Interested in getting my PPL - help?

I've always been in the "FAK" crowd, but since P is for Pilots, Pee-Hack probably makes more sense.
 
RobertSubnet said:
Hello "CC268!" I am a little late to the party but hopefully I can help - although you have gotten some excellent advice so far.

Me: 49 years old, Phoenix resident. I live just off of I17 so you are east of me. But I enjoy the restaurants in Cave Creek especially El Encanto! (That duck pond is really neat)

I fly out of the Deer Valley airport with "Westwind School of Aeronautics." The two schools at Deer Valley airport (KDVT) are Transpac and Westwind. Both schools are really geared toward "professional pilot programs." However only Westwind accepts "custom students." That is people like you and me who want to get a PPL and have time to train one or two times a week. Despite my repeat requests to train with them Transpac more or less told me, the "custom student/customer" to go pound sand.

In addition to a "discovery flight" you can meet with a representative at Westwind who will go over their (custom) program and what they offer. I met with a helpful woman name "Alexi" who answered all my questions.

Unfortunately iHenning is correct - flying is expensive.

I agree with this and so does Westwind. I train in a 172 using "steam gauges." While G1000 cockpits are available for the PPL student Westwind does offer and suggest the steam gauges - "steam gauge" aircraft also cost less to rent.

I do not own an iPad and thus far do not feel the need for one. There is PLENTY to learn without electronic distractions.

This is very good advice. I do not mean to sound like a sales person for Westwind but we work off of a syllabus. I know exactly where I am in the training and what is expected of me.

Pronounced "Pee-Hack." You can download a free copy from the FAA here:

http://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/handbooks_manuals/aviation/pilot_handbook/

As other posters said, get the medical done first. I also have a medical condition relating to range and motion issues with my hands and arms. I got the medical done first - and there was no problem.

^^This. You will need to create an account to do this so be sure to save the login credentials someplace.

You cannot see any doctor you want for the medical certificate. You need to see an "AME" or Aviation Medical Examiner. The FAA has a helpful tool for locating doctors in our area. The URL

https://www.faa.gov/pilots/amelocator/

The doctor I went with was Dr. Bryman. He is a pretty laid back guy. They specialize in aviation medicals so they know the procedure very well. For more information:

http://www.drbryman.com/index.htm

I would strongly suggest you get the medical done first. If nothing else for your own peace of mind.

Knowing what I know now I would recommend Westwind. My instructor's name is Stephen Frisch and I like him. He is easy going, friendly and very knowledgeable. He goes out of his way to schedule training when I am available. Stephen looks out for me (the "custom student") and has no problem bumping the "professional pilot program" students in order to make room for guys like you and me.

Good luck with your decision. If you do decide to go with Westwind please feel free to reach out to me: robertfippinger@hotmail.com and perhaps we can meet up for margaritas.

Ohh and to whet your appetite, if you did not already know this, there is a restaurant in the Deer Valley airport. There is an open air patio above the restaurant where you can sit and look out at the airport. There is a speaker where radio communications (ground and tower) is played and you can listen to what is being transmitted. A nice place for lunch, to study, etc., when it is not too hot. You access the patio from outside stairs.

~Robert
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Sorry for the late response! El Encanto is a good place haha! I have looked on the Westwind website and that is definitely a canidate. If I remember correctly it was a tad more expensive than the others, but I would have to check again. It sounds like Westwind is a great school though.

I will definitely look into getting my medical done first - thanks for the documentation.

Thanks a lot for all the info!
 
I guess I would be insanely shocked if I was denied the medical certificate...not to sound rude, but I am healthier than 99% of the population out there...22 year old who is in the gym an hour and a half or more 5 days a week PLUS running for 20-30 minutes at the end of the workout...I am in great shape and my latest doctor visit reflected that.
 
CC268 said:
I guess I would be insanely shocked if I was denied the medical certificate...not to sound rude, but I am healthier than 99% of the population out there...22 year old who is in the gym an hour and a half or more 5 days a week PLUS running for 20-30 minutes at the end of the workout...I am in great shape and my latest doctor visit reflected that.
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Seriously get a consultation with an AME before you go. You don't want to be insanely shocked.
 
jordane93 said:
Seriously get a consultation with an AME before you go. You don't want to be insanely shocked.
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Yea, do this. Actual health is not relevant in this paperwork game.
 
CC268 said:
I guess I would be insanely shocked if I was denied the medical certificate...not to sound rude, but I am healthier than 99% of the population out there...22 year old who is in the gym an hour and a half or more 5 days a week PLUS running for 20-30 minutes at the end of the workout...I am in great shape and my latest doctor visit reflected that.
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Like exNCsurfer said, this is not the kind of medical exam you think it is.
 
jordane93 said:
Seriously get a consultation with an AME before you go. You don't want to be insanely shocked.
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When you do the consult, bring in the Doctor status letter and latest PFT results.

Make sure staff and AME understand this is a consult and not live exam.
 
Ahh I see...alrighty well I guess that will be the first step if I do this!
 
CC268 said:
Thanks guys - I am young (22 years old), so I guess I would like to do it now (get my PPL) early. I have about $4,000 saved in the bank right now. I don't have any debt or any housing expenses right now (live with my parents). I make great money as an engineer (and especially so for a 22 year old), but it is still expensive!

It looks like the next steps are going to be reading the Pilot Handbook, AFH, and finding a good school/instructor. I think flying twice a week wouldn't be a problem. I work 7:30 - 4 (although I can work whatever hours I want, I have an awesome boss!).
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Count your blessings......

You will be buying a Cirrus within the year...;)
 
CC268 said:
Ahh I see...alrighty well I guess that will be the first step if I do this!
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I don't see where you say if you've had any flight time yet.

For me, I'd say, first step, discovery flight, or better yet, call it first hour of training. I think a lot of times 'discovery flights' don't give you enough time to get a good feel for flying. My first flight was a 30 minute 'discovery flight' where I was only given the controls for maybe 2 minutes of straight and level, seemed to go by way too fast.

So, go on a first hour flight or two(try a couple cfi's). If you find you enjoy it and have the bug, then worry about the Medical. You don't want to jump through a bunch of hoops and figure out later that you don't enjoy flying.
 
CC268: As JimBilly says, getting the medical BEFORE you start training isn't a set in stone requirement. Just a good idea for someone who has more medical issues than you and needs more time to get any/all required items sorted.

You need your medical done before you solo. but that's typically 15-20 hours into the training. So if you're doing 2 flights a week of 1.5-ish hours per flight, that 6-8 weeks along. Toss in family, holidays, weather, aircraft not available, instructor not available, etc., and it might be more like 12 weeks. So what I'm saying, for your case, it's not a huge rush. But your asthma daignosis means you need to provide a bit more info than other airmen. So that step takes time for you to see your treating doctor, do the PFT, and get the results and status letter.

New fact for you to take on board... for medical information submissions to the FAA, the agency wants to see test and lab results that are recent. If what you want to hand over to the agency is older than 90 days, it is likely gonna get kicked back with a request for a new test or lab result.
 
All great advice.

Stick with it. There will be times that it won't "click", but it will come together. Just remember to have fun with it. So few people get to experience and enjoy what we private pilots get to do. I still get goosebumps every time I break through an overcast to a brilliant blue sky above.

My parents have a place in Desert Mountain and I occasionally fly into Deer Valley to visit. Cave Creek and Carefree pretty cool places to be.

Eggman
 
jimbilly said:
I don't see where you say if you've had any flight time yet.

For me, I'd say, first step, discovery flight, or better yet, call it first hour of training. I think a lot of times 'discovery flights' don't give you enough time to get a good feel for flying. My first flight was a 30 minute 'discovery flight' where I was only given the controls for maybe 2 minutes of straight and level, seemed to go by way too fast.

So, go on a first hour flight or two(try a couple cfi's). If you find you enjoy it and have the bug, then worry about the Medical. You don't want to jump through a bunch of hoops and figure out later that you don't enjoy flying.
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I don't have any flight time at all - just been in several 172 and Pipers (friends). My dad has his PPL, but isn't current.

I guess I should find a school/instructor and go for a discovery flight.
 
James_Dean said:
All great advice.

Stick with it. There will be times that it won't "click", but it will come together. Just remember to have fun with it. So few people get to experience and enjoy what we private pilots get to do. I still get goosebumps every time I break through an overcast to a brilliant blue sky above.

My parents have a place in Desert Mountain and I occasionally fly into Deer Valley to visit. Cave Creek and Carefree pretty cool places to be.

Eggman
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Oh wow, yea Desert Mountain is NICE. Thanks for the words.
 
+1 everything that First Alternate has said. The FAA exam is not your typical doctor visit. I do not remember seeing this in the thread but how is your vision? Any issues there? Corrected?

It sounds like Westwind is a great school though.
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A couple of other thoughts about Westwind and then I will stop pushing them so hard! :)

1. They use an online scheduling system so you can check your instructors availability - you are given login creds when you start taking lessons. If you want to see what the login page looks like:

http://gssvm1.cloudapp.net/Westwind/logonprofile/logon.asp

I do not usually use the CASSi system, Stephen and I just schedule our next lesson(s) at the end of a lesson.

2. If you decide to take lessons at Westwind be prepared to be put on a waiting list. It took 3 weeks for me to be assigned an instructor. And I hope you are a morning person. Because of the heat we are up at 6am (7am now that things are cooling off). With everyone starting up at the same time you kind of feel like you are on the deck of a WWII aircraft carrier!

Which reminds me: because of the schools, Deer Valley can get very busy. There are mixed thoughts regarding this but I kind of like the congestion. Although overwhelming at first you will quickly develop your situational awareness. You will also develop an ear for working with a busy tower. I am still pre-solo (10 hours flight time) and already I am pretty comfortable working with the radios and tower. You will also learn how to scan for traffic while flying the pattern. It is almost normal for our downwind to be extended and we have to search for traffic to follow behind. One time we were denied entry into the pattern and I did turns-around-a-point over the Arrowhead Mall until the controller could make room for us. Some would say this is not a good environment for a student but I think the experience is great.

FWIW: one of our practice areas is in your area. Monday mornings I fly north of the Carefree Hwy, west of Scottsdale Rd. If you see a Cessna doing stalls there at 7:30 in the morning that is probably me. :)

If you do fly out of Deer Valley stop by the desk in the main terminal. They have a small laminated map of the airport they give out. I keep this map with my knee board - it is very handy to reference. And if you like "oldies" be sure to tune the ADF to 1440 - it is fun to listen to music while waiting for a clearance. :)

Good luck with your decision. Please let us know how it goes no matter what you decide.
 
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Another thing about the medical that hasn't been mentioned is drugs and DUI. If you have ever been pulled over for driving under the influence or if you were treated for ADHD or depression, all of which are becoming increasingly common, make sure you find out about how that will affect your medical BEFORE you go in for the actual medical.

If you have any questions, you may be thinking, I'll just not mention this thing or that thing that is questionable -- on the form. Bad, bad idea. The FAA will treat that as fraud and pretty much refuse you anything.
 
RobertSubnet said:
+1 everything that First Alternate
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FYI, "First Alternate" isn't the screen name. That just a field that the forum software and the PoA MC allow us to put anything we want, from useful to silly to strange and bizarre. Prior to the "Dancing with the Czars" quip, I had "Lars Lars Pantsonfars"

Real name is Mike and that's what is preferred. :yes:
 
AuntPeggy said:
Another thing about the medical that hasn't been mentioned is drugs and DUI. If you have ever been pulled over for driving under the influence or if you were treated for ADHD or depression, all of which are becoming increasingly common, make sure you find out about how that will affect your medical BEFORE you go in for the actual medical.

If you have any questions, you may be thinking, I'll just not mention this thing or that thing that is questionable -- on the form. Bad, bad idea. The FAA will treat that as fraud and pretty much refuse you anything.
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No drugs or DUI haha...and no depression or ADHD...I am a bit OCD though :wink2:
 
RobertSubnet said:
+1 everything that First Alternate has said. The FAA exam is not your typical doctor visit. I do not remember seeing this in the thread but how is your vision? Any issues there? Corrected?

A couple of other thoughts about Westwind and then I will stop pushing them so hard! :)

1. They use an online scheduling system so you can check your instructors availability - you are given login creds when you start taking lessons. If you want to see what the login page looks like:

http://gssvm1.cloudapp.net/Westwind/logonprofile/logon.asp

I do not usually use the CASSi system, Stephen and I just schedule our next lesson(s) at the end of a lesson.

2. If you decide to take lessons at Westwind be prepared to be put on a waiting list. It took 3 weeks for me to be assigned an instructor. And I hope you are a morning person. Because of the heat we are up at 6am (7am now that things are cooling off). With everyone starting up at the same time you kind of feel like you are on the deck of a WWII aircraft carrier!

Which reminds me: because of the schools, Deer Valley can get very busy. There are mixed thoughts regarding this but I kind of like the congestion. Although overwhelming at first you will quickly develop your situational awareness. You will also develop an ear for working with a busy tower. I am still pre-solo (10 hours flight time) and already I am pretty comfortable working with the radios and tower. You will also learn how to scan for traffic while flying the pattern. It is almost normal for our downwind to be extended and we have to search for traffic to follow behind. One time we were denied entry into the pattern and I did turns-around-a-point over the Arrowhead Mall until the controller could make room for us. Some would say this is not a good environment for a student but I think the experience is great.

FWIW: one of our practice areas is in your area. Monday mornings I fly north of the Carefree Hwy, west of Scottsdale Rd. If you see a Cessna doing stalls there at 7:30 in the morning that is probably me. :)

If you do fly out of Deer Valley stop by the desk in the main terminal. They have a small laminated map of the airport they give out. I keep this map with my knee board - it is very handy to reference. And if you like "oldies" be sure to tune the ADF to 1440 - it is fun to listen to music while waiting for a clearance. :)

Good luck with your decision. Please let us know how it goes no matter what you decide.
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My vision is good (just went to my first eye doctor a few months ago)...no correction or glasses.

I guess my concern with Westwind is that it sounds like you have to start in the morning? This isn't necessarily an issue, although I would prefer flying after work. In terms of the "busyness" of Deer Valley - a coworker of mine who has her PPL has mentioned that to me...she did he training in Tuscon when she was at U of A, but she was well aware of the fact that Deer Valley tends to be pretty busy.

Do you know what the hourly rate of Westwind is (plane + instructor)?

It sounds like you are flying over the Bartlett Lake turnoff area...BEAUTIFUL area...grew up riding motocross all throughout there...down to the Verde River...much of the land has since been closed to motor vehicles :mad:

All this talking makes me excited...just going to come down to whether or not I can afford it...I know I can, but its gonna take a good chunk of change...seeing if my dad will maybe help me out :D
 
Do you know what the hourly rate of Westwind is (plane + instructor)?
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Here you go: http://www.westwindaviation.com/aircraft-rentals/

For aircraft rentals Westwind schedules in 2 hour blocks of time but you only pay the aircraft rental rate when the propeller is turning. The aircraft is available to you for 2 hours what you do with it is up to you. I try to get to the airport an hour before my "block." I check weather and perform some calculations, go over the calculations and flight with my instructor and try to have the pre-flight check completed at the start of my block time. This so that I can have the maximum amount of flight time.

I guess my concern with Westwind is that it sounds like you have to start in the morning?
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No not at all - you can schedule afternoon lessons. But do you really want to be in a 100+ degree cockpit? Actually if I remember correctly at 105+ degrees all flights are cancelled. But this time of year you should have no problem getting afternoon flight time.

...much of the land has since been closed to motor vehicles
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And to people who want to shoot in the desert. :(

...just going to come down to whether or not I can afford it...I know I can, but its gonna take a good chunk of change
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Completely understand.
 
It's A LOT easier to learn to fly in the morning. The earlier, the better.

Later on, you should try some late afternoons and get the crap beaten out of you. But not to start. Desert climates get very turbulent late afternoons, especially in summer. Even moderate climates get noticeably bumpier late in the day, though it's well short of beating you up.
 
RobertSubnet said:
Here you go: http://www.westwindaviation.com/aircraft-rentals/

For aircraft rentals Westwind schedules in 2 hour blocks of time but you only pay the aircraft rental rate when the propeller is turning. The aircraft is available to you for 2 hours what you do with it is up to you. I try to get to the airport an hour before my "block." I check weather and perform some calculations, go over the calculations and flight with my instructor and try to have the pre-flight check completed at the start of my block time. This so that I can have the maximum amount of flight time.



No not at all - you can schedule afternoon lessons. But do you really want to be in a 100+ degree cockpit? Actually if I remember correctly at 105+ degrees all flights are cancelled. But this time of year you should have no problem getting afternoon flight time.



And to people who want to shoot in the desert. :(



Completely understand.
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Those rates are actually not bad - pretty similar to everyone else. I am going to have to some talking with my dad...hopefully I will know what I decide to do in the next few weeks.

Yea I used to shoot out at Seven Springs (Unit 21), and it is very difficult to do so now.
 
Yea I used to shoot out at Seven Springs (Unit 21), and it is very difficult to do so now.
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I used to go to Table Mesa Rd. The BLM closed that down for shooters. /ggrrr
 
You don't need a medical until solo. Go fly, learn, hang out at the airport and talk to veteran pilots around there, especially the old timers, if you can find a QB (Quiet Birdman) that takes a shine to you, you are golden. At this point a third class medical will not be a problem, you will be connected lol. Truth be told, AMEs apply a wide range of standards in passing and deferring things, and these guys know, use, and are friends with the AMEs who are pilots keeping other pilots in the air as long as they can.
 
Went into Westwind today and got to check out a few 172s...man I can't wait to get an intro flight!
 
CC268 said:
Went into Westwind today and got to check out a few 172s...man I can't wait to get an intro flight!
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Awesome!! Keep us in the loop as you progress. We all love working with energetic airmen T like yourself.
 
Will do! Gonna try to setup an intro flight for next week/weekend.

As a private pilot do you get to learn how to recover from spins like this? https://youtu.be/4dSrjVR0MvE
 
That's awesome...hope I learn that stuff!
 
Make the drive and check out wings270 in Chandler. Wings270.com. Sure it will cost you in time and fuel but low key training environment will be much better than crazy airspace Deer Valley airport has.
 
Ah alright - thanks for the heads up.
 
The developed spin recovery isn't what's important. It's the conditions and situation which set up a spin entry that are important to learn, and how to handle it in case you get in that situation. However, once you get along in your training, you can ask about spin training, and it's helpful.
 
Alrighty, so I got an appt. with my asthma doctor this Friday (PF test, etc) and then on the 24th I have an appt with an AME. Currently looking around at different schools and CFIs.
 
CC268 said:
Alrighty, so I got an appt. with my asthma doctor this Friday (PF test, etc) and then on the 24th I have an appt with an AME. Currently looking around at different schools and CFIs.
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Awesome. If able, send in advance of your asthma doctor appointment the worksheet I linked along with a cover letter explaining what your visit is about, and requesting the plainly worded status letter that covers all of the requested details. Hopefully this will aid your doctor in creating the letter and getting it back to you quickly.

And did we point out going to https://medxpress.faa.gov to fill out the required FAA 8500-8 form that the AME will require?
 
Yes I filled out the MEDX and saved it to my computer..printed it out at well.

I told my asthma doctor's office what the visit was for and explaining some of the things on the checklist (which he will obviously be familiar with). I could email them the worksheet though...although I do plan to bring it along with me.
 
CC268 said:
Yes I filled out the MEDX and saved it to my computer..printed it out at well.

I told my asthma doctor's office what the visit was for and explaining some of the things on the checklist (which he will obviously be familiar with). I could email them the worksheet though...although I do plan to bring it along with me.
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Don't forget, hold onto that confirmation# and don't give it to the AME(or his secretary!), until after you've had a consultation with an AME to review your answers and supporting documents. You'll probably have to make two appointments with the AME. So don't set it up as a flight physical exam appointment initially. You may have to try a couple if they don't understand what you're asking for(a consultation).
 
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