new-to-me hundid dollah burger place

eman1200

eman1200

Touchdown! Greaser!
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Bro do you even lift
not sure how I never heard of this place before, as it's pretty close to me. I heard about it the other day and went to scope it out today. was thinking it might be a potential cool spot for a fly-in for the southeast folks to at least talk about going, if not maybe possibly actually going to. it looked like there'd be enough room to camp, and there's a bar/restaurant on the field. turns out it's a massive sky diving operation, and they actually aren't overly welcoming of GA. it's in the middle of several MOA's and extremely close to restricted airspace, which made the arrival fun (not bad, just gotta know what's going on). the restaurant serves breakfast all day, so I immediately liked them. anyways, quick vid link below.

anyone else find a NEW place to fly to?

5W4
 
I know a guy that jumps there all the time, had no idea they had a restaurant on the field. Will have to check it out.
 
Cool video hoski. It definitely looks like a good hypothetical fly in location!
 
airspace directly surrounding the field:

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I’m sensing a bit of hostility........:skeptical:
 
My home stomping grounds! I was raised in Raeford, NC, and our family has had a presence at that airport for many years. I think my cousin hangars his old J3 and his Cessna 180 elsewhere; I'm honestly not sure. (He owns Carolina Turf Farms, which you can see from the air -- looks like a giant, lush golfing green!)

The Thacker family owns 5W4, but they're letting the current tenants run it. Yes, they're big on the parachuting business. The Army's Golden Knights have trained at that airport for decades.

I haven't tried the new diner, but I've heard it's good.

And yes, it IS surrounded by military stuff -- Ft. Bragg, Pope AFB. I was learning how to plot courses a while back, and you have to go around your elbow to get to your ear to avoid some of them.
 
Stephen Poole said:
….And yes, it IS surrounded by military stuff -- Ft. Bragg, Pope AFB. I was learning how to plot courses a while back, and you have to go around your elbow to get to your ear to avoid some of them.
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I had plan B C and D ready to go, depending on what was active or not. the 2 south moa's are listed as active during the week, and active on the weekends by notam. I did not see any notam for today but made sure to get flight following so I could confirm this with Fayetteville approach. they asked if I was RNAV equipped and then gave me direct RAEFO, direct 5W4, I just had to stay over KHFF Mackall's airspace before dropping down. if those 2 moa's are active, it's a whole different story lol.
 
Carolinaflyer said:
That airspace intimidates me a little.
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Nah! It's a decent field, I checked it out to use insfead of KFAY when visiting my in-laws, but declined since it's unfenced and the "on field restaurant" more closely resembled a bar, and I could imagine angry drunks and pickup trucks spilling onto the ramp and my plane . . . .

But it'd be good for a fly-in lunch, maybe overnight sleeping by the plane and drinking with the crowd in the bar. The field itself looked fine.

Nothing special to the airspace, if you can fly into FAY. Expect to stay above 4500 msl over Bragg and Mackall.
 
Stephen Poole said:
The Army's Golden Knights have trained at that airport for decades.
And yes, it IS surrounded by military stuff -- Ft. Bragg, Pope AFB. I was learning how to plot courses a while back, and you have to go around your elbow to get to your ear to avoid some of them.
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SkyDog58 said:
I thought the Knights practiced at Laurinburg (MEB).
Click to expand...

They have been a MEB for a loooooong time.

The airspace around 5W4 is benign as long as you avoid R5311A (which is Surface to 6000MSL but stays active from the surface to 4000MSL about 98% of the time.) The MOA around 5W4 are chart fillers...

We avoid the place around these parts as it is a skydiving airport...not surprising they were not all warm and fuzzy to you...

Killer side trip though...check out https://paracletexp.com/ Indoor skydiving....
 
Carolinaflyer said:
That airspace intimidates me a little.
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Yeah. I'm with you on that, especially if the MOAs are active. Probably lots of low-level choppers about. Are the C-130s operating out of Mackall (HFF)? I saw one flying low near there last year, after leaving BQ1. They were based at Pope AFB in Fayetteville for years.
 
N659HB said:
Yeah. I'm with you on that, especially if the MOAs are active. Probably lots of low-level choppers about. Are the C-130s operating out of Mackall (HFF)? I saw one flying low near there last year, after leaving BQ1. They were based at Pope AFB in Fayetteville for years.
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The MOAs are chart fillers...I have overflown 5W4 about 100 times going west...never...not once...was an MOA mentioned as active nor was any unusual traffic noted. The restricted area is where the action is. There is a new drone path from MacKall to the southwest corner of 5311. There are zero C130s based at Mackall...there may be zero a Pope AAF as well...

Fayetteville Approach and range control do a stellar job of keeping it all untangled...

Nothing to see here...carry on.
 
SkyDog58 said:
I thought the Knights practiced at Laurinburg (MEB).
Click to expand...

They practice at a lot of places, but I know that one of them is the Raeford Airport. I've watched them. :)

EDIT: OK, I didn't mean to imply that their primary base is at 5W4; it's (obviously) not. But the military in general, including the Golden Knights, have jumped there many times over the years. Like I said, I've watched them.
 
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well there ya go. kelvin says to just mozy on through, no need to check notams or be concerned at all! that should hold up when u bust airspace....."but kelvin said it's fine!". silly me to even think of checking before I went there!
 
Thanks for the prep. Hard to compete against BQ1, which isn't far away and not constrained by SUA.

It's funny that skydiving and regular old GA don't always get along, but us old codgers are probably as hostile to jumpers as they are to us. Honestly I love the energy that jumpers bring to a field and I don't mind the minor annoyance of avoiding the meat bombs.
 
SkyDog58 said:
I thought the Knights practiced at Laurinburg (MEB).
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Flew there on my long x/c. Asked FSS if they were jumping that day and was told they were not. But they were. Just one of several things distorted my seat cushion that day.
 
Kelvin said:
They have been a MEB for a loooooong time.
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Yep, Laurinburg-Maxton. I've been there many times as well. In addition to the Golden Knights, Charlotte Aircraft dismantles and scraps aircraft there.

Y'all are bringing back some memories here. I always thought that KMEB was kindof junky looking. The runway at Raeford (5W4, the OP's original subject) was apparently paved a few years ago. It was looking kind of long in the tooth, but they MUST be making some money. That thing shines now.
 
eman1200 said:
well there ya go. kelvin says to just mozy on through, no need to check notams or be concerned at all! that should hold up when u bust airspace....."but kelvin said it's fine!". silly me to even think of checking before I went there!
Click to expand...

Ha! You now have real insight into the area and how the airspace works on a daily basis...not just on paper....chew what you can chew and spit out the rest...
 
@Stephen Poole ...you grew up in Raeford? I grew up in the Hope Mills area...My family had a property in Arabia for about 20 years...my dad moved out there...got lonely and moved back in to town.

I know the Turf Farm...odd to see it mentioned on POA!
 
eman1200 said:
not sure how I never heard of this place before, as it's pretty close to me. I heard about it the other day and went to scope it out today. was thinking it might be a potential cool spot for a fly-in for the southeast folks to at least talk about going, if not maybe possibly actually going to. it looked like there'd be enough room to camp, and there's a bar/restaurant on the field. turns out it's a massive sky diving operation, and they actually aren't overly welcoming of GA. it's in the middle of several MOA's and extremely close to restricted airspace, which made the arrival fun (not bad, just gotta know what's going on). the restaurant serves breakfast all day, so I immediately liked them. anyways, quick vid link below.

anyone else find a NEW place to fly to?

5W4
Click to expand...

I've flown to a couple skydiving joints when they're jumping. Those adrenaline junkies are a fun crowd. This was my favorite, L65. Took some pics. Here's one.

DSCN1893.JPG
 
eman1200 said:
I had plan B C and D ready to go, depending on what was active or not. the 2 south moa's are listed as active during the week, and active on the weekends by notam. I did not see any notam for today but made sure to get flight following so I could confirm this with Fayetteville approach. they asked if I was RNAV equipped and then gave me direct RAEFO, direct 5W4, I just had to stay over KHFF Mackall's airspace before dropping down. if those 2 moa's are active, it's a whole different story lol.
Click to expand...

Ya probably wouldn't want to go if they wasn't jumpin that day. Restaurant/bar would probably be closed if they weren't. If they be a jumpin I don't think the MOA's are going to be a MOA'ing
 
I was curious if there had been accidents involving skydivers and airplanes. I found one from 1993 (NYTimes) that killed 4 people in the airplane: "A sky diver collided with a plane more than a mile above the ground on Sunday, causing a crash that killed the four people aboard the aircraft, the authorities said today. The parachutist was hospitalized with a broken ankle." I do recall seeing this one previously as well: https://www.cnn.com/2014/03/08/us/plane-skydiver-collision/
 
Challenged said:
I was curious if there had been accidents involving skydivers and airplanes. I found one from 1993 (NYTimes) that killed 4 people in the airplane: "A sky diver collided with a plane more than a mile above the ground on Sunday, causing a crash that killed the four people aboard the aircraft, the authorities said today. The parachutist was hospitalized with a broken ankle." I do recall seeing this one previously as well: https://www.cnn.com/2014/03/08/us/plane-skydiver-collision/
Click to expand...

And then there is this:

 
Kelvin said:
@Stephen Poole ...you grew up in Raeford? I grew up in the Hope Mills area...My family had a property in Arabia for about 20 years...my dad moved out there...got lonely and moved back in to town.

I know the Turf Farm...odd to see it mentioned on POA!
Click to expand...

Born in Pinehurst, family lived in Raeford. Watched fireworks every 4th of July in either Aberdeen or Hope Mills. Where in Arabia? I lived on Arabia Road for while myself. (And yes, it was great fun to tell people "I'm from Arabia!") :)

Spent many days at the Raeford airport watching the parachutes float down. I went to High School with Paul Thacker's daughter, Kim, who was pretty dang close to drop-dead gorgeous. My first big job as a radio engineer was at WEWO/WSTS Laurinburg, not far from MEB. The consultant who designed the new directional site for WEWO back in the 70's owned a plane (a Piper? can't remember now!) and would fly into MEB to check on the work.

As for Carolina Turf, my uncle started that. He's the original pilot of the family, took me for my first plane ride in that old J3. I haven't lived in that area for decades, so I'm going on memory, but I believe my cousin bases the aforementioned airplanes at his late father-in-law's private airstrip (I believe it's listed as Viking -- you can see it in Google Earth, little grass strip). Not far from 5W4.

(For everyone else, when threads pop up here about "flying for business," that's why I'll sometimes chime in when some folks flatly try to discourage the OP's idea. I knew a bunch of people who routinely flew small planes for business when I was growing up. My uncle flew his tail-dragger Cessna 180 for business and never had an incident. IFR-rated, he was an excellent pilot. He flew the living daylights out of that thing.)
 
[QUOTE="Brad Z, post: 2655663, member: Honestly I love the energy that jumpers bring to a field and I don't mind the minor annoyance of avoiding the meat bombs.[/QUOTE]

I'm not about to start another "Is GA Dying?" thread, but the reason why 5W4 is so big on jumping is because it brings in revenue ... far more than if it was a "classic" airstrip, diner and fuel. If you become a popular jumping destination (which Raeford has been for decades, so close to Ft. Bragg and the 82nd Airborne), you can make a very good living.

I *believe* (going on a 50-year old memory!) that Paul Thacker, the guy who bought and upgraded 5W4, was a former paratrooper. He made that little airport quite profitable. And yes, I know I've watched the Golden Knights there, many years ago, as well as many, many other military jumps. Every weekend, it's a hoot to watch all the chutes drifting down from the sky over that place.

To the OP, if they seemed "hostile" to you, that's just because they didn't want an incident. (You're certainly smart enough to know that, forgive me for stating the obvious). They charge $16-30 (roughly) for each jump, and they want their planes in the air, filled with meat, generating revenue.
 
Stephen Poole said:
...To the OP, if they seemed "hostile" to you, that's just because they didn't want an incident. (You're certainly smart enough to know that, forgive me for stating the obvious). They charge $16-30 (roughly) for each jump, and they want their planes in the air, filled with meat, generating revenue.
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oh I totally understood once I hung out there for a bit and spoke to some of the peeps there. first of all, the guy who manages the restaurant was extremely nice and gave me a bunch of history about the place. it was very interesting. you can clearly see in the restaurant how it's grown from basically a hot dog stand to having 3 or 4 additions added on throughout the years. some cool memorabilia hanging on the wall and he talked about how much more there was but it's all going to a museum somewhere.

after talking with a few other folks it was clear that they are there for jumping and that's it. it was just weird to me because there are other places (like RUQ, the airport formerly known as rowan county) that does jumping non-stop but they are just as much a GA airport. so it was odd when I was telling them about how potentially a whole lot of us would talk about flying in there (although not actually do it) and possibly bring them some other money (ie beer, camping, restaurant) they were like "meh, we don't care, really, we got enough money coming in elsewhere". threw me for a loop but it's all good. and don't get me wrong, I'd go back there again for lunch. I just don't think I'd try to organize a lunch meet up there. as for the airspace, having never been there before, it was overly concerning. after flying in there, I would STILL double check everything but it ended up being a non-event, as I stated in the first post. and my recommendation to people would be to have a solid understanding of the airspace, not to just say "eff it, some guy on the internet said don't worry about it", that's just idiotic.
 
eman1200 said:
oh I totally understood once I hung out there for a bit and spoke to some of the peeps there. first of all, the guy who manages the restaurant was extremely nice and gave me a bunch of history about the place. it was very interesting. you can clearly see in the restaurant how it's grown from basically a hot dog stand to having 3 or 4 additions added on throughout the years. some cool memorabilia hanging on the wall and he talked about how much more there was but it's all going to a museum somewhere.

after talking with a few other folks it was clear that they are there for jumping and that's it. it was just weird to me because there are other places (like RUQ, the airport formerly known as rowan county) that does jumping non-stop but they are just as much a GA airport. so it was odd when I was telling them about how potentially a whole lot of us would talk about flying in there (although not actually do it) and possibly bring them some other money (ie beer, camping, restaurant) they were like "meh, we don't care, really, we got enough money coming in elsewhere". threw me for a loop but it's all good. and don't get me wrong, I'd go back there again for lunch. I just don't think I'd try to organize a lunch meet up there. as for the airspace, having never been there before, it was overly concerning. after flying in there, I would STILL double check everything but it ended up being a non-event, as I stated in the first post. and my recommendation to people would be to have a solid understanding of the airspace, not to just say "eff it, some guy on the internet said don't worry about it", that's just idiotic.
Click to expand...

What frequencies did you use there? The AF/D has the CTAF as 123.0. In the Remarks it says monitor 123.5 for jumping activity.
 
luvflyin said:
What frequencies did you use there? The AF/D has the CTAF as 123.0. In the Remarks it says monitor 123.5 for jumping activity.
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yup, that's another thing the jumper guys got snooty about. they said the freq is 123.5 and I said oh, they have 2 listed, sounds like one for "us" and the other for jumpers that we need to listen to and they were like NO it's 123.5. regardless, it's posted like you said so I was announcing on 123 and monitoring 123.5.
 
Sort of reminds me of the differences between Skydive Chicago (8N2) and Rochelle Airport (RPJ). Both have very active jump operations. The folks at Rochelle warmly welcome other GA traffic. However at Skydive Chicago which is privately owned but listed as open to the public, they seem to prefer you not come. Which was always fine by me as RPJ has much better food.
 
eman1200 said:
oh I totally understood once I hung out there for a bit and spoke to some of the peeps there. first of all, the guy who manages the restaurant was extremely nice and gave me a bunch of history about the place. it was very interesting. you can clearly see in the restaurant how it's grown from basically a hot dog stand to having 3 or 4 additions added on throughout the years. some cool memorabilia hanging on the wall and he talked about how much more there was but it's all going to a museum somewhere.

after talking with a few other folks it was clear that they are there for jumping and that's it. it was just weird to me because there are other places (like RUQ, the airport formerly known as rowan county) that does jumping non-stop but they are just as much a GA airport. so it was odd when I was telling them about how potentially a whole lot of us would talk about flying in there (although not actually do it) and possibly bring them some other money (ie beer, camping, restaurant) they were like "meh, we don't care, really, we got enough money coming in elsewhere". threw me for a loop but it's all good. and don't get me wrong, I'd go back there again for lunch. I just don't think I'd try to organize a lunch meet up there. as for the airspace, having never been there before, it was overly concerning. after flying in there, I would STILL double check everything but it ended up being a non-event, as I stated in the first post. and my recommendation to people would be to have a solid understanding of the airspace, not to just say "eff it, some guy on the internet said don't worry about it", that's just idiotic.
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Wow, never heard of an airport discouraging pilots from flying in. So I guess I won't.

As for "new" restaurants, there was a fly-in fish camp in the area that I heard about when I lived in Laurinburg. Anybody know if it's still around? So many things disappeared during the 2008-11 recession, and despite my searching, there were no Flight Instructors at KMEB when I lived there and had time / money available (mid-90s).
 
eman1200 said:
yup, that's another thing the jumper guys got snooty about. they said the freq is 123.5 and I said oh, they have 2 listed, sounds like one for "us" and the other for jumpers that we need to listen to and they were like NO it's 123.5. regardless, it's posted like you said so I was announcing on 123 and monitoring 123.5.
Click to expand...

Seems like the jumpers need to be educated on the two frequencies and their use. Everything that I see published is that 123.0 is CTAF and 123.5 is to monitor parachute ops. Something tells me that while the jump operation is communicating on 123.5, they neither monitor nor care about CTAF (123.0). This is an accident waiting to happen in my opinion. I have no idea what they expect a pilot with a single comm to do.
 
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