Home Addition - NA

[Rushie]

Depends on the market.
I almost bought a house in the DC Area, which needed a garage. The cost to add the garage was almost a dollar for dollar increase in the value of the house and it sells a lot faster. Which outside of Boston now, adding a garage does almost nothing for the value of the house.
Which makes absolutely no fricking sense to me.

Tim

Yeah you're right, it depends on the local market. Best to consult a local real estate agent about what value and marketability it will add.

 

[SoonerAviator]

Well as it sits, with minor items like a new roof and paint (interior is already done/modernized). The house probably sells for $150K-160K I'd guess, so I'd walk away with $30K over purchase price. If I added the attached garage which adds ~700sq ft of living space (for fun say it costs $80K), I then have $200K into a house that will probably sell for somewhere between $220-240K. I walk away with $30K over purchase price plus add-on cost. I base that on homes in my same neighborhood that are less than 3K sq ft, mine would be 3,700 sq ft at that point. So, unless my estimation of the local market is wrong, I doubt I lose either way. The situation hasn't changed for me, as I'm still looking to get some reputable GCs out to give me a ballpark estimate on project cost. The cost was always going to be the break-point to see if the addition was worth it from the return on investment versus just living with it as-is and going elsewhere when the time comes. We are only a family of 3, so it's not as if we are space-constrained. I just figured if I could add a garage cheaply-enough, I could enjoy it for 10 years and then recoup most when we sell.

The amazing thing to me, is that I can have a stand-alone 30x40 steel frame shop with concrete and insulation/electric for $25K-30K, but to build a smaller footprint 2-story addition costs another $50K. Obviously drywall and additional material is in there, but it's just funny to see the massive increase.

 

[weilke]

I'm considering building a house in a year or two, and I'll need an architect. With the current building boom that going on, will I be able to get their attention with a small one-off custom home (~$250k in Alabama)? I ask, because y'all make it sound like they'd be interested in doing an addition and I'm wondering if they'd even want to mess with a house. Seems like the cookie cutter subdivisions would have them completely booked.

Cookie cutter subdivisions don't use independent architects. If a stamp is required for the local jurisdiction, they have in house architects or engineers.

 

[John221us]

Well as it sits, with minor items like a new roof and paint (interior is already done/modernized). The house probably sells for $150K-160K I'd guess, so I'd walk away with $30K over purchase price. If I added the attached garage which adds ~700sq ft of living space (for fun say it costs $80K), I then have $200K into a house that will probably sell for somewhere between $220-240K. I walk away with $30K over purchase price plus add-on cost. I base that on homes in my same neighborhood that are less than 3K sq ft, mine would be 3,700 sq ft at that point. So, unless my estimation of the local market is wrong, I doubt I lose either way. The situation hasn't changed for me, as I'm still looking to get some reputable GCs out to give me a ballpark estimate on project cost.

The amazing thing to me, is that I can have a stand-alone 30x40 steel frame shop with concrete and insulation/electric for $25K-30K, but to build a smaller footprint 2-story addition costs another $50K. Obviously drywall and additional material is in there, but it's just funny to see the massive increase.

You don't want to be the most expensive house in the neighborhood or you will have trouble selling as well as appraising (comps). Over building can be an issue, unless you just want to keep the house for twenty years and you are doing it strictly to make it more livable.

 

[SoonerAviator]

You don't want to be the most expensive house in the neighborhood or you will have trouble selling as well as appraising (comps). Over building can be an issue, unless you just want to keep the house for twenty years and you are doing it strictly to make it more livable.

True, that has crossed my mind. However, my neighborhood happens to be a bit unique in that there are homes from the late-60's through the 90's, with several above 3K sq ft, as well as neighborhoods within a square mile which are just as large. So, while mine might be one of the largest with the addition, I'm not overly concerned as there are slightly newer houses which command much higher prices nearby. It's certainly something to take into account, though. The biggest detractor for my house versus newer builds is the split-level floor plan. There are no two houses that look alike in my neighborhood.

 

[coloradobluesky]

Get references and call them on your builders. Ask for copies of their workmans comp and liability insurance policy with the phone number of their insurance agent and call and verify. Don't go with the lowest bid. The thing that causes the most problems in construction are CHANGES. Get a written procedure for changes. No procedure followed, no change. Hopefully there won't be many changes if the design is well worked out. Remodeling is more expensive than new construction. With that brick, you're going to be over $100 per square foot although the garage isn't fully finished so that may help.

 

[SoonerAviator]

So latest update: after dealing with a few contractors, we found one who specializes solely on garages/additions. Bid came out to $63K for a 30x30 attached garage including electric, concrete, and a finished bedroom on the second story. So, we’ll go talk to a few banks and see what the house will appraise for after we’re finished. If the home appraises for $210K or better, we will likely go ahead with the build. I have a feeling the house will go for more than that, but I’m being conservative.


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[flyingron]

Great. It will be a challenge while it is going but the end will be worth it. Our construction seems to have been taking forever, but the painters and the tile guys have been busting ass all week. The (interior) doors should be hear next week. Cabinets, finished floors, and finish plumbing and electrical and we'll be done!

 

[Zeldman]

So latest update: after dealing with a few contractors, we found one who specializes solely on garages/additions. Bid came out to $63K for a 30x30 attached garage including electric, concrete, and a finished bedroom on the second story. So, we’ll go talk to a few banks and see what the house will appraise for after we’re finished. If the home appraises for $210K or better, we will likely go ahead with the build. I have a feeling the house will go for more than that, but I’m being conservative.

Did you insurance company say anything about having a living area above the garage? I wanted to build a guest area above the garage on the new to me house, but the insurance company told me that my insurance would almost double.

 

[SoonerAviator]

Did you insurance company say anything about having a living area above the garage? I wanted to build a guest area above the garage on the new to me house, but the insurance company told me that my insurance would almost double.

I haven’t looked into insurance info yet, but it would boggle the mind that they would care. I realize exhaust fumes are prevalent in a garage, but an open 2-car garage door should be enough to ventilate the area without compromising any room above it.


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[Clark1961]

I haven’t looked into insurance info yet, but it would boggle the mind that they would care. I realize exhaust fumes are prevalent in a garage, but an open 2-car garage door should be enough to ventilate the area without compromising any room above it.


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Think fire...

 

[SoonerAviator]

Think fire...

Well, if that were the case, they wouldn’t insure any 2-story homes. I don’t see a fire starting there any easier than in the kitchen. I suppose there are those that store gas cans next to a water heater closet, but I won’t have that issue since there will be no ignition source or fuel cans in the garage as-designed.


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[flyingron]

Did you insurance company say anything about having a living area above the garage? I wanted to build a guest area above the garage on the new to me house, but the insurance company told me that my insurance would almost double.

As long as things are built to code, certainly none of my insurers have ever cared. It's a fact of life in many areas that they'll tuck the garage under living space. There are two things you need to make sure of:

1. There's an adequate firewall between the two spaces. Most places require a one-hour wall, which essentially is served by a two sheets of the standard 5/8 drywall or one of the fire resistance products.

2. That any air leaks between the garage and the living space above are properly sealed.

We have people living above their airplane hangars here.

 

[Clark1961]

Well, if that were the case, they wouldn’t insure any 2-story homes. I don’t see a fire starting there any easier than in the kitchen. I suppose there are those that store gas cans next to a water heater closet, but I won’t have that issue since there will be no ignition source or fuel cans in the garage as-designed.


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It has to do with what actuaries see, not what you will say you will do.

 

[SoonerAviator]

It has to do with what actuaries see, not what you will say you will do.

I know, I was just being argumentative. I know plenty of modern houses that have man caves/etc built over the garages, so hopefully they don’t see it as being much to spike the premiums over. They already gouge me enough as it is to insure my home on square footage instead of market value. I’ve got insurance coverage for 250% of what I paid for it, lol.


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[Clark1961]

I know, I was just being argumentative. I know plenty of modern houses that have man caves/etc built over the garages, so hopefully they don’t see it as being much to spike the premiums over. They already gouge me enough as it is to insure my home on square footage instead of market value. I’ve got insurance coverage for 250% of what I paid for it, lol.


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You argumentative? On POA? Never I’m sure.

I suspect the bedroom over the garage thing varies by insurance company and what their claim data shows. Many homes around here have the master bedroom over the garage by design out of the 60s. Have heard of a few problems. Dunno what insurance rates look like. I’m thinkin’ that if it’s a fire rated ceiling in the garage then it won’t be a problem in an area well served by a fire department.

 

[SoonerAviator]

The entire addition will be finished out with drywall, so hopefully that seals all potential air leaks. Requesting fire rated drywall would probably be worth it for peace of mind anyway. I’ll just be satisfied with a garage for the vehicles and a bedroom above for child #2 on down the line. Still have to see what a bathroom addition will run, even if just a 1/2 bath for young child accidents.


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[steingar]

The reasoning is nuts, just nuts. "Oh, we'll add this and that and we can sell it for X in ten years". You have no clue whatsoever what will be what in ten years! Aliens could invade Oklahoma and make your property worthless! Or maybe just another '08-style real estate crash. Or who knows what else!

To be honest, I think a house has to be the poorest investment I've seen. You don't make money on it, no way, not after you get done paying loan interest, caring for the structure and the attached land, etc. I bet if I added up everything I spent on the Steinholme it would dwarf anything I could sell it for. You buy a house because you need somewhere to live and you want some space. You want a deal in living space go live in a trailer park.

If you must have a garage, fine, build a garage. If your cars are that valuable or you like to wrench, it makes good sense. Personally, I think just buying a house with an extant garage makes more sense, but that's just me. But building one because you think the market will be X and therefore you can sell for Y is pure and utter foolishness.

 

[SoonerAviator]

The reasoning is nuts, just nuts. "Oh, we'll add this and that and we can sell it for X in ten years". You have no clue whatsoever what will be what in ten years! Aliens could invade Oklahoma and make your property worthless! Or maybe just another '08-style real estate crash. Or who knows what else!

To be honest, I think a house has to be the poorest investment I've seen. You don't make money on it, no way, not after you get done paying loan interest, caring for the structure and the attached land, etc. I bet if I added up everything I spent on the Steinholme it would dwarf anything I could sell it for. You buy a house because you need somewhere to live and you want some space. You want a deal in living space go live in a trailer park.

If you must have a garage, fine, build a garage. If your cars are that valuable or you like to wrench, it makes good sense. Personally, I think just buying a house with an extant garage makes more sense, but that's just me. But building one because you think the market will be X and therefore you can sell for Y is pure and utter foolishness.

I'm the only one who turns wrenches on my vehicles and toys. Doing so in the drive way has been doable, but not ideal in the least, especially when weather is a factor. The garage is being built because we want a garage. Since we want a garage, it only makes sense to build a room above it and expand the house since the footprint will be the same and the additional cost is minimal. While I don't have a clue what the value will be in ten years, it doesn't generally fluctuate in Oklahoma too much compared to other areas of the country. The housing bust went largely unnoticed in OK because properties weren't significantly over-valued here. I know roughly what the market value is right now, and roughly what the value of a comparable house is with a garage. I also know that a house of this size is expected to have a minimum 2-car garage, in order to appeal to the broadest range of potential buyers in the future. If this were a 1,200 sq ft home, the story would be much different.

As far as housing being a poor investment, that's entirely dependent on how long you finance and what your intentions are. If you move every 5 years, then house purchases don't make a ton of sense, but at least your money doesn't go entirely to rent with no equity in return. This isn't so much about the return on investment as it is not losing money on the home vs potential sales value. I bought the house for less than $120K, and can sell (minus expenses) for around $160K today. If I put $70K into it, and the market value of the house goes up to $230K, I lose no money in the deal (aside from interest expense) and have the same equity to sales spread. So why not have more space and a garage for 10 years and get the same money after the sale?

 

[SoonerAviator]

Since FastEddie has been updating his thread, I figured I'd give a brief update on my home renovation project: we decided to build a detached garage as well as put all new windows on the house. We went out and re-financed the home (total note well-below pre-construction market value). So now we have all of the new windows installed and the driveway has been busted up/pad poured for the garage addition. It's amazing how quiet the house is with the new windows (replaced the original 1965 single-pane non-tempered units). I don't think we'll notice much in energy savings just yet, but it will show up in time, especially this winter.

Pic of house with new windows and balloons for the kiddo's 2nd b-day party.

Driveway demo

Demo finished, ready for ready for rebar/footer prep

Footer poured, concrete pad poured, carport will stay.

View from under carport, garage will have a "pull through" design with 2-car garage door on front and back to allow carport use.

 

[SoonerAviator]

Once garage is built/bricked, the entire house/garage will be painted a medium gray (per the wife's demand) with white trim. Garage will technically be a detached structure, but will have a finshed-enclosed hallway connecting to the side door of the house. This created a 5'W area between the house and the garage, but it won't be too evident from the front. I don't have plans for it, but there are drains in the concrete as well as grading to ensure runoff is funneled appropriately.

 

[MIFlyer]

The existing driveway will get busted up to allow for footings under the addition.

You will have a giant tarp instead of a wall on the side of the house where the addition is being placed until it at least gets closed in. Strange cats will show up and eat your cat's food.

Get used to crews showing up and pounding on the house at 7:00 AM

Is the house sided? Brick? How close can it be matched?

How well things flow between the house and addition will depend on the layout of the house. Is there a hall against the wall that gets the addition or are you going to have to cut up a room?

Patching in the new roof or replacing all the shingles?

Hire an Architect.

agree with this and also, consider if you really want the second floor over the garage. it might be architecturally way easier to just attach a first floor garage and NOT have a space above it. while the space above seems "free", and it would be if you were building this thing in middle of the field, matching it up to the house and getting HVAC to it and balanced, etc in a way that looks elegant is MUCH harder in most cases. think hard about how much you want that upstairs space vs getting and architect to design a simple 30x30 garage only box to stick on the side and make it look like it was probably always there

 

[denverpilot]

The reasoning is nuts, just nuts. "Oh, we'll add this and that and we can sell it for X in ten years". You have no clue whatsoever what will be what in ten years! Aliens could invade Oklahoma and make your property worthless! Or maybe just another '08-style real estate crash. Or who knows what else!

To be honest, I think a house has to be the poorest investment I've seen. You don't make money on it, no way, not after you get done paying loan interest, caring for the structure and the attached land, etc. I bet if I added up everything I spent on the Steinholme it would dwarf anything I could sell it for. You buy a house because you need somewhere to live and you want some space. You want a deal in living space go live in a trailer park.

If you must have a garage, fine, build a garage. If your cars are that valuable or you like to wrench, it makes good sense. Personally, I think just buying a house with an extant garage makes more sense, but that's just me. But building one because you think the market will be X and therefore you can sell for Y is pure and utter foolishness.

Out here where I live, and people have tractors, and various machinery to store, adding a garage or pole barn always increases the resale value of the property over one without it. Always.

Market fluctuations like ‘08, caused by government meddling in loan guarantees and nearly crashing the world economy, are one offs. Yes, if you have to sell during the correction, you’re screwed.

But generally, housing prices climb with inflation, just like everything else does. Buying (even via a mortgage with reasonable time limits on it, never 30 years, you won’t ever be there that long) locks in a price at X date, while overall prices continue to rise, unless you live in an area where significant job loss and mass exodus are occurring or overbuilding happened.

Which in terms of the entire country, aren’t common. Even then, housing rarely falls in the depressed areas, it just sits level and many rentals sit empty for a while. Population continues to grow, housing is always eventually in demand.

The better “bones” you buy in a house the less major maintenance is needed. Paint it inside and out once in a while or better, buy brick exteriors. Real brick, not crappy brick siding, if you can get it. Change the carpet out every so often. Appliances as needed.

People tend to waste a lot of money on landscaping but it’s not required unless you live somewhere with a fascist HOA. Install rocks and spray for weeds in the rocks and done. Watering (here in the arid high plains) and mowing grass is stupid. A dump truck with many tons of nice river rock and a couple of weekends shoveling rocks on top of a good thick plastic weed barrier, and you’ll have a lovely no maintenance “lawn”.

Not buying housing is fine, you just have to budget for ever increasing rent, which is just following inflation, if you live anywhere normal. The owner is certainly going to pass along all costs to the renter, or sell it, if they have any business sense at all. Including maintenance. You’re not getting any break from maintenance on a rental. It’s in the monthly price.

Pay a house off, it’s an asset. Until then, it’s a rental from a bank and they’re just making you maintain their rental property. Most people are renting, whether to a private landlord, or a bank. They don’t own squat until they have the title in hand.

 

[SoonerAviator]

Yeah, we decided against having a room addition above the garage as the cost was going to be more than we could likely recoup. However, the roof will be a 12/12 pitch to match the house, so there will be ample attic space above, as well as 9' walls for the garage. So, essentially we are adding an oversize (24'Wx30'L) 2-car garage with a pull-through to utilize the carport behind it with full drywall and electric. Between the 25 new windows, driveway repair, and the garage addition, it will run us around $55K. The house appraises for $40K over my current loan value once the garage is finished, so I essentially in the same spot financially as I was prior to having this work done. The only financial impact should be interest cost on the additional loan principle, but we refinanced at a lower rate so it may be a wash in the end.

 

[Lando]

Just got done with a similar size addition to our house. Two big tips:

• Get everything in writing with a detailed contract and make sure you have a way out if things go bad at some point
• Make sure the contractor commits to a schedule. If you can build in penalties/incentives for slower or faster work, that would be even better.

 

[JOhnH]

Hire an Architect.

An architect should know the answers to all your questions, even if you don't know the questions. And he will probably have a lot of ideas that you never thought of. AND he will keep you from making some potentially serious mistakes.

Of course, architects live on the Bell curve too, so check them out. Look at some of their results.

 

[SoonerAviator]

Well, we've got something that resembles a garage.