Into the FRZ...

gprellwitz said:
My understanding is that you have to do the video AFTER you've done the fingerprinting. Why? I have no idea.:dunno::dunno::dunno:

So it's:
1) airport
2) FSDO at Dulles, since I'm transient
3) fingerprinting at Reagan
4) back to airport
:eek:
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I thought you had to visit the FSDO that controls the airport you wish to get vetted for, so CGS is Baltimore, and the other two are Dulles. Am I getting this correct ?
 
All the FSDO does is run a check of your records - validates that your certs are valid and not suspended and none of the violations that would render you unFRZworthy. I _THINK_ either FSDO can do it regardless of the airport you are going to "base" at.
 
jdwatson said:
I thought you had to visit the FSDO that controls the airport you wish to get vetted for, so CGS is Baltimore, and the other two are Dulles. Am I getting this correct ?
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According to the document on AOPA (linked to earlier),
Potomac Airfield, Washington Executive/Hyde Field, and transient flight operations applicants should contact the Washington FSDO
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(emphasis mine)
 
My eyes are rolling to the back of my skull. Let me get this straight -- we're talking about the USA here, right?

This process sounds like the kind of bureaucratic nightmare we used to run into all the time in COMMUNIST POLAND back in the early 70's. Probably the same went for the USSR, GDR, etc.

Three different lines for one end result, but we've improved upon the communist model. They were dumb enough to (usually) have all the lines in the same building. No, we've used good old Yankee ingenuity and placed the 3 lines in 3 different geographic locations!

I sent in my complaint about the ADIZ. I guess I had better fire up the rant machine again and complain to my "government representatives" about this silly process. Not that it'll matter. Heck, I'd love to fly into College Park, but I'm a stay-at-home dad in suburban Philly -- I can't just bop down and spend a day doing this idiotic waltz to get approved for a $100 burger run.

Cheers to those of you who have taken the time and energy to get certified. I wish more of us could. Then maybe we could have a POA fly-b-q at the CP airport....
 
flyersfan31 said:
My eyes are rolling to the back of my skull. Let me get this straight -- we're talking about the USA here, right?
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I am 100% convinced that part of the reason the process is set up this way is to intentionally discourage folks from applying for the ability to fly into the FRZ.
 
To be honest, there is NO logical reason I can think of that we should have to go to DC to set this up in the first place anyway! Except, of course, for the one Bill pointed out.
I am 100% convinced that part of the reason the process is set up this way is to intentionally discourage folks from applying for the ability to fly into the FRZ.
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You should be able to go to your "local" FSDO and/or TSA office to take care of this! (Yeah, easy for me to say in the Chicago area. How about those who are a couple hundred miles from their nearest FSDO?)
 
Grant,
gprellwitz said:
According to the document on AOPA (linked to earlier), (emphasis mine)
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I skipped right over that because I was thinking about going to CGS. I'm going to be in DC towards the end of the month, perhaps I'll try to get this done then. I'll be flying into Dulles so this works out. Thanks for bring that to my attention.
 
jdwatson said:
Grant,


I skipped right over that because I was thinking about going to CGS. I'm going to be in DC towards the end of the month, perhaps I'll try to get this done then. I'll be flying into Dulles so this works out. Thanks for bring that to my attention.
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You're welcome. Let us know how it works out! (I didn't do it while I was there).
 
I went to the FSDO at BWI as a "transient pilot" and all they did was look up my record on the FAA database. I didn't even have to show my medical. They verified it online.
 
I'm hoping to use CGS for future trips after getting vetted. I hear it's very close to the Metro, and from there I can get to RFK stadium.

I'll let y'all know how it goes. Hopefully smoothly.
 
jdwatson said:
I'm hoping to use CGS for future trips after getting vetted. I hear it's very close to the Metro, and from there I can get to RFK stadium.
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It's about an eight minute walk from your airplane to the Metro Station.
 
RE: CGS

I can no longer recommend the 94th Aero Squadron as a place to eat.

Last time there (aside from no traffic to watch on the runway), we had an infestation of ants on the table, less than stellar service, flies, out of a couple of menu items, and improperly set table. There were very few people in the restaurant (mid-week, dinner/evening meal).

Can't say I recommend it for the price paid.
YMMV
 
It just goes to show the devastating effect the FRZ has had on a place like that, no pilots to go there, few people eating there, etc.
 
tdager said:
It just goes to show the devastating effect the FRZ has had on a place like that, no pilots to go there, few people eating there, etc.
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Ah, that place was terrible back when I was working at the airport, long before the FRZ.
 
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wsuffa said:
RE: CGS

I can no longer recommend the 94th Aero Squadron as a place to eat.

Last time there (aside from no traffic to watch on the runway), we had an infestation of ants on the table, less than stellar service, flies, out of a couple of menu items, and improperly set table. There were very few people in the restaurant (mid-week, dinner/evening meal).

Can't say I recommend it for the price paid.
YMMV
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Dan and I went the 94th Aero Squadron at PWK. It achieved OK status - nothing to make a trip for. We saw some bizjets taxiing on the far side of the field.

The only fun stuff is the B-17 and P-51 replicas out front and the P-38 in the back yard. Ya know. WWI planes to match the theme. :rolleyes:
 
mikea said:
Dan and I went the 94th Aero Squadron at PWK. It achieved OK status - nothing to make a trip for. We saw some bizjets taxiing on the far side of the field.

The only fun stuff is the B-17 and P-51 replicas out front and the P-38 in the back yard. Ya know. WWI planes to match the theme. :rolleyes:
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If you're gong to eat around PWK, pop over to Bob Chinn's Crabhouse. Ultra-high-volume, but IIRC he at least keeps (or used to) a couple of planes at PWK Not that he flies himself, but to bring the fish in.

I agree, the 94th Aero Squadron at PWK is nothing to write home about, though it's been a couple of years since I ate there.
 
gprellwitz said:
If you're gong to eat around PWK, pop over to Bob Chinn's Crabhouse. Ultra-high-volume, but IIRC he at least keeps (or used to) a couple of planes at PWK Not that he flies himself, but to bring the fish in.

I agree, the 94th Aero Squadron at PWK is nothing to write home about, though it's been a couple of years since I ate there.
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Bob Chin's is great. I have not been to the one in downtown Chicago, only the one on Milwaukee Ave not too far from Palwaukee. Lunches are great deal and don't forget the Mai Tai's. I worked not to far from there and man I had a lot of those great Mai Tais on Friday lunches!
 
Latest FRZ experience...

KEZF to KFME: I filed IFR, expecting a 35 minute flight at 130 knots at 3000.

On Clearance, routing issued is: BRV --> TAPPA --> PXT --> LOUIE --> Direct FME

Total flight time? 1.1 hours.

Yikes.
 
dmccormack said:
On Clearance, routing issued is: BRV --> TAPPA --> PXT --> LOUIE --> Direct FME
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Yow. I can see routing via PXT to avoid the worst of the DC traffic and ADIZ, but why the BRV->TAPPA part?! That seems a long way out of the way to avoid not a lot of anything.
 
jmaynard said:
Yow. I can see routing via PXT to avoid the worst of the DC traffic and ADIZ, but why the BRV->TAPPA part?! That seems a long way out of the way to avoid not a lot of anything.
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To avoid the DCA arrivals from the south and the Dahlgren gunnery range R-area. If you're operating IFR, they have to take you all the way around south of both.
 
Ron Levy said:
To avoid the DCA arrivals from the south and the Dahlgren gunnery range R-area. If you're operating IFR, they have to take you all the way around south of both.
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I've done a lot of work at Dahlgren .. there ain't much firing going on, and there wasn't any last night.

But that's probably the reason for the convoluted routing.

When I got to LOUIE I was tempted to cancel and head on over to OXC.
 
Hey Ron , you got vetted and flew into College Park, Why didn't you claim it on the ConUS?
Dave G:blueplane:
P.S. BTW i might go get vetted also just to have it. Not that i go to DC much anyway.
 
Ron,

You don't have to do more paperwork to get into Hyde or Potomac AFAIK. I was told by those at College Park that you just have to file the appropriate flight plan and you might have to tell ATC that your PIN is listed with College Park. We should look into this more, but I'm sure I am correct in that we can go into all of the Maryland 3.

Kobra
Still waiting for my PIN...it's been only two weeks since I've finished my paperwork
 
You are correct - I'm vetted with Hyde, and flew my first flight to CGS. Just be sure to tell the briefer which airport you are vetted with when you file.
 
Are there alternate options of getting vetted if one lives outside of the DC area?
 
All vetting requires a face-to-face visit to one of the DC3 airports, plus a visit to a FSDO, and going to DCA to get fingerprinted. If anyone's ever in town, just PM me and I can probably get some time free to shuttle you around to get it done.
 
I am now fully vetted and NEVER visited any FRZ airport for vetting. Apparently, the new FAA on-line ADIZ course completion certificate is now acceptable in lieu of watching the video tape on-site.

I still had to visit DCA for the fingerprinting and IAD for the FSDO. (They also had to make a few phone calls, since BWI normally is the FSDO for CGS). My records are filed with CGS.

Note that the IAD FSDO is not really at IAD, but in an office park nearby. Be sure to call first for directions and gate entrance procedures. While DCA is easily reachable via public transportation, the IAD FSDO is not. Not at all. You will need a car (or perhaps a taxi) to go there.

I have not used the FRZ authorization (PIN) yet, but intend to to so for a family trip to CGS in June.
 
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Thanks, nice to meet you.

I just went through the ramp access vetting process at one of my "home" airports (ISP) and posted a bit about it in "Pilot's Lounge" (see: http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29055&highlight=TSA&page=2 )

Soon, we'll all walk around with twenty badges hanging from our necks, like the commercial pilots. Not exactly the kind of status symbol I want.

I wonder why we can't just have a Pilot's Certificate that shows you're trustworthy? Wait, I thought it did. I guess we're OK flying around, but can't be trusted to walk on the ramp.

I'm looking forward to using my PIN and flying into CGS in June. I wonder if I'll need to be escorted to and from the plane after I land there.
 
I went through most of the vetting at an AOPA fly-in a bunch of years ago, when they first dreamed this foolishness up, then eventually got to DCA for my fingerprinting (though, why the local cop shop couldn't have done as well I don't know) and waited months for my PIN. Finally chased it down, flew to Hyde Field, Clinton MD a couple of times, and then decided to try College Park, as it's far more convenient to my destination. It was quite a seamless operation- Called Leesburg's dedicated FRZ line, the guy who answered identified himself as Raleigh FSS, told them I was associated with W32, but wished to fly into College Park. I gave him my PIN, filed my flight plan via my best guess by airways avoiding DC itself, picked up a 'direct EDE- CGS' clearance on the ground. Just a bit north of Richmond, I was cleared to PXT, direct WHINO, direct MITCH and then radar vectors, but the whole reroute didn't add much more than 10 minutes to the trip. Cancelled IFR five miles from CGS, landed there without any problem, found the staff there to be lovely, no escort required. They provided the prop lock, and got me on my way with excellent promptness. On the way out, the ride from midDC took 20 minutes on the Green Line. I'll do that trip again without hesitation, especially since the world's cutest granddaughter is only five subway stops south of College Park. Flying IFR, in particular, is quite easy: somebody holds your hand the whole way.
 
voipguy said:
I am now fully vetted and NEVER visited any FRZ airport for vetting. Apparently, the new FAA on-line ADIZ course completion certificate is now acceptable in lieu of watching the video tape on-site.
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That would seem odd. There are definitely a couple of wrinkles to the FRZ procedures that are not included in the SFRA presentation. Unless they gave you those procedures in a separate briefing, before flying to CGS, I would give the CGS security guy a call to make sure you have all the information required. There are some innocent mistakes you can make that could have unintended consequences.
 
TMetzinger said:
one perhaps new piece of info... your FRZ clearance process makes it possible for you to operate in and out of any of the DC-3 airports. One trick when filing your flight plan is to tell them what airport you are "associated" with - so they can look you up when you give them your PIN.

it really is a non-event - and worth the hassle.
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No its not.

I fly out of two local airports that offer 121 service. I need a badge for each, finger prints and a class.

Now for dc i need finger prints and a class.

How many id cards, licenses, authorizations do we as pilots need to carry?

Between my mechanic and pilot certificates. I need no less than 8 at any point in time. I have a seperate wallet for them all.

They need to take everyones fingerprints at the time of initial certificate application, do the fbi check, issues a license with a photo and be done with all this crap. 1 license, gets you to all civil airports.

These roadblocks are no different than the ones for gun owners. By making it a goat rope, people will just give up. The problems and potential legal issues don't outweigh the benefit.

Wait until they change the FRZ again, and everyone needs to go back for more briefings and more booklets with secret cool guy codes.
 
Well they haven't in a decade, and it's nice to be able to fly to College Park, Hyde, and Potomac. I wish I could fly into DCA.

The fact that you're ****ed at the gov't (and I don't disagree with your issues) doesn't change the fact that if you want to fly to the DC3 the process is do-able.
 
What about 135 operations? If I were vetted to fly into these airports, would that grant access to the company? I assume there also has to be some kind of addendum to the manual for those types of operations.
 
Other than the cost of running back and forth and back and forth, what is the approximate cost of said procedure?
 
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