Oops, wrong airport

Another example of the outstanding professionalism at this carrier.
 
texasplt said:
Another example of the outstanding professionalism at this carrier.
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Oh yes, because this is clearly the first time in history this has been done.

http://www.thirdamendment.com/wrongway.html

July 16, 1997 - A Continental Express Embraer 120, bound for Lake Charles, Louisiana, mistakenly lands at Southland Field in Carlyss. See T.J. Milling, "A familiar landmark? Another Continental plane sets down at same, wrong airport," Houston Chronicle, July 19, 1997.

...

October 3, 1996 - A Continental Express aircraft, bound for Lake Charles, Louisiana, mistakenly lands at Southland Field in Carlyss. Link.
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OK, why did they not just take off and fly on over to the proper airport? 5,000' and paved...
 
SCCutler said:
OK, why did they not just take off and fly on over to the proper airport? 5,000' and paved...
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Can't takeoff again without a new dispatch release, t/o performance data, current weather packet, and load manifest (remember, these planes fly on paperwork). No way dispatch was going to release that flight!

They actually couldn't if they wanted to (they wouldn't have data for Carlyss, probably, without going into supplemental ops), and there's no way a chief pilot would sign off on it.

And had the pilots taken off without a release...it WOULD get back to the company, and that WOULD be much worse!
 
Sorta figured all that - but thought I'd ask.
 
Do you think the Captain and FO fight over who has to make that cabin announcement?
 
Another obvious question... was the flight crew already briefed as to their correct destination before they departed the ready room? Wasn't that part of their clearance?

If they were operating in the IFR system, wouldn't they have had plenty of clues before they were committed to land?
 
bfergie10 said:
Do you think the Captain and FO fight over who has to make that cabin announcement?
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MOST captains would do it themselves. And MOST FOs would tell the captain where to stick the mic if he told them to do it.

AggieMike88 said:
Another obvious question... was the flight crew already briefed as to their correct destination before they departed the ready room? Wasn't that part of their clearance?

If they were operating in the IFR system, wouldn't they have had plenty of clues before they were committed to land?
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I guess I'm not 100% clear on the question, but yes, they knew where they were supposed to be going. They would have had the schedule at least all day; probably since sometime last month. Before departure they would have gotten a stack of paper about half an inch thick; the first page of which (called the Dispatch Release) has the destination in, I think, at least 3 places. All the rest of the paperwork is the weather/NOTAMS/performance data for their departure, planned arrival, and planned alternate airports.

It was an IFR flight. There are certain cases where they could have taken off VFR (with dispatcher approval, must pick up IFR w/i 50nm of departure point), or canceled enroute (must be in contact with ground based radio station that supports traffic reporting, must be within 10nm of the airport, must maintain visual contact with the landing surface at all times; there's a few other criteria, as well), but there are no enroute VFR operations allowed.

This wasn't an issue of them not knowing where they were going. Something else happened on the way. My guess is, they briefed the approach somewhere near the top of descent, then picked up the first set of lights that they saw after the blackness between Houston and Lake Charles, got cleared the visual approach, and landed there. Unfortunately they wanted the second set of lights, only about 8 miles away.
 
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typically they get cleared for the approach and land at the first airport they see. it just happens it isn't the right one
 
Teller1900 said:
Can't takeoff again without a new dispatch release, t/o performance data, current weather packet, and load manifest (remember, these planes fly on paperwork). No way dispatch was going to release that flight!

They actually couldn't if they wanted to (they wouldn't have data for Carlyss, probably, without going into supplemental ops), and there's no way a chief pilot would sign off on it.

And had the pilots taken off without a release...it WOULD get back to the company, and that WOULD be much worse!
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Jeez, I'm surprise the airlines doesn't have paperwork for when the pilot can use the lavatory. :rolleyes:

So what ends up happening to the passenger? Do they get stranded until the pilot get all the paperwork, or does the airline usually send out another crew to pick them up and fly them to the correct airport?
 
Tarheel Pilot said:
Jeez, I'm surprise the airlines doesn't have paperwork for when the pilot can use the lavatory. :rolleyes:

So what ends up happening to the passenger? Do they get stranded until the pilot get all the paperwork, or does the airline usually send out another crew to pick them up and fly them to the correct airport?
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No paperwork for the lav, but you'd be amazed at the dance we had to do to get out of the cockpit.

If the plane is diverted to another station that can handle it (with coordination from Dispatch), then yes, you just wait for new paperwork, which can be generated and sent in well under 5 minutes. In this case, the pax would have been put in a bus/cab. The plane didn't fly out until just after 1700 the next day (with a new crew).
 
I've never landed at the wrong airport.


























(figured out my mistake when I was still on downwind)
 
I've been is several situations where I had airport confusion. With the GPS, it can certainly be cleared up, but I can see how someone can be the subject of confusion visually. I just went to a new airport a couple months ago where there was a major airport next to the uncontrolled on to which I was headed. Very easy to see the large airport and not as easy to see the smaller one. I was vectored by approach right toward the major airport and crisply told my airport was at 2 O'Clock and seven miles. Well, I can see how folks would proceed to the incorrect one, especially if the runway directions are the same. El Paso has this problem where folks go to the field just north, and Destin has had several problems.

I haven't done it, but can certainly see how it occurs.

Best,

Dave
 
Coming home from the north at night I usually pick up the lights at Lunken before my home dromes (maybe because the ISZ beacon is half burned out more than half the time.) If I were unfamiler I could see making the goof of passing over Blue Ash.
 
tonycondon said:
typically they get cleared for the approach and land at the first airport they see. it just happens it isn't the right one
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A lot of times it happens at night at non-towered airports that use the same CTAF. Guy clicks the mic, sees the runway light up, and lands ... oops.
 
Dave Siciliano said:
El Paso has this problem where folks go to the field just north, and Destin has had several problems. Dave
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The controllers at EL Paso give a "warning" on most clearances to runway 22 saying "Cleared visual 22 approach, Biggs Field 2 miles north". Main problem is El Paso is runway 22 and Biggs is runway 21 (very similar).

On night flights coming through Anthony Gap I will request the rabbit lights if given runway 22 just to be 1000 percent sure.
 
Steve said:
They probably have "I landed at Carlyss" t-shirts in the company store.
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:rofl: They didn't have them in EWR, but I'll have to ask the guys from the IAH side of the house if they have any...or are making any.
 
I believe the record miss distance in the US was a Western Airlines 737 cleared for the visual approach to Sheridan, Wyoming (KSHR) that landed in Buffalo WY (KBYG) instead -- 26 miles. But the miss distance and the consequences may have both been worse for a Tel Aviv-bound cargo flight that landed in Beirut 132nm away by mistake.
Here's a pretty good list...
http://www.thirdamendment.com/wrongway.html
 
danhagan said:
The controllers at EL Paso give a "warning" on most clearances to runway 22 saying "Cleared visual 22 approach, Biggs Field 2 miles north". Main problem is El Paso is runway 22 and Biggs is runway 21 (very similar).

On night flights coming through Anthony Gap I will request the rabbit lights if given runway 22 just to be 1000 percent sure.
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:yeahthat: Every time I've been in there we've briefed that we either have to A) be spot on the ILS, or B) visually acquire the other airport or the ELP terminal before we land. I have heard more than a couple first hand accounts of that place biting guys hard.

The place I went to flight school had 2 CFI candidates in a Seminole on their way to St. Petersburg, FL land at MacDill AFB instead. They had a LONG couple days, and unsurprisingly, didn't come home with new certificates in their pockets!
 
Since the runways at Lake Charles and the other place are both aligned 15/33 and have LOC freqs of 109.1 and 109.3, what do you want to bet that they might have had the wrong frequency plugged in as well?
 
Gulf of Oman, evening hazy conditions, flying EMCON (EMissions CONtrolled) or "zip lip" recovery to Nimitz, where all electronic emissions on the ship were shut down. We (E-2 Hawkeye) vectored the recovering aircraft to the stack, or holding pattern, where they circled down to pattern altitude and then vectored to the ship for landing in sequence.

After the last plane got aboard, we took one last sweep with the radar to confirm location of home plate, shut down our radar and pushed on in, expecting to see this ...

800px-USS_Nimitz_%28CVN-68%29.jpg


Instead, we lined up on (similar to) this ...

greek-shipx.jpg


It WAS the biggest blip on the screen, just a half mile off ... :)
 
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