KART VOR 7 question

[rookie1255]

Coming from the north and crossing the ART VOR IAF, how long do you fly the 223 radial until starting the procedure turn?

 

[Joshuajayg]

I would fly about 2 minutes if I was doing 100kts (winds permitting.)

The directions say "remain within 10nm"

 

[roncachamp]

Coming from the north and crossing the ART VOR IAF, how long do you fly the 223 radial until starting the procedure turn?

At whatever point you feel will leave you with sufficient room on the R-223 inbound to establish a good track on it and descend, if needed, but not more than ten miles.

 

[flyingron]

Steve is, of course, right. There's nothing the least bit unusual about this approach. The PT Barb leaves it up to the pilot not only when to commence the PT, but what sort of course reversal to make. You may wish to review the instrument procedures handbook, especially chapter 4. https://www.faa.gov/regulations_pol...ument_procedures_handbook/media/Chapter_4.pdf

On U.S. Government charts, a barbed arrow indicates the maneuvering side of the outbound course on which the procedure turn is made. Headings are provided for course reversal using the 45° type procedure turn. However, the point at which the turn may be commenced and the type and rate of turn is left to the discretion of the pilot (limited by the charted remain within XX NM distance).​

It's also in 5-4-9 of the AIM:

On U.S. Government charts, a barbed arrow indicates the maneuvering side of the outbound course on which the procedure turn is made. Headings are provided for course reversal using the 45 degree type procedure turn. However, the point at which the turn may be commenced and the type and rate of turn is left to the discretion of the pilot (limited by the charted remain within xx NM distance). Some of the options are the 45 degree procedure turn, the racetrack pattern, the teardrop procedure turn, or the 80 degree 260 degree course reversal. Racetrack entries should be conducted on the maneuvering side where the majority of protected airspace resides. If an entry places the pilot on the non−maneuvering side of the PT, correction to intercept the outbound course ensures remaining within protected airspace. Some procedure turns are specified by procedural track. These turns must be flown exactly as depicted.

​

 

[somorris]

Hi Rookie 1255.

It is up to the pilot. When i was training, I was taught to fly outbound 1 minute then start the turn. In the approach example, flying outbound, I would turn right to intercept the inbound course. That usually allowed ample time in a Cessna 172/182 speed airplane to get established inbound. like Joshua said, though, it you went out two minutes you would have more time to get established and still stay within the limit, usually 10 miles.

 

[flyingron]

If you don't make an estimate for the winds, you should. If the winds are blowing strong from the SW, for example, you may wish to delay that turn.

It's a point of discussion whether you should make your inbound turn towards the approach or away from it. I've got my opinions but they're not particularly compelling. I'll sit back with my bowl of popcorn while people argue that point.

 

[jaybee]

depends on the wind and depends on the speed of the aircraft you are flying would be the all encompassing "correct answer" the usually given advice is 2 - 4 minutes out bound

 

[Gucci Pilot]

In a 172 doing 90 knots I just do 1 minute.

If I am flying the approach at 90 knots no wind:

Fly outbound 1 minute(1.5 miles)
turn 45 degrees off for 1 minute(about 1.1 miles)
Standard rate 180 degree turn(about a .5 mile radius)

Should be able to do the course reversal only going out 3.1 miles.

30 knot tailwind going outbound and want to fly outbound 2 minutes?:

Outbound 2 minute (4 miles)
turn 45 degrees off for 1 minute(about 1.4 miles)
Radius(.6 miles)
Total miles outbound = 6

 

[luvflyin]

All of the above. And I'll fly a little longer outbound also, staying within 10 miles of course, if I've gotten a little behind and could use a little more time to get caught up. Or I just want more time to get established on the inbound leg because the winds are squirrelly.

 

[forseth11]

I would personally do this at 60 seconds, but you can do it with what ever time you want to keep you within 10nm of ART VORTAC as shown on the IAP.