Idiot killed by jet blast at St Maartin

Little harsh... Like most mistakes involving unfamiliar situations, you don't know until you know... And sometimes that's too late. I don't disagree that it's pretty clear that it's not a good idea to hang out waiting on jet blast, but it's still unfortunate.
 
Except that this is a tourist activity that's done by thousands, if not tens of thousands of people per year. I'm sure she hit her head against the barrier like the girl from 2012 in the video lower on the page.

Here's a thought - take out those small barriers that won't really stop anybody in the first place, and just put in a slide down to the water.
 
Sign? What sign?

Z-Playing-with-danger-at-the-blast-fence.jpg
 
I grieve for humanity, whenever someone dies or is injured in any activity that might be construed as dangerous there are two responses that you can count on, the first is legal action and the second is a long line of people calling them stupid. I obviously don't know the statistics, but I doubt hanging on that fence would make it a lot more likely to die than flying recreational GA. Of course, the vast majority of the population says the same thing about anyone who dies in a GA crash..........idiots.
 
Toi la je t'aime? What the hell is that doing on a danger sign ?! (Or I am I missing something idiomatic? Is it just a heads up, as in "you there I mean you!" It literally means, "you there I like (or love) you!")

Regardless, very sad occurrence. They really do need to redesign that perimeter... maybe put up a solid wall there. Even for people farther outside the danger zone on the beach, it can't be a very pleasant experience. :(
 
azure said:
Regardless, very sad occurrence. They really do need to redesign that perimeter... maybe put up a solid wall there. Even for people farther outside the danger zone on the beach, it can't be a very pleasant experience. :(
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Maybe a law !



They have done exactly what needs to be done: Put up a sign so those unfamiliar with jets are warned. Beyond that, let nature run it's course.
 
Is there not room for a jet blast fence?
 
azure said:
Toi la je t'aime? What the hell is that doing on a danger sign ?! (Or I am I missing something idiomatic? Is it just a heads up, as in "you there I mean you!" It literally means, "you there I like (or love) you!")

Regardless, very sad occurrence. They really do need to redesign that perimeter... maybe put up a solid wall there. Even for people farther outside the danger zone on the beach, it can't be a very pleasant experience. :(
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After watching the video I think it is referring to those people deliberately running toward the blast for the fun of it and they are yelling "you there" to the blast itself.
 
I don't get the harshness. She did something literally 1,000s of people have done, knowing the risks.

We have people jumping out of airplanes, riding ATVs, playing with their guns, etc. all knowing the risks. Sometimes the risk bites you. If we call this lady an idiot for seeking a thrill, then we'll need to call everyone else who engages in an activity with risk an idiot.

Condolences.
 
Pilawt said:
Looks like it was stenciled on by an "independent contractor".
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I don't think so, it looks like it was done by the same people who did the graphic of the jet blast and the falling person.

And @weilke, I didn't say anything about a law. If it's possible to build one, a blast fence or wall would protect lives without restricting the freedoms of people on the beach. I really can't get on board with "let nature take its course". That's a little like saying if you're illiterate or of subnormal intelligence, we don't really care if you get hurt by our jet blast. Or you don't belong on this beach.

If it's impractical to put a blast fence there then that's one thing. But I would hope it's been considered.
 
Rushie said:
After watching the video I think it is referring to those people deliberately running toward the blast for the fun of it and they are yelling "you there" to the blast itself.
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I was thinking maybe to the people on the jet... but it still seems a strange thing to have on the sign.
 
Never understood the thrill of getting sandblasted in your bathing suit.....
 
Having been there, and been behind the jet blast, I can say most people exhibit more enthusiasm then intelligence.
I stayed below most of the jet blast by staying on the beach (for the MD-80, Airbus 340 and Quantas 747); and it was rather fun and kinda cool to experience. The MD-80 was actually the most impressive, as the captain stands on the brakes at the end of the runway and takes about 7 seconds for the engines to spool up. The A340 and B747 both only held the brakes for a second or so, and you can hear the engines still picking up power speed as the plane pulls away. The end result was not as dramatic in my opinion.
From my perspective, as you only get on the curb of the road by the beach side you have the danger of a few scrapes and bruises but not much else. If you lose your balance, or are pushed, you end up rolling down a gentle incline toward the ocean. I am guessing due to the lip of the road and the curb, there really was not much power down low on the beach itself. Closer then that, if you do not react and maintain balance you could end up hitting your head, rolling into cement barriers... plenty of bad things can potentially happen.
Once you start crossing the road, or try and hang onto the fence you really are doing something stupid.

Tim
 
Unless they put in a pop-up blast deflector, like on an aircraft carrier, the best you can hope is that people will take responsiblity for their actions.
 
If there isn't room for a blast fence, maybe they could replace the existing fence with a concrete wall.
 
Matthew said:
Unless they put in a pop-up blast deflector, like on an aircraft carrier, the best you can hope is that people will take responsiblity for their actions.
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I don't think she can take responsibility for anything anymore. :(
 
I think they just need a bigger sign. If it's bigger it means the warning is more serious, right? Smaller signs are more like suggestions really...
 
Bill Jennings said:
Is there not room for a jet blast fence?
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As such a structure wouldn't be frangible, it would require shortening the runway. The run way is already on the short end for intercontinental flights.
 
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azure said:
And @weilke, I didn't say anything about a law. If it's possible to build one, a blast fence or wall would protect lives without restricting the freedoms of people on the beach. I really can't get on board with "let nature take its course". That's a little like saying if you're illiterate or of subnormal intelligence, we don't really care if you get hurt by our jet blast. Or you don't belong on this beach.
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It is similar to hiking to some attractions in the alps. The railing may be a single steel cable. Of couse, you could put up a big honking concrete wall to keep people from New Jersey from hurting themselves, but why ? Mountains are made from rocks and you climb up to look down on stuff. Falling off the edge is an assumed risk of going there.
In this case, the risk is not to the casual beach-goer. They may get some sand in their eyes, but unless they use implements like umbrellas to hurt themselves, the beach itself is pretty safe. Its the dimwits who hold on to the airport fence who get blown off and hit the concrete barrier. The place would be safer without the fence or the concrete barrier.
 
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weilke said:
It is similar to hiking to some attractions in the alps. The railing may be a single steel cable. Of couse, you could put up a big honking concrete wall to keep people from New Jersey from hurting themselves, but why ? Mountains are made from rocks and you climb up to look down on stuff. Falling off the edge is an assumed risk of going there.
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Exactly, getting thrown back by jet blast is not normally an assumed risk of going to the beach.
In this case, the risk is not to the casual beach-goer. They may get some sand in their eyes, but unless they use implements like umbrellas to hurt themselves, the beach itself is pretty safe. Its the dimwits who hold on to the airport fence who get blown off and hit the concrete barrier. The place would be safer without the fence or the concrete barrier.
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That is what isn't clear to me. That beach looks very tight, and departing jets have their tails pretty close to the fence, apparently, as they begin their takeoff roll. If that's an illusion due to camera angle or whatever and it's true that there is no danger at all beachward of the concrete barrier, then I'm less concerned. But that isn't at all clear from the (admittedly limited) view of the place from the pictures and video posted here.
 
azure said:
I don't think so, it looks like it was done by the same people who did the graphic of the jet blast and the falling person.

And @weilke, I didn't say anything about a law. If it's possible to build one, a blast fence or wall would protect lives without restricting the freedoms of people on the beach. I really can't get on board with "let nature take its course". That's a little like saying if you're illiterate or of subnormal intelligence, we don't really care if you get hurt by our jet blast. Or you don't belong on this beach.

If it's impractical to put a blast fence there then that's one thing. But I would hope it's been considered.
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I am on board with "let nature take its course" past a point. There is a price that's too high to try to get risk to zero and society pays too much too often. I cannot say whether it would be in this case. How much would a renovation cost and how many deaths or serious injuries have happened here? If the price works out to $$billions to save one life in 30 years that's not worth it. You always need to consider the opportunity lost when you do stuff like this but people never seem to.

Edit: my example numbers are extreme. In reality I have no idea what they are. Maybe it only costs $2000 to put up a barrier or remove the offending concrete. In that case it would be worth it.
 
Rushie said:
I am on board with "let nature take its course" past a point. There is a price that's too high to try to get risk to zero and society pays too much too often. I cannot say whether it would be in this case. How much would a renovation cost and how many deaths or serious injuries have happened here? If the price works out to $$billions to save one life in 30 years that's not worth it. You always need to consider the opportunity lost when you do stuff like this but people never seem to.
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I agree. That's why I stipulated that if it's impractical to put up a blast wall, then they've probably done the best they could. It just seems like an unusual hazard for a beach, and there are inevitably going to be people who will not have enough sense to realize that the danger is very real, even with the sign there.
 
azure said:
I agree. That's why I stipulated that if it's impractical to put up a blast wall, then they've probably done the best they could. It just seems like an unusual hazard for a beach, and there are inevitably going to be people who will not have enough sense to realize that the danger is very real, even with the sign there.
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you can't always save people from themselves.....o_O
 
azure said:
Exactly, getting thrown back by jet blast is not normally an assumed risk of going to the beach.

That is what isn't clear to me. That beach looks very tight, and departing jets have their tails pretty close to the fence, apparently, as they begin their takeoff roll. If that's an illusion due to camera angle or whatever and it's true that there is no danger at all beachward of the concrete barrier, then I'm less concerned. But that isn't at all clear from the (admittedly limited) view of the place from the pictures and video posted here.
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It reality it is not that close, you are a couple hundred feet from the end of the engines. The big planes do not turn on a dime, they have to effectively complete a u-turn, and then the engines are about half the length of the plane further forward.

In addition, the beach is below the level of the road and curb.
On the beach, that worst that could happen is you fall over or get some sand in your eyes.
Further, all the crowds gathering to watch the takeoff and landings sort of give away the excitement and know what is going on.

Lastly, if the jet blast really did push that much, there would be no beach because it would push all the sand out to sea.

Tim
 
It's not a large area at all, maybe 75 feet from the fence to the water, give or take a few depending on tide and seasonal beach erosion. Inbetween is a very narrow two-lane road.
 
I bet it smells good there. Smelling burning Jet fuel reminds me of going to the airport when I was a young kid.
It was the only thing that smelled like that and it meant we were going somewhere.

Oh well.
RIP
 
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