didn't make sense to him, but once he accepted the heading assignment, he should have flown that heading. I stopped listening after that.
 
I have a number for you to call.
 
Palmpilot said:
I don't think that the controller understood what the pilot was asking for.
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Correct. The pilot mentioned clipping the southwest part of the Class D airspace and the controller asked how he was gonna go southwest to get east of the airspace.The controller didn't hear or understand what the pilot was saying. But once the controller gave him the 070 heading the pilot should have complied ...
 
Daleandee said:
Correct. The pilot mentioned clipping the southwest part of the Class D airspace and the controller asked how he was gonna go southwest to get east of the airspace.The controller didn't hear or understand what the pilot was saying. But once the controller gave him the 070 heading the pilot should have complied ...
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I agree. Another option would have been: “can I just head back west out of the delta and get a frequency change?”
 
Palmpilot said:
I don't think that the controller understood what the pilot was asking for. His initial request sounded to me like he was planning to fly south along the highway that grazes the west edge of the class D, prior to going over to the beach.
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I don’t think so, neither understood what the other was asking and wanting. The controller asked the pilot if he was going to follow the interstate south then cut over to the beach. The pilot responded that he was OVER the interstate, ie crossing it, and would then cut thru the southwest portion of the delta. But, it looks like the pilot wanted to more than jsut graze the delta, following his track he intended to cut over very near the runways and active pattern traffic.

And what the hell kind of phraseology is “I want to graze your control area” anyway? I seem to have missed that one in the AIM.
 
Bill said:
I don’t think so, neither understood what the other was asking and wanting. The controller asked the pilot if he was going to follow the interstate south then cut over to the beach. The pilot responded that he was OVER the interstate, ie crossing it, and would then cut thru the southwest portion of the delta. But, it looks like the pilot wanted to more than jsut graze the delta, following his track he intended to cut over very near the runways and active pattern traffic.

And what the hell kind of phraseology is “I want to graze your control area” anyway? I seem to have missed that one in the AIM.
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I’m trying to think how I would have phrased it.

“I’d like to transition the west side of the delta, southbound along the interstate, then east to the beach once I’m well south of the field.” Maybe. Most people forget the word secant about two seconds after HS geometry.
 
Bill said:
And what the hell kind of phraseology is “I want to graze your control area” anyway? I seem to have missed that one in the AIM.
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It's right next to "last call"
 
Flying Keys said:
I’m trying to think how I would have phrased it.

“I’d like to transition the west side of the delta, southbound along the interstate, then east to the beach once I’m well south of the field.” Maybe. Most people forget the word secant about two seconds after HS geometry.
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Seems a bit wordy. How about "I'd like to transition Interstate 95 south to Canal Street east".
 
asicer said:
Seems a bit wordy. How about "I'd like to transition Interstate 95 south to Canal Street east".
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Assuming I know the names of those landmarks, sure. I’d do that at my home airport, but I wouldn’t expect it to mean much to people not from there.
 
Arrogant
Entitled
Defiant

Other pilots have to get out of his way.

Sounds like a lot of problems today.
 
What's the over/under for length of suspension?
 
On the one hand, I used tell my students to remember that ATC was invented to help pilots on their way, not the other way around. In that regard, the controller might have made a little more effort to understand what the pilot was requesting and aided him in the request. I thought it was pretty obvious what the pilot was asking for.

But on the other hand…

That in no way excuses patently disregarding ATC instructions. Specifically, 91.123, in part:

Except in an emergency, no person may operate an aircraft contrary to an ATC instruction in an area in which air traffic control is exercised.

I do think this pilot’s actions were in clear violation of FAR 91.123 and flagrant enough to precipitate some enforcement action.
 
Flying Keys said:
Assuming I know the names of those landmarks, sure. I’d do that at my home airport, but I wouldn’t expect it to mean much to people not from there.
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According to the Super Cub guy in the video, "Been livin' here 25 years and coming through here so no problem".

I suppose the other side of the coin is whether or not the guy in the tower knows those landmarks. Maybe those are the roads on his drive to work?
 
asicer said:
According to the Super Cub guy in the video, "Been livin' here 25 years and coming through here so no problem".

I suppose the other side of the coin is whether or not the guy in the tower knows those landmarks. Maybe those are the roads on his drive to work?
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Yeah, haha, for sure those two locals could have figured out a way to communicate that better! I was just trying to figure out how I’d express those intentions as a non-local (basically applied anywhere that’s unfamiliar) in a professional way instead of the clipping/grazing thing they got here.
 
If he would have clarified what he wanted to do, or just stayed out of the Delta and flew south a bit before turning east all would have gone well. Looking at it on Skyvector (if the locations on the video are correct) the time for what he wanted to do and what he ultimately had to do are the same. If he's been living there for 25 years, and this ain't his first flight to the beach, he must have known better ...
 
Rt 95 is used as a landmark by Daytona Approach which controls the Class C above where this was going on. I want to transition up or down 95 regularly and they ask me where I am relative to it as well. It's the main N/S highway in eastern FL. I'd be shocked if the EVB tower doesn't know where that is relative to the field.
 
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