Pilot Egos

denverpilot said:
Have run into that same stupidity at GXY. Don’t know why, but that place loves to have half the airplanes making laps on 28, and everyone else shooting instrument approaches to landings on 35.

Part of it is nobody wants to taxi from the far end of 35 to the terminal for lunch, but there’s something else that causes it there.

Of course 35 didn’t exist or wasn’t usable back in the day... that concrete monster was added and I have no idea why, but someone got some serious coin for pouring that thing. :)

Anyway. Yeah. GXY gets stupid.

Also as a warning unless they’ve gotten over their “terrorism” security stupidity. Don’t plan GXY for an after hours departure after flying in during the day. They will NOT give you a gate code and they’ll tell you that you have to call a number and wait for an on call counter/desk person to come open the doors and let you walk to your plane. And they’ll charge you $35 or something like that for the privilege.

I’ve got family up there we used to fly up for afternoon stuff and dinner with. Now if we do that we tell them to drive over to FNL. I won’t give money to GXY while they have that policy.

The gate has a code reader too.

I hear there’s new management up there. Maybe they’d listen if I flew up and chatted with them about how dumb that pay to get to your airplane policy is. I’ll happily buy gas. But don’t lock me off the ramp and make me pay $35 for someone to punch a code. Dumb dumb dumb.
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Need to work your fence climbing skills Nate..... come to think of it, I haven't climbed a fence in 20 years or more, I should practice too.
 
PaulS said:
Need to work your fence climbing skills Nate..... come to think of it, I haven't climbed a fence in 20 years or more, I should practice too.
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They have cameras and the airport is next door to the PD’s shooting range. Nooooope.
 
denverpilot said:
They have cameras and the airport is next door to the PD’s shooting range. Nooooope.
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I've climbed airport fences from here to Minnesota. No arrests yet! Knees don't like it much anymore...
 
Not sure I would have changed runways here. The guys on the ground, assuming they were competent, could easily slip out between two in the pattern for the other runway. If they weren't competent then they would have been a problem no matter which runway they were on. As far as this "he hurt me with his words" stuff, I think we all need to HTFU. Once again, who cares?
 
Dude the other day took off opposite runway from me and started doing closed traffic. You could tell he did it on accident but I swapped to the perpendicular runway to avoid him. He lands taxis over to the runway I’m using and announces “taking off on the crosswind runway 23 closed traffic. Incredible stol characteristics for a 172 I guess.
I thought about going back to the original runway for the humor of it, but we just left the guy the airport to himself.

Proper awareness and communication makes for fun. When someone starts getting mouthy and controlling it can be scary.

Aren’t uncontrolled airports great
 
Mtns2Skies said:
That's it. Accommodating other traffic is righteous indignation :rolleyes:

The traffic pattern isn't really the best place to make your stand on proper procedure.
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Nor is it really the place to do non-standard things just because. Just playing devils advocate here but the way I read it and maybe I am missing something...The guy was right, you were wrong, you disagreed based on circumstances and lets face it convenience for those involved, he called you out on procedure and you didn't like it so he shouldn't be flying because of his ego. I think that is a bit drastic.
 
DFH65 said:
Nor is it really the place to do non-standard things just because. Just playing devils advocate here but the way I read it and maybe I am missing something...The guy was right, you were wrong, you disagreed based on circumstances and lets face it convenience for those involved, he called you out on procedure and you didn't like it so he shouldn't be flying because of his ego. I think that is a bit drastic.
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Yeah but that "circumstance" as you put it involves 4 aircraft taking off potentially into me. It was VERY easy for me to change patterns to prevent that from occurring, and for this guy to change patterns as well. Very simple. But due to an advisory item, not a mandatory one, he decided he'd rather stay on the runway that was not favored for safe operations. Even as I flew over later with 3 aircraft IN THE PATTERN for the other runway, not just in line for takeoff, he decided him being right was more important than him being safe.
 
I'm certainly not above saying I was wrong. Perhaps I should have just left the pattern immediately rather than trying to get the other pilot to switch with me :dunno:.

Either way I certainly was not going to continue my pattern with planes that could takeoff into me on short final.
 
Shrug it off and go fly. I had a frustrating experience recently at a towered airport. The controller wasn't paying much attention while I was trying to do a few touch n goes all alone at first, then another plane comes in and the controller clears him to land straight in right as I was starting to turn short final from the pattern (I was doing simulated engine out). I catch sight of the other plane on final about 300 feet below me (he was dragging it in, and just about the perfect distance for me to have descended right into him if I hadn't noticed him) and reminded the controller I was on base ready to turn final, he had me go-round. Another couple planes called up while I was in upwind so I decided to bug out to calmer skies.
 
Yeah, I 've had confused controllers before. Best to bug out until they clear up their act. Like I said, lots of places to land nearby.
 
When a tower controller is working slow traffic, beware! I've seen it myself as a tower controller. I wasn't working one day but was up in the tower and it was low overcast, nothing going on except for a T37 on an ILS approach. I heard a vehicle call ground to cross and the GC cleared him across, as I looked up I saw the T37 come out of the overcast and said "hey you got a Tweet there", too late of course as the vehicle drove across the runway. Wasn't close but point being tower forgot about the jet. When it's busy as heck controllers are alert and paying attention more. Just saying how it is sometimes.
 
Years ago when instructing I was on a dual cross country. He wanted to do a touch and go at some sleepy little airport and I said go ahead. He listened to the AWOS which reported wind as light and variable. The runway was 9-27, or close to that. The student decided that since the sun was low on the horizon, he would use runway 9 to keep the sun out of his eyes.

Since we were coming in from the north, he decided to enter a midfield downwind for runway 9. He made all the appropriate traffic calls and it sounded as if we were the only traffic in the area, so he proceeded to enter the downwind for left traffic for runway 9.

After calling turning to final, another plane called in 10 miles from the south. Immediately some one on the ground got on the radio and said. "Watch out Roy, there is an airplane landing backwards." Now I need to say this was in southeast Ohio, along the river, so backwards sounded like bakerds. I got on the radio and in my best Gomer Pyle voice I said, "Bakerds..!!! I ain't never seen no airplane land bakerds befoe...." The guy on the ground warned ol' Roy and said "That there airplanes doin' a dangerous down wind landing."

I went to my best instructor voice and said, "If you can't land with a light and variable tail wind then you should probably hang it up. Much safer to land with the sun behind you instead of blinding you."

The windsock was as limp as a deflated balloon, but indicated that the last breeze came out of the west. The runway was flat and around 5500 feet long. After landing we taxied back to depart runway 9. The AWOS was then reporting wind calm. But ol' Roy came in landing to the west, straight into the sun which was about 10 degrees or so above the horizon.

After he cleared the runway I got on the radio and said, "That sun sure is bright." Ol' Roy came back, "Yeah, it'll get that way everyday 'bout this time, makes it hard to land". :rolleyes:
 
Salty said:
Shrug it off and go fly. I had a frustrating experience recently at a towered airport. The controller wasn't paying much attention while I was trying to do a few touch n goes all alone at first, then another plane comes in and the controller clears him to land straight in right as I was starting to turn short final from the pattern (I was doing simulated engine out). I catch sight of the other plane on final about 300 feet below me (he was dragging it in, and just about the perfect distance for me to have descended right into him if I hadn't noticed him) and reminded the controller I was on base ready to turn final, he had me go-round. Another couple planes called up while I was in upwind so I decided to bug out to calmer skies.
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Experience is a great thing to have and build. When I was checking out in an SR-20 we were doing pattern work when a Cardinal kept getting closer and closer behind us. So my instructor says watch this, turn an early crosswind into downwind. After that the Cardinal didn't catch up again, I wouldn't have thought of that, now I know.
 
I had a guy throw that "calm wind runway is XX" crap at me.

I said "Reported winds are XXX at 05, thanks"
 
Ravioli said:
I had a guy throw that "calm wind runway is XX" crap at me.

I said "Reported winds are XXX at 05, thanks"
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Isn't using the calm runway more of a neighborly thing, generally for noise consideration? The AP I regularly fly out of says something to the effect of "winds under 5 rwy 32 preferred".
 
you're right. but... when people are lining up the way el-moderator @Mtns2Skies describes it is polite to go with it.

I've seen it at an airport I keep a plane at, where the traffic has been 32 for hours, but the wind failed to listen to us and 14 became the better choice. Took a while to get everyone to "agree" so we landed with the lemmings on 32... we were at the fuel pit when the flow finally changed.

Fortunately I was in the right seat in a somewhat famous Grumman at the time. Who knows what could have happened if I was PIC.
 
I hear that "calm wind runway" advisory/warning/chastisement nearly every time I get near Greeley ... no, not directed at me (recently, anyway). :D
 
gkainz said:
I hear that "calm wind runway" advisory/warning/chastisement nearly every time I get near Greeley ... no, not directed at me (recently, anyway). :D
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Do they have two mics so you can pick up the wind from either orifice?
 
PaulS said:
Isn't using the calm runway more of a neighborly thing, generally for noise consideration? The AP I regularly fly out of says something to the effect of "winds under 5 rwy 32 preferred".
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The calm wind thing at GXY isn't really a noise concern...unless the cows are complaining...and they will be hamburger soon anyway.

Folks wanting fuel or a meal or work on the plane are going to use 10/28 and winds are 'always' out of the west-southwest so not sure what's up with the 17/35 preference. 35 does have an ILS but that's about it's only redeeming feature for FLIBs...unless ya wanna get 3 tngs on one pass down the runway.
 
Clark1961 said:
The calm wind thing at GXY isn't really a noise concern...unless the cows are complaining...and they will be hamburger soon anyway.

Folks wanting fuel or a meal or work on the plane are going to use 10/28 and winds are 'always' out of the west-southwest so not sure what's up with the 17/35 preference. 35 does have an ILS but that's about it's only redeeming feature for FLIBs...unless ya wanna get 3 tngs on one pass down the runway.
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Three tngs on one pass, sounds like some of my landings.
 
I think it’s funny if an airport has one runway with a 10 knot crosswind it’s normal. But if it has two runways and you take the one with a 10 knot crosswind (while the other may only be 5) it’s considered dangerous. When traffic allows and the wind is reasonable I nearly always take the most convenient one. Why only do crosswind landing when you have to?
 
PaulS said:
I've told you before you need to stop listening to those voices in your head Clark.
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I have to call a number when I don't pay attention to the voices in my head.
 
Mtns2Skies said:
I don't care that he was correct, he had way too big of an ego to fly safely. Even though he was an ass I corrected my incorrect pattern, but I was NOT about to fly an intersecting pattern with other aircraft. A calm wind runway is advisory not mandatory and he created a VERY unsafe condition.
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Respectfully disagree. He was in front of you and you were both in the pattern doing T&G's and then you changed runways and flew an incorrect pattern. He may have been a condescending a$$, but he didn't create the unsafe condition. If the other aircraft were remaining in the pattern they should have used 35. If they were just departing I don't see why you needed to change runways...
 
idahoflier said:
Respectfully disagree. He was in front of you and you were both in the pattern doing T&G's and then you changed runways and flew an incorrect pattern. He may have been a condescending a$$, but he didn't create the unsafe condition. If the other aircraft were remaining in the pattern they should have used 35. If they were just departing I don't see why you needed to change runways...
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Yes, sometimes someone can be an ****0le and still be right. It doesn't make them any less an ****0le, it just makes them... right.
 
Nope. I’m actually a class clown type. Can barely make it through five minutes without cracking some stupid joke.
But I don’t expect anyone here to know that, as nobody here knows me.
That said, some jokes are in bad taste, or better yet just not funny.
You are free to disagree.
 
Kritchlow said:
Nope. I’m actually a class clown type. Can barely make it through five minutes without cracking some stupid joke.
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In that case your online alter-ego is exceedingly well crafted to hide humor detection in any form. ;)
 
RoscoeT said:
In that case your online alter-ego is exceedingly well crafted to hide humor detection in any form. ;)
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Nah... look harder at some posts.
But overall I think most here have egos the size of the moon. That’s what prompted my first post on this thread. All the new private pilots say now they have a license to learn, but as soon as a 20,000 hr airline guy tries to tell them something they are arguing and quoting the AIM. All the new guys know everything. Want a specific reg or a formal explanation? Ask a newly minted PP. Want some tips on real world flying and the way it’s really done? Ask a seasoned ATP.
 
I have a friend who flies the seven five for Delta. He don't know chit about flying a Piper Cherokee.
 
Kritchlow said:
Nah... look harder at some posts.
But overall I think most here have egos the size of the moon. That’s what prompted my first post on this thread. All the new private pilots say now they have a license to learn, but as soon as a 20,000 hr airline guy tries to tell them something they are arguing and quoting the AIM. All the new guys know everything. Want a specific reg or a formal explanation? Ask a newly minted PP. Want some tips on real world flying and the way it’s really done? Ask a seasoned ATP.
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I thought we were talking sense of humor issues, but in the context of an "ego" thread it's rather telling that you drifted unprompted and off topic into the mention of your 20,000 hrs of somewhat narrow flying experience and supremacy over others. Aviation is a very broad and wide ranging topic. Your 20,000 hrs. of course has relevance to some of that. But you should realize that ATP/airline pilots often get a bad rap because some equate hours passed sitting in a seat with wide ranging expertise. I really don't need to go into examples. This is a general comment. I don't pay close enough attention here to lump you in with those types.
 
RoscoeT said:
I thought we were talking sense of humor issues, but in the context of an "ego" thread it's rather telling that you drifted unprompted and off topic into the mention of your 20,000 hrs of somewhat narrow flying experience and supremacy over others. Aviation is a very broad and wide ranging topic. Your 20,000 hrs. of course has relevance to some of that. But you should realize that ATP/airline pilots often get a bad rap because some equate hours passed sitting in a seat with wide ranging expertise. I really don't need to go into examples. This is a general comment. I don't pay close enough attention here to lump you in with those types.
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Okay. Whatever...

But you’re wrong on many points. First most of us have flown small airplanes and have moved on.
Personally I have done corporate flying for 20 years into small airports so I’m very aware of small airplane type flying. I’ve also done airlines for several years so I’m also equated to that.

In the early days I have flight instructed, flown sky divers, and flown checks in a C310. I have also flown commuter turboprops for several thousand hours. I have flown corporate in anything from a baron to a Citation X.

The only type of flying I haven’t done is military.

The point is not that I know everything (lord knows I am far from that), but rather I can pass along some knowledge to the younger guys.

So, I stand by my post.
 
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