Icy Runways

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ScottVal

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Winter storm Gemini passed through on Saturday, and on Monday I was scheduled to take a rented Cardinal for a spin. I woke up Monday morning having planned a 60-mile cross country, dressed in warmly, ready to go, weather briefing in hand. Looked like a great VFR morning. Certainly the taxiways and runways had been plowed and de-iced.

I got a call from a lady at the FBO, and she asked me if I still wanted the rental. I asked her if there were complaints about ice on the runway or taxiways, and she put me on hold for a moment to ask around. She came back and said that the runways were icy and in poor condition. I canceled the flight, as I don't have any experience with icy taxiways and runways.

I wanted to start a forum discussion about this, and see if any of you all have experience with these conditions and have any opinions about what it takes to taxi safely on icy runways, or to perform safe T/Os and landings in such conditions. Thanks. -Scott
 
If she called you maybe there was someone else wanting to take the plane, you just never know. If possible you could have listened to liveatc.net (if your airport is on there) and see what pilots were saying about the braking action. If it's a smaller airport you could call the tower directly and ask. I know I personally wouldn't rely my decision on what a phone operator at an FBO told me.
 
I landed at Branson MO a few years back on an icy runway and I'd never do it again. I knew that a snow storm had just past through the previous night but I figured being a Class C the runway would be in good shape. No such luck.

The ATIS was reporting breaking action fair to poor. When I landed the runway was completely covered in ice with slush at the approach end from the jets taking off. I landed and swerved a bit but kept in on the runway. When I shutdown in parking all the slush had frozen to the belly, wings and wheel pants. I spend about 45 minutes scrapping the ice off before departure.

Just not worth operating in those conditions for small GA aircraft not on a schedule.
 
Taxi at a walking pace. On takeoff and landing,never touch the brakes until you have slowed to a walking speed. Follow these rules and ice operations are pretty normal. Some major airports operate for long periods of time with an ice cover - Cleveland Hopkins comes to mind. The operators treat the runway with urea to roughen the surface. The first trip there, it seemed really weird, but I got used to it.
 
Ha ha thanks guys. These are great ideas and great videos. I will also ask my cfii about icy taxiways and runways next time I see him.
 
A lot has to do with the speed and direction of the winds. Obviously, braking in a cross wind on an icy runway is going to be more exciting than no wind or wind straight down the runway. ;)
 
I land on icy runways all the time in winter.

You have to consider how the ice was made and the conditions since then. When you have melt and refreeze then you will have smooth ice that offers no traction. I don't land on that. If you have a layer of ice with snow that has fallen and stuck on top that usually provides good traction. Basically if the ice has a transparent very shiny surface beware. An opaque/dulled surface it is usually descent traction.

If there is no crosswind I land slow and with no yaw (even if I have to go around to get it setup perfect). If there is a crosswind I land just fast enough that I can quickly jump back into the air. I'll get the wheels down, test braking, if I'm sliding I can add power and get back into the air before I hit a snow bank or whatever.
 
This is one of those "I know I when I see it" situations -- no way to tell without actually looking it over. But taking the word of the FBO renting you the plane is usually a pretty good idea -- the want the plane generating revenue, but not being busted.
 
Just remember it doesn't have tires and handling like your car. Use a long lead time for braking and for cornering. Also, even though the runways and taxiways are in adequate condition does not mean the FBO ramp will be the same way so if the person at the FBO told you not to come it's probably a good idea to believe them.
 
Depends. Slush I stay away from for the reasons above.
Hard ice, no problem.

On an slick runway, you "fly" the plane down the runway/taxiway, understanding that the flight controls have more effect than the wheels. On one very slick taxiway with a significant wind, it was throttle and rudder to crab the plane down the centerline.

I don't do T&Gs on ice runways. Personally, there's too many ways to lose directional control while reconfiguring the aircraft. Land and focus on the centerline, taxi off and back, then take off focusing on the centerline.
 
It's one of those times a twin with good differential thrust can be a big help. Landed in OSH last winter in the middle of moderate snow. Braking was poor and there had been ice on the runway for a few days. All was well until I went to turn off and the plane just kept going same direction. Brought up outboard engine, as it turned the plane, brought up the inboard and just came in--all at about 2 mph (g).

Tug broke my tow pin putting it in the hangar. They said it just slowly started to slide until it broke the pin. Oh well.

Best,

Dave
 
I get hourly e-mails from our airport manager with RW and TW reports of snow coverage, presence of ice and braking reports.

The new manager has really taken his responsibilities serious, it is quite nice.
 
ScottVal said:
I canceled the flight, as I don't have any experience with icy taxiways and runways.
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That's an example of good judgment, and it beats heck out of your name being on the top line of an NTSB report.

Consider that the only control you have on the ground is from those three narrow patches of tire tread. Do you REALLY want to find out if they'll hold traction on ice at 60 mph?
 
PilotAlan said:
Depends. Slush I stay away from for the reasons above.
Hard ice, no problem.

On an slick runway, you "fly" the plane down the runway/taxiway, understanding that the flight controls have more effect than the wheels. On one very slick taxiway with a significant wind, it was throttle and rudder to crab the plane down the centerline.
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If it's so slick you can only control direction on the ground with throttle and rudder, how are you going to stop the plane? I'll pass on those conditions, thanks.
 
Ron Levy said:
If it's so slick you can only control direction on the ground with throttle and rudder, how are you going to stop the plane? I'll pass on those conditions, thanks.
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First, the direct crosswind on the taxiway was weathervaning the plane. You could stop, and you could steer. Just not taxi with a direct crosswind.

Second, that wasn't a choice. The temps had dropped and taxiways iced over during the 30 min flight, and no one else was out. We only found the conditions after landing.
 
Alton Bay - the ice runway. Remember this should be a short field landing, not a soft field landing. If they open Alton Bay Iceport, the ice is plenty thick for a firm landing. But if you touch down late or at too high an airspeed, you can easily exit the far end of the runway... over an icy berm. Bring your A game, set down on speed at "the numbers", raise the nose as high as possible for aerodynamic braking, steer with rudder. At walking speed, you can steer gently with the nose wheel.

Presumably with differential braking, too, but I have no time in a plane which lacks nose wheel steering.

-Skip
 
I remember my first "icy" runway. A storm had passed through the previous night and airports were slow to get cleared. I had an Arrow reserved at MHT (Manchester NH) for a flight up to Laconia (LCI). Getting out was no problem. Plowed packed snow everywhere. Coming back the tower was reporting "braking action poor, reported by fuel truck".

There was a slight cross wind down and rolling fine and then the arrow weathervaned into the wind on sheet ice. I worked to get the tires rolling in the correct direction before they got traction, glad the runway was wide. As I taxied in, a Delta DC-9 called the tower for landing and got the same runway condition report with the addition, "braking action reported nil by a Cherokee arrow".

Taxi slower than a walk, keep your power at idle or lower, pump the brakes to help the turn, they grab, lock up and slide, but when they transition from rolling to sliding you get momentary braking and control.
 
One thing I don't think has been mentioned is that slopes on taxiways and ramps that are normally not a problem can become hazardous. If at all possible do not ever head downslope if there's any chance (e.g. something you might hit) along the downslope or slightly beyond it. If it's really slippery there's a good chance you simply will not be able to stop until you're on level ground or going uphill.
 
TangoWhiskey said:
He was in a Grumman. That was just his short field technique.
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Yeah, I think Ron teaches that technique in Grummans.
Aim for the snow bank. It'll stop us like an arresting cable on a carrier. :)
 
The snow banks at Alton bay are not very forgiving,there is usually a slight crosswind on the runway. Have two pilot friends that have had incidents on the lake.
 
Ron Levy said:
If it's so slick you can only control direction on the ground with throttle and rudder, how are you going to stop the plane? I'll pass on those conditions, thanks.
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Like on ice skates or snow skies- by sliding sideways, maybe a little more than 90°, perhaps as much as a full 180 using power as in reverse thrust.
 
Just had a piper twin run of the runway at LWM ,Lawrence mass. Light snow at the time.
 
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