Microsoft Surface

I'm interested. I'm looking for something comparable to the ipad, both in the airplane and out. I don't think there is anything just yet though.
 
I find the Windows 8 previews I've seen (which is the basis of this things GUI) pretty disgusting. On the other hand it looks like some of the features are pretty cool. Depends on how bad Microsoft screws it up.

If it is anything like WINCE and it's successors, you'll have to deal with things taking up a bit more space and needing a little faster processor. On the other had, you're likely to get your favorite windows app moved over quicker as the software environment is much closer to desktop windows (almost a clone) than iOS is to OS/X (which really aren't much the same at all).
 
Nice, I'll wait to see if it turns into a Zune or not. Microsoft and primary hardware haven't really built a reputation yet.
 
Apps? Seems like the killer app for aviation is Foreflight. Is that going to run on this?
 
Ghery said:
That was my thought, as well. If there aren't good aviation apps, forget about it.
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Aviation apps I'm not that concerned with anymore, I'd like the machine to be able to handle files. I've given up on these for cockpit until they improve the view ability and that will probably require more power than the market will bear given the typical use of these devices.
 
I am currently running Windows 8 (Release Preview) on my laptop, which has a touch screen. For that, I like it. Not so sure if I'd like it without a touch screen. I've just installed the Release Preview (upgrading from the Consumer Preview, and before that Dev Preview). Since I have JUST installed it (not all of my software is back on the PC), I haven't really had a chance to play with it to tell what's new in this version, but the Consumer Preview was a significant improvement over the Dev Preview version.

What I like about the idea of it on a tablet over the iPad is that there will be many different devices out there, with different sizes and specs, so there will be more variety to choose from, than if I want an iPad with 3G or without. This will lend itself to being able to meet the needs of different people at different pricepoints. For me, I willl be wanting a higher end device than the typical consumer, but not everyone needs that power (I have 8GB RAM and a touchscreen in my laptop ;)).

BTW, the down side of using a laptop with a touchscreen is that when I sit down at my computer at work, I can't get the screen to respond... ;)

I have previously (a couple months ago) inquired of Foreflight whether they'd have a Windows 8 version of foreflight, and their answer was the typical boilerplate reply: "We have not announced a Windows version of Foreflight." Literally, that was the whole reply.

I'm waiting to see what comes out, but I am optimistic.
 
Henning said:
Don't forget keyboards...;)
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Those too.

As for the Surface, I'd have to try one. I simply don't know that I have any use for it. I'd be willing to make a trip to Paterson (note the one "t" in Paterson) to look at and touch one at MicroCenter, though. I'm open-minded.

But then again, there's really no "bad" reason to visit MicroCenter; and if I'm going to drive > 100 miles to visit one of the three MicroCenters within a reasonable distance from me, it's going to be the one in Paterson. I don't have to cross the Hudson (nor pay the toll), and the sales tax in Paterson is only 3.5% compare to > 8% in Yonkers or Westbury.

But I digress. Back to the subject at hand, I've used a few iPads, and I wasn't sufficiently impressed to go buy one. I've also used Samsung's tablet thingy, and neither was I sufficiently impressed with that device to trade money for it (not to mention the Galaxy's added disadvantage of running an OS made by Google, whom I have come to passionately detest).

I just don't find tablets very useful, is what it comes down to. But this new one from MS might just have enough added functionality beyond that of the present market leaders to make me consider one.

-Rich
 
Henning said:
Aviation apps I'm not that concerned with anymore, I'd like the machine to be able to handle files. I've given up on these for cockpit until they improve the view ability and that will probably require more power than the market will bear given the typical use of these devices.
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If you're expecting to be disappointed with regard to Windows 8 devices, you're going to be disappointed ;). Some of what is coming is going to be really neat. Last year at TechEd, I think it was, M$ gave away tablet devices to all attendees. I don't remember the specs, because I was not one of those lucky attendees, but I have handled a couple, and they are impressive, even with technology that is now a year old.

<edit: On second thought, I don't think it was TechEd. I think it was MIX. >
 
I expect nothing anymore and enjoy being pleasantly surprised when I actually get something. :D
 
hopmedic said:
That's a good philosophy. :D
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It's the same as realizing 80% of everybody is stupid and incompetent. When something stupid and incompetent happens, I'm expecting it and just deal with it without being upset. If someone proves competent I get to be pleasantly surprised.
 
Henning said:
I expect nothing anymore and enjoy being pleasantly surprised when I actually get something. :D
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Heh... either you've changed your ways, or I imagined all those rants about Apple products. ;)

Or did their awful products break your will to live? :)
 
denverpilot said:
Heh... either you've changed your ways, or I imagined all those rants about Apple products. ;)

Or did their awful products break your will to live? :)
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I never said I wouldn't complain if they fail to deliver to their hype. If I pay for the product I also payed for the right to point out how they have failed.
 
Henning said:
I never said I wouldn't complain if they fail to deliver to their hype. If I pay for the product I also payed for the right to point out how they have failed.
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I agree. That's one of the reasons I love MicroCenter. One of the official, perfectly acceptable reasons for returning a purchase for a refund is simply that "The product did not perform as I expected it to."

Assuming that the return is made within the quite reasonable time frame (which varies by product type) and is accompanied by the original packaging and all the included literature and doodads, that phrase will result in an immediate refund, an apology, and (on occasion) a managers' discount on an alternative product.

That's another reason why if I do decide to give the Surface a try, I'll make the long trip and buy it at MicroCenter in Paterson (with one "t").

-Rich
 
They have a ready-made business application base (Windows apps). The early adoption will probably be to leverage these applications and create a relatively low cost mobility solution for many business applications (little or no development required).
 
John221us said:
They have a ready-made business application base (Windows apps). The early adoption will probably be to leverage these applications and create a relatively low cost mobility solution for many business applications (little or no development required).
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It will sell well just due to having the MS Office suite.
 
Then, if people like it, there's that chance that they will either upgrade their laptop/desktop OS to Win8, or buy a new computer with Win8. Then there's the phone.... The same experience on all three devices is probably a pretty good strategy. I've been using a Windows Phone for over a year now, and I love it.
 
I can't wait to buy one. Probably will get the Win 8 Pro version vs the RT/ARM setup. I'll give my iPad away. I'm also looking forward to getting the Windows 8 version on the cell phone which should be out this fall. Then I can get rid of my Motorola Android.
I'll do without Foreflight if I have to.
 
hopmedic said:
Then, if people like it, there's that chance that they will either upgrade their laptop/desktop OS to Win8, or buy a new computer with Win8. Then there's the phone.... The same experience on all three devices is probably a pretty good strategy. I've been using a Windows Phone for over a year now, and I love it.
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Many years before Apple made an iPhone Siemens made the Pocket PC Phone Edition which I completely loved and it did everything I wanted it to do using Win CE. The only issue I had with it was the touch screen wasn't sweat proof and if I talked on it while sweating all the tap spots would be a half a centimeter off diagonally and I had to wait for it to dry before I could tap on the left side buttons. Outside of that it had Word and Excell from which I could fill out my billing and reports onboard a boat while on the way to the dock, e-mail it in and my check would be waiting in my box when I arrived regardless what time it was.
 
Henning said:
Many years before Apple made an iPhone Siemens made the Pocket PC Phone Edition which I completely loved and it did everything I wanted it to do using Win CE. The only issue I had with it was the touch screen wasn't sweat proof and if I talked on it while sweating all the tap spots would be a half a centimeter off diagonally and I had to wait for it to dry before I could tap on the left side buttons. Outside of that it had Word and Excell from which I could fill out my billing and reports onboard a boat while on the way to the dock, e-mail it in and my check would be waiting in my box when I arrived regardless what time it was.
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I used Windows CE / Windows Mobile phones for several years before there ever was an iPhone. I love how people say MS copied Apple......

I also developed some solutions for the manufacturing plant that I worked in at the time, using Windows CE / Windows Mobile devices with wi-fi to the database, including devices with barcode scanning and RFID read/write devices on them. Now that was some fun stuff, there. ;)
 
Never tried that... I was developing WinCE apps at work, so I tested on my own phone a lot, too.
 
Rich: I think it was at BUILD 2011 that MS gave away the Samsung developer tablets.

I've owned a 3 TabletPCs since 2003. I'm a digital artist so the iPad generation of tablets was a giant step backwards for me. I didn't care to finger paint. If I were to get a tablet it would be a Win 8 (intel) tablet. I'm not convinced I have a legit use case for it since between my WP7 and desktop I've got everything covered except maybe e-book reading.

I finally got Win 8 Release Preview working on my Lenovo X200T tabletpc this weekend. Wacom Pen. No touch. It works well enough, but navigating with the stylus is better than using a mouse and not as good as swiping with a finger. Also have trouble reaching the corner hotspots because the stylus calibration just isn't precise at the very edges.

Windows 8 RP is fast to start up cold and from sleep. I've had Vista and Win 7 on this same machine - all aggressively optimized - and Windows 8 out of the box is the clear winner without me doing anything. My 2008 laptop is now performing faster than it was when it was new. That alone gives me confidence that something is going right here.
 
That's what it was - BUILD. Thanks. Couldn't get my old brain to think of it.

I've never owned a tablet before, but I've handled a few iPads, and I can't tell you what it is, but it just doesn't appeal to me. Nothing against Apple, as I taught myself BASIC on an Apple ][ back in the day, but the iPad just doesn't do it for me.

Yes, Win8 does start fast. :) My PC has 8GB RAM, an i7, 8GB SD card for the Ready Boost, and the PC starts from cold in under 15 seconds. SWEET.

The place I used to work had gotten me an MSDN license, so I've been using cutting edge for years, but since I don't have that anymore, it looks like I might just have to buy a copy of Win8 Pro and Visual Studio when it comes out. ;)

Yes, I think Microsoft has a definite winner with this OS. I'm looking forward to getting my first tablet, as I've been pretty happy with Win8 so far on my laptop, and the shared experience of the desktop, phone, and tablet will be a winner with me.

I'm not a pilot yet, but I sure do hope that Foreflight comes out for Win8 RT. I would expect to see it, since I would expect to see Windows tablets catch on due to the prolific use of Windows on the desktop.
 
hopmedic said:
I used Windows CE / Windows Mobile phones for several years before there ever was an iPhone. I love how people say MS copied Apple......
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Well Apple certainly didn't copy Microsoft's phone(s). The iPhone was a radical 180 that Microsoft completely laughed at.
 
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The WINCE browser sucked badly compared to Safari on the phone. Absent a few sites that made lowres mobi versions, it was pretty awful. The mail app wasn't too bad.
 
Henning said:
Nice, I'll wait to see if it turns into a Zune or not. Microsoft and primary hardware haven't really built a reputation yet.
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Aviation related: their Sidewinder Force Feedback joystick has gotten pretty good reviews; but I don't know whether they are still building them or not (you can still buy them though from various places, such as via Amazon.) The Wikipedia article says MS discontinued the Sidewinder product line in 2003 but restarted it in 2007.
 
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jesse said:
Well Apple certainly didn't copy Microsoft's phone(s). The iPhone was a radical 180 that Microsoft completely laughed at.
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What I didn't say: Apple copied MS.
What I AM saying: When MS came up with a phone, it wasn't to copy Apple. They were SEVERAL years ahead of Apple.
 
flyingron said:
The WINCE browser sucked badly compared to Safari on the phone. Absent a few sites that made lowres mobi versions, it was pretty awful. The mail app wasn't too bad.
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Yes, it was pretty bad. But it was the only thing out there for a while. It was better than what Apple had at the time. ;)
 
jesse said:
Well Apple certainly didn't copy Microsoft's phone(s). The iPhone was a radical 180 that Microsoft completely laughed at.
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Microsoft never made a phone that I know of. I need a phone as a communication device and that includes emailing files that industry says have to be Excel. I wasn't really looking for an entertainment device. That was the difference with the iPhone, it was designed to be an entertainment device with a phone in it.
 
Henning said:
Microsoft never made a phone that I know of. I need a phone as a communication device and that includes emailing files that industry says have to be Excel. I wasn't really looking for an entertainment device. That was the difference with the iPhone, it was designed to be an entertainment device with a phone in it.
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No, MS didn't make phones. They made the OS. If I said or implied, my mistake. :redface:
If you're currently looking for a phone that will handle Excel, Windows Phone has Office and can open and edit (to limited extent) Excel and Word files, and can open/display PowerPoint, as well as having OneNote if you use that.
 
I'm good on equipment at the moment, but I'm hopeful on the Win8 platform for my next round replacements.
 
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