Well, this particularly letter is almost certainly not part of the required due process. As I understand the context of your statement, the due process you are referring to would apply to the method by which you are made aware of the criminal court proceeding. You are correct that the court would still have to serve the warrant or summons, and there are clear rules about how that must be served. http://www.supremecourt.ohio.gov/LegalResources/Rules/criminal/CriminalProcedure.pdf But that is irrelevant to this first class letter demanding payment. This is merely an attempt to collect without having to file formal charges. If you ignore the letter, they just move to the next phase of their collection procedure. But getting you to respond to the letter, or even proving you received it, is completely irrelevant to the issue of whether you committed the underlying criminal offense, and whether they can proceed to prosecute you.
Ohio City Tax Oddity
- Thread starter Ted
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Well, this particularly letter is almost certainly not part of the required due process. As I understand the context of your statement, the due process you are referring to would apply to the method by which you are made aware of the criminal court proceeding. You are correct that the court would still have to serve the warrant or summons, and there are clear rules about how that must be served. http://www.supremecourt.ohio.gov/LegalResources/Rules/criminal/CriminalProcedure.pdf But that is irrelevant to this first class letter demanding payment. This is merely an attempt to collect without having to file formal charges. If you ignore the letter, they just move to the next phase of their collection procedure. But getting you to respond to the letter, or even proving you received it, is completely irrelevant to the issue of whether you committed the underlying criminal offense, and whether they can proceed to prosecute you.
Ted
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Well, people accused of murder are not necessarily informed they are being investigated prior to arrest and prosecution.
I've certainly encountered judges who felt that the ends (especially when it involved taking your money) justified the means of ignoring when cops or other government representatives didn't do what they were supposed to. Back in college I once got a ticket for being in a park after dark. There was no sign saying this, and the cop didn't have me sign the ticket (said right on the ticket along the lines of: "Must sign to be valid. Signing is not an admission of guilt."). I pointed both of these out to the judge, with evidence proving I was right. Judge said "I'm going to ignore that." Well yeah, it was about $300 for the city. This was also New York.
To add a follow-up on a few things. Some people reached out with contacts for people who know more about this than me (attorneys and CPAs). After a few phone calls, I am going to be following up on this and not ignoring it. Also, I misread the notice to a certain extent. It says if ignored I would then get subpoenaed for a court appearance and if I failed to appeared at that court date they would then issue a warrant. So that makes more sense.
I'm not going to state much more about it until things are resolved for what should be obvious reasons, but I did want to make the corrections.
EdFred
Taxi to Parking
The demand for payment (or whatever important letters that may only come first class mail) is not part of the prosecution. Like you said it's a demand for payment, or a notice. But it's not prosecution. AFAIK if you are being prosecuted for something, you're supposed to be made aware of it via summons or something a little more face to face than USMail.
investigation != prosecution
Sounds like you and I are 100% on the same page.
That is exactly what I suspected.
Ted
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Even I am capable of making errors. I know some of you are shocked.
Sorry, I wasn't clear. It wasn't that I thought you misread it. It's that I suspected that this was just a collection letter and they would move to phase II if it was ignored. Sorry about that.
Ted
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I understood what you meant. I was making a joke. As many have pointed out, I am very bad with humor.
I understood what you meant. I was making a joke. As many have pointed out, I am very bad with humor.
Thanks. I just wanted to make sure I was clear I wasn't taking a pot shot at anyone.
I would hope this one can be cleared up quickly and cheaply. I think it sucks that you have to deal with this. As a civil defense lawyer, I see first hand the costs that are incurred due to what I perceive as stupid cases. Those costs generally get paid by insurance companies, who most people hate, so no one really loses sleep, or really considers whether those costs get passed on to consumers. (Hint-- they do.) But it is really tough when individuals have to pay those costs directly. As Mark Steyn so eloquently stated, "the process is the punishment." I will not link to any of his articles discussing this principal so as to avoid any Spin Zone worthy responses. But you can google them yourself and find some addressing the IRS. Good luck.
steingar
Taxi to Parking
Judge: you were served with notice of a tax liability
Steingar: I didn't receive a damn thing
Judge: I have record the notice was sent on XXXXXX
Steingar: I didn't receive a damn thing
Judge: It is your responsibility to receive mail
Steingar: I have thieves in my neighborhood who steal mail. It's your responsibility to catch them
You forgot the next line of the transcript:
Judge: Ok, I will set aside the warrant for your failure to appear. But you have now been served. Trial is set for Monday at 9:00 a.m. We are adjourned.
EdFred
Taxi to Parking
State wants to get paid!That soon?
Zeldman
Touchdown! Greaser!
Or as what once happened to me when contesting a traffic ticket, '' I do not like your attitude. You can sit in jail until you are ready to apologize for that remark...''
Lindberg
Final Approach
You forgot the preceding lines of the transcript:
Court: Mr. Steingar, are you going to give testimony?
Steingar: Yes.
Court: Do you swear the testimony that you are about to give is true, to the best of your knowledge?
Steingar: Can you define "true"?
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Clip4
Touchdown! Greaser!
Can you define is?
flhrci
Final Approach
So, where's my money @Ted DuPuis? I am here in Ohio waiting you know.
@steingar probably wants his share to.
@steingar probably wants his share to.
Ted
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So, where's my money @Ted DuPuis? I am here in Ohio waiting you know.
Seeing as you live in Columbus (along with Michael), and this is a city tax matter with Hamilton, your town would not be getting anything regardless of outcome.
And while there is progress, there is not yet a final resolution, so I am going to continue to not post regarding the matter itself.
wsuffa
Touchdown! Greaser!
Do what I did. The P.O. kept delivering social security checks for someone several blocks away. The third time, I put it in a FedEx envelope addressed to the postmaster with a note tha "I have to send it this way because my experience is that the USPS will deliver to the wrong place". I got a call the next day from the postmaster explaining how embarrassed he was to have a FedEx delivery guy delivering to his facility in front of the staff..... and I pointed out how desperate the SS recipient must be. Never another misdelivered piece of mail until I moved away.
ARFlyer
En-Route
I HATED Ohio City Taxes! I had to deal with them when I was still at PSA and based in Dayton for training and line flying. The ****ty part was filing taxes for Arkansas, North Carolina, and Ohio.
The FAA will send enforcement investigation letter to you via both Certified and First Class. If the Certified comes back but the First Class letter does not then the FAA still assumes service.
The FAA will send enforcement investigation letter to you via both Certified and First Class. If the Certified comes back but the First Class letter does not then the FAA still assumes service.
Rushie
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That is a good idea!