New Information On MH 370

Silvaire said:
Well there's the Immarsat data analysis, the amount of fuel on board and the FACT that there's nothing else out there other than The Indian Ocean.

Unless you're claiming that those guys are just full of it and have no idea what they are doing because I'm sure you know as much about that stuff as they do and you're not buying it, right? :rolleyes2:
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I am claiming that ,,, barring finding verifiable wreckage........ That plane could be anywhere....:yes:
 
N801BH said:
I am claiming that ,,, barring finding verifiable wreckage........ That plane could be anywhere....:yes:
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How, when the data determined it to be out there with not enough fuel to possibly get anywhere else? We're talking about the laws of physics here...:dunno:
 
Silvaire said:
How, when the data determined it to be out there with not enough fuel to possibly get anywhere else? We're talking about the laws of physics here...:dunno:
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Is this verifiable DATA .... Or just a theory based on the reception of a weak sigal in a parabolic antenna... Did the receive antenna have a prime focus feedhorn, or a cassagrain feed horn.. Has it been proven the incoming signal was not actually a weak sidelope and the theoretical arc is accurate ?

Where along this suggested arc does the plane lie.. Why are they "assuming" it is in the Indian Ocean and not in the northern section of the arc???
 
N801BH said:
Is this verifiable DATA .... Or just a theory based on the reception of a weak sigal in a parabolic antenna... Did the receive antenna have a prime focus feedhorn, or a cassagrain feed horn.. Has it been proven the incoming signal was not actually a weak sidelope and the theoretical arc is accurate ?

Where along this suggested arc does the plane lie.. Why are they "assuming" it is in the Indian Ocean and not in the northern section of the arc???
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The round trip time of the pings was known (knowing the time is part of the protocol they use,) so they knew the jet was somewhere on the surface of a sphere of known radius centered on the satellite. Where that sphere intersected the earth's sphere generated the arc that was published. The width of the arc was likely less than one light millisecond wide at worst (300 km).

It turns out that doppler affects have to be taken into account by the Inmarsat satellites because they would otherwise cause loss of comms, so they do track and correct for doppler shifts. They compared the recorded shifts with shifts from planes whose direction of travel they knew, and found them to be consistent with a southern route.

Here is a summary:

http://www.malaysiaairlines.com/content/dam/mas/master/en/pdf/Information_provided_to_MH370_investigation_by_UK_Air_Accidents_Investigation_Branch_Updated.pdf

Annex with images mentioned in above document:
http://www.malaysiaairlines.com/content/dam/mas/master/en/pdf/Annex_I_images.pdf
The signal strength wasn't used in determining the arc. So the nature of the antenna lobes is irrelevant.
 
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Jim Logajan said:
The round trip time of the pings was known (knowing the time is part of the protocol they use,) so they knew the jet was somewhere on the surface of a sphere of known radius centered on the satellite. Where that sphere intersected the earth's sphere generated the arc that was published. The width of the arc was likely less than one light millisecond wide at worst (300 km).

It turns out that doppler affects have to be taken into account by the Inmarsat satellites because they would otherwise cause loss of comms, so they do track and correct for doppler shifts. They compared the recorded shifts with shifts from planes whose direction of travel they knew, and found them to be consistent with a southern route.

Here is a summary:

http://www.malaysiaairlines.com/con...ir_Accidents_Investigation_Branch_Updated.pdf

Annex with images mentioned in above document:
http://www.malaysiaairlines.com/content/dam/mas/master/en/pdf/Annex_I_images.pdf
The signal strength wasn't used in determining the arc. So the nature of the antenna lobes is irrelevant.
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I figured it was a timing calculation but the beam width might have validated their wild ass guess a bit more.....

The whole thing is suspect though as they are basing their conclusion on another wild ass guess... "They compared the recorded shifts with shifts from planes whose direction of travel they knew,"

So, I want to see it proven beyond reasonable doubt that they actually know "direction of travel"... IMHO..
 
N747JB said:
I'm guessing IF they find any parts or pieces on the bottom of the ocean, the rest will be fairly close by. ;) Even if it exploded when it hit the water, the parts and debris will be within a defined circle, with the expection of things that floated away. Even with the floating debris, they can figure an area to search based on the wind and tides.
If it's ever found, it will be based on luck as much as science.;)
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The luck window is over, if they find it now, it will be due to dogged determination and methodical search patterns run with a tow fish.
 
Silvaire said:
How, when the data determined it to be out there with not enough fuel to possibly get anywhere else? We're talking about the laws of physics here...:dunno:
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What data? Yeah, we have information from some source that indicates it might be in the Indian Ocean. But that information is suspect in a lot of minds. If that data is in fact invalid, then the airplane in fact COULD be anywhere.
 
Help me. I always thought a modern sub like we have, was so sensitive it could pick some breaking wind under the Britney deep. Could this have been employed early on and maybe found the plane thru the beeper?
 
I don't think submarine is better equipped for this kind of work than the specialized towed pinger locator (TPL) with the processor/receiver on board a ship. The TPL was lowered in this case to 6000 ft - far deeper than such submarine could dive to. And at that depth you far isolated from your "own" noises whereas even a quietest submarine is not exactly a totally silent environment.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
Help me. I always thought a modern sub like we have, was so sensitive it could pick some breaking wind under the Britney deep. Could this have been employed early on and maybe found the plane thru the beeper?
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Well even if it could it would have to be where the "breaking wind" occurred at the time it happened. I think that most people sitting in front of their computer monitors have absolutely no concept of the vastness that the "southern Indian Ocean" encompasses.
 
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