Helmets in GA aircraft?

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Frank

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Frank
I have been thinking about helmets for two main reasons. First, becoming unconscious in a ditching, and second, becoming unconscious after a landing that damages the airplane and that also leads to fire. Helmets might also provide some mitigation of head injuries, but keeping you conscious seems to offer some real benefits. I know that today helmet use is rare, but when I started flying most of us didn't use headsets to preserve our hearing, and we rode bicycles and skied without benefit of helmets, but times have changed. I am not suggesting new rules, just some thought on the issue.

If you think helmets might have something to offer, then what kind of helmets would you think would work well? what might be some downsides to using helmets?
 
The weight of the helmet and comfort especially on long flights.Also would you have to provide one for your passengers?The pilots that would feel safer in a helmet probably want an aircraft with a parachute installed.I do however go with suspenders when flying over water.
 
Cropduster pilots wear helmets all the time... for reasons of enhanced crash survivability to just simply preventing themselves from getting too many lumps on their noggin's from bashing their heads around the cockpit while flying in low altitude thermal turbulence. The helmets used by them would be suitable for any other GA flying... but they're not cheap and equipping them with quality ANR headphones is even more expensive due to the difficulty of fitting ANR earcups into the helmets. They're also very heavy and uncomfortable, and hot inside and when you sweat in them a lot, they'll get smelly and be a possible source of bacterial and/or fungal infections too. Wearing a helmet while flying a Cessna/Piper/spamcan will get you laughed at too.
 
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If you're going to wear a helmet when flying for a $100 hamburger, I hope you're wearing the helmet on your drive to/from the airport.

Ya never know.......
 
frfly172 said:
The weight of the helmet and comfort especially on long flights.Also would you have to provide one for your passengers?The pilots that would feel safer in a helmet probably want an aircraft with a parachute installed.I do however go with suspenders when flying over water.
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Helmet weight does not need to be an issue if a lightweight helmet is enough to keep you conscious. I ski in helmets all day long when I am teaching, and the weight is not an issue. I think from a liability standpoint you would look really bad if you wore a helmet but did not provide one to a passenger. I think a helmet might be most important when flying over water. Why go to the trouble of putting on an inflatable vest and packing a life raft, when hitting a wave is likely to knock you out. Kayakers and other whitewater folks wear helmets and flotation devices so they do not get knocked out and float face down.

The suspenders might be a good idea for distributing the additional load if you have a serious over water emergency but no flotation device or life raft.
 
There are a lot of GA aircraft I wear a helmet in. Pitts, Extra 300, T-6 etc... Uhhhh, in a 152? No, no no no no no and again, no. Please no!
 
Frank said:
I have been thinking about helmets for two main reasons. First, becoming unconscious in a ditching, and second, becoming unconscious after a landing that damages the airplane and that also leads to fire. Helmets might also provide some mitigation of head injuries, but keeping you conscious seems to offer some real benefits. I know that today helmet use is rare, but when I started flying most of us didn't use headsets to preserve our hearing, and we rode bicycles and skied without benefit of helmets, but times have changed. I am not suggesting new rules, just some thought on the issue.

If you think helmets might have something to offer, then what kind of helmets would you think would work well? what might be some downsides to using helmets?
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For normal operations I don't see a need for them. As for the downside the helmet will likely interface with your headset.
 
Neal Howard said:
Cropduster pilots wear helmets all the time... for reasons of enhanced crash survivability to just simply preventing themselves from getting too many lumps on their noggin's from bashing their heads around the cockpit while flying in low altitude thermal turbulence. The helmets used by them would be suitable for any other GA flying... but they're not cheap and equipping them with quality ANR headphones is even more expensive due to the difficulty of fitting ANR earcups into the helmets. They're also very heavy and uncomfortable, and hot inside and when you sweat in them a lot, they'll get smelly and be a possible source of bacterial and/or fungal infections too. Wearing a helmet while flying a Cessna/Piper/spamcan will get you laughed at too.
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I worked with a cropduster that refused to wear a helmet. He had a buddy (fellow cropduster) that crashed in the middle of a field. When they got to the plane, they thought he was unconscious but it turns out the weight of the helmet actually broke his neck and killed him. After that, the guy I worked with wouldn't wear a helmet any more.

Most of the guys I worked with said the helmet was more for rocking around in the cockpit in the bumps while flying like you mentioned.

I have seen one guy that always wears a fighter-pilot-style helmet when flying his small 2-place plane. The general consensus at the fly-in I was at is that he is a douche.
 
Personally, I wouldn't wear one for placid GA flying. Skiing, biking, and those kinds of things have a lot of potential for the kinds of impacts where a helmet will make a difference. I'd guess that the amount of scenarios in which a helmet will make a difference is far less in an airplane that's just buzzing around (not doing acro, agriculture, and stuff like that.)

But to each his own. Whatever makes you feel safe and keeps you flying.
 
I might wear one if it could incorporate a lightweight air conditioner. Or actually a very small cooling unit attached to the helmet via a small hose. It would just take a small amount of cooling and a small fan. And building in a headset would offset some of the weight.

I might have to look into making one of those things myself.
 
What about bringing one in the plane with you and only putting it on as part of your emergency landing checklist.
 
I think I'd look a little silly wearing a helmet with shorts, tank top, and sandals.
 
JHW said:
I think I'd look a little silly wearing a helmet with shorts, tank top, and sandals.
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You wear a tank top? I've been known to go topless in the plane on hot days. Then again, your Travel Air has better ventilation.

On that note, what are my temps aloft for tomorrow and Saturday... hmm doesn't look terrible at or above 8k.
 
JHW said:
I think I'd look a little silly wearing a helmet with shorts, tank top, and sandals.
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In Hawaii you would be overdressed:D. I wore flip-flops a few weeks ago over there when we went acro gliding.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
You wear a tank top? I've been known to go topless in the plane on hot days. Then again, your Travel Air has better ventilation.

On that note, what are my temps aloft for tomorrow and Saturday... hmm doesn't look terrible at or above 8k.
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Topless is fine with cloth seats. With leather I might not be able to peel off the seat in case of emergency egress. One thing I do not allow in the plane is dark socks with sandals. It's a latent anti-Austrian bigotry I harbor.
 
JHW said:
Topless is fine with cloth seats. With leather I might not be able to peel off the seat in case of emergency egress. One thing I do not allow in the plane is dark socks with sandals. It's a latent anti-Austrian bigotry I harbor.
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I'm not sure why you would wear socks with sandals anyway. If I'm wearing sandals, I don't want socks.

The 310 seats are sheepskin covers over the leather, so topless works just fine. I need to add sheepskin to the panel since I don't have airbags.
 
Motorcycling, skiing, rock climbing are all activities which in the instance of impact, the body is not restrained. In a car or aircraft, the cabin provides protection for your head, provided you are properly restrained in a 3 to 5 point system. Without a HANS device, the helmet would provide limited ability to protect your head and more likely to cause a cervical spine injury. No shoulder strap? Then maybe a helmet would serve a purpose.
 
I was a long time army helicopter pilot...I would quit flying if the norm was to wear a helmet again for GA flying other than cases mentioned....
 
Non Compos Mentis said:
If you're going to wear a helmet when flying for a $100 hamburger, I hope you're wearing the helmet on your drive to/from the airport.
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What a dumb retort. I'm not flying surrounded by a meticulously engineered energy-absorbing crash structure, injury preventing panels, and 8 airbags, all of which are standard in any car today. Of course I would rather want a helmet in a 172.
 
Frank said:
If you think helmets might have something to offer, then what kind of helmets would you think would work well? what might be some downsides to using helmets?
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Here's my note pad, although be advised that I have not bought one yet!

http://www.backcountrypilot.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=6089
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Gentec, Gallet to name a few. Gentec conjures up military surplus, and are used
widely by hotshot crews, Park Service, and probably other agencies. Gallet is
top-shelf, with good ANR, quality visor options, custom fit, etc...
----
Oregon Aero seems to do a thriving business in providing fixes for helmets that
have become uncomfortable.
----
Bottom line: Gallet helmets are designed for the forces we'll see when we crash
our Cubs, while Gentec helmets are designed for the forces you'll see when you
punch out of your F-22. In short, the Gallet helmet is the right one for most
of us. That being said, I prefer the Gentec single knob visor design.
----
Keep in mind the fast jet helmets are designed to protect your head during
ejections, cat shots, and to keep your noggin safe when it's bouncing off the
canopy during high g maneuvers. Probably fine for most GA flying, but they are
not designed to protect you from high impact. That is the job of the helicopter
helmets. They're bigger and heavier but offer a higher degree of protection.
----
Gentex (not Gentec) is the primary supplier of aviator's helmets for the military. They produce several varieties of helmets, for a variety of applications. They are NOT ALL designed for use in fighter aircraft. In fact, the most widely used helicopter helmets are Gentex helmets.

That said, I really prefer the Gallet helmets, for several reasons:

1) the only vendor for civilian purchase of new Gentex helmets has a TERRIBLE fitting system, and has an even worse track record of getting helmets to fit their customers.
2) the Gallet helmets are lighter than almost any of the Gentex helmets.
3) the Gallet helmets, sold by Merit Apparel, DO have a GREAT fitting system (order the Oregon Aero Fit kit--it's worth it).
4) the Gallet ANR in my opinion, is a better system than the Gentex ANR system.

Fit is everything with helmets.
----
If you have a military helmet (or headset) the impedance is different so you'll have to get a converter for civilian radios.
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http://www.oregonaero.com/p69-2001.html
redirects to http://www.oregonaero.com/aviation-helmet-upgrades/aviation-helmet-upgrades
http://www.oregonaero.com/aviation-helmet-upgrades/aviation-helmet-components#zetaliner
----
Peltor G78 - adopted from racing, an off-the-shelf, but lot cheaper than
traditional aero helmets.
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BTW I hate Gentex though I wear it regularly.
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DO I found a LOT of our "loaner" helmets were cracked, or otherwise compromised.
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[Best is] MSA Gallet, period. Nicely equipped with dual visors, Oregon Aero
seals, CEP's and fit kit will push about $1600.
----
Gentex cracks if dropped.
----
I've been flying with a DC-K helmet with LightSpeed Z's installed for several
months and it is pretty darn nice, not perfect but definitely better than a
ball cap. Can't say I would/could wear it for a long X-country ...
----
http://www.backcountrypilot.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=106288#p106288
A-Alpha Halfshell helmet with a David Clark headset -- pictures
----
unlike Gentex, Gallet helmets are crash rated for rotary applications.
----
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/avpages/dchelmet.php <---- unsure if ok
----
* Rob Hamers at Merit Apparel in Florida
http://www.meritapparel.com/pages/products/product.html
----
I'm not sure what the Gallet dealers are putting out, but Gentex helmets are
indeed rated for rotary application, you just have to select the applicable
model. The HGU-33, and HGU-55's were originally designed to protect mellons
from ejections, thus more kevlar in the top of the helmet, the HGU-84s, and
HGU-56s are specifically designed for fore and aft impacts more likely in
helicopters (or bush flying, pipeline patrol, wildlife survey's, etc)

Continue in http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showthread.php?t=49699
http://www.gibson-barnes.com/Gentex+Helmets/id/18/cat_id/28/
http://www.davidclark.com/Headsetpgs/k10.htm
http://www.protechelmet.com/products.asp?cat=14 -- Protec A-Bravo Half Shell
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The ultralight guys seem to be content with Lynx and Comtronics helmets, but remember two things: 1) their fuel tanks a tiiiiny, so they do not wear them for 8 hours straight, 2) they are by definition cheap people who skip on everything that can save 10 cents.
 
If I were flying low level, ( pipeline patrol, fire suppression, medevac helo, etc.) I would wear one. But based on more than a few years sitting in a military helo with a cement block on my head I'll pass for any other application. :nono:
 
Joan Claybrook pushed motorcycle helmet laws because (duh) head injuries cause most fatalities.

Any good statist will immediately see the benefit to society - Save those hospital bills that we all must collectively pay for.

Imagine how many automobile fatalities could be prevented with helmets for the driver and all passengers? But this won't happen because the target size is too big - it would be political suicide.

But the GA target is politically insignificant, same as motorcyclists, and we could easily see helmet laws passed for GA.

So please, shut up, and wear a helmet if you want to.
 
JohnAJohnson said:
Any good statist will immediately see the benefit to society - Save those hospital bills that we all must collectively pay for.
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not always. A statist waiting on an organ transplant list might see the greater good in young healthy people riding without helmets.
 
I think you have to weight the inconvenience of wearing the helmet against the added safety it provides. While some have described how uncomfortable a helmet can be, if you get one that fits right, they aren't all that bad. I wear a SPH-5 for work and I have no problems with the fit. I wear a skull cap underneath to keep sweat off the liner and prevent hot spots. Only time it's a bit of an annoyance is wearing goggles on long flights or hot days were the A/C hasn't kicked in yet. Also, I've seen enough bird strikes through windscreens to know the visor can protect your eyes from debris.

It's like the whole flight suit and flight gloves argument. You have to compare the odds of needing the equipment in a crash with the problems of dressing up with all that junk before you fly. Only you can answer that.
 
Velocity173 said:
I think you have to weight the inconvenience of wearing the helmet against the added safety it provides. While some have described how uncomfortable a helmet can be, if you get one that fits right, they aren't all that bad. I wear a SPH-5 for work and I have no problems with the fit. I wear a skull cap underneath to keep sweat off the liner and prevent hot spots. Only time it's a bit of an annoyance is wearing goggles on long flights or hot days were the A/C hasn't kicked in yet. Also, I've seen enough bird strikes through windscreens to know the visor can protect your eyes from debris.

It's like the whole flight suit and flight gloves argument. You have to compare the odds of needing the equipment in a crash with the problems of dressing up with all that junk before you fly. Only you can answer that.
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i note in your picture you are wearing shorts
 
The most important thing you can do to improve your chances of surviving a crash is get a shoulder harness, if your plane isn't already so equipped.

So many crashes involve the face smashing into the yoke. A full-face helmet would help with that, but a shoulder harness would be a more obvious solution.
 
zaitcev said:
Here's my note pad, although be advised that I have not bought one yet!



The ultralight guys seem to be content with Lynx and Comtronics helmets, but remember two things: 1) their fuel tanks a tiiiiny, so they do not wear them for 8 hours straight, 2) they are by definition cheap people who skip on everything that can save 10 cents.
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My airplane is just a step above an ultralight. I started flying ultralights and have friends whom fly them. We are not cheap people but people with a limited budget. But we are not cheap. We keep our airplanes or aircraft's in perfect shape skimping on nothing.

I fly my small 320 lbs eab using a Comtronics helmet. But like you stated I never fly over 1 hour. When I first started flying I posted this question on some forums. I heard all the same things that are being stated hear.

So I do what I do and let others do as they want. So far it has worked for me.

Tony
 
JHW said:
i note in your picture you are wearing shorts
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LOL! Yeah but I had a long sleeve shirt on so I'm good. :) Unless it's 100 % wool or cotton I don't think it's going to make much of a difference anyway. I've seen pics of what polyester and nylon melted to skin and it ain't pretty.
 
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Warlock said:
I was a long time army helicopter pilot...I would quit flying if the norm was to wear a helmet again for GA flying other than cases mentioned....
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Air Force helicopters, but yeah, no way. If it is something that would require a helmet, I will fly something else. I wear a Halo headset so that I don't have to wear a head clamp.

Oops, I do wear a helmet - cotton in summer and leather shearling lined in winter. I don't think those are the topic here. ;)
 
Plenty of time in a SPH-4 with first gen Goggles and a one pound counter wieght will get you hating a helmet in about 20 min....Even a IHAD's in an AH-64 custom fitted to your head is painful after 2-3 hours...I've lived a good life so if it ends, its shorts and a 13oz headset for me...
 
I flew on a training mission with CAP a while ago. Pilot wore slacks and a poloshirt, the guy in the front right seat came fully equipped with flight-suit and a helmet. Thought it was a bit funny, but well, takes all kinds. 10 minutes into the flight we took out a bigger bird (probably a crow), luckily it hit the strut and didn't come through the windshield. After we landed to clean up the bird guts and check for damage, the helmeted observer mentioned 'and now you know why I wear this silly thing'.

Most bird strikes happen at low altitudes. So if you do anything that involves poking around at bird altitudes (Ag, survey, pipeline), wearing at least eye protection is not entirely crazy.
 
I'd wear a HU-11 (very light 'fighter style' with pull down visor) helmet flying Ag and some days flying pipeline in the PA-12 when the turbulence would be so bad I'd get slammed into the tubes even cinched down in a Hooker harness. In a typical GA plane/flight, I don't wear it, but I ride motorcycles in shorts, flip flops, and sunglasses.
 
CJones said:
I worked with a cropduster that refused to wear a helmet. He had a buddy (fellow cropduster) that crashed in the middle of a field. When they got to the plane, they thought he was unconscious but it turns out the weight of the helmet actually broke his neck and killed him. After that, the guy I worked with wouldn't wear a helmet any more.

Most of the guys I worked with said the helmet was more for rocking around in the cockpit in the bumps while flying like you mentioned.
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I don't see the point of wearing a heavy helmet unless there is a high risk of your head smashing into something at a fairly high speed.

If the aim is to just protect your head from dings when rattling around inside a Pawnee or whatever, I'd guess a lightweight "climbing" helmet would be enough. I see a lot of show riggers (and others) wear them in lieu of a hard hat; been thinking about getting one myself (to replace the fairly heavy wide-brim hard hat I wear sometimes on the job). They work well for protecting your noggin when working in a swarm of people furiously moving heavy stuff around, often at head height. And if someone drops a shackle or something from the grid (anywhere from 20 to 120 feet above you) you probably won't end up in the ER. If you fall off a stage and tag the corner of a road box on the way down, it will make a difference there, too. Obviously, climbers wear them to protect against falling rocks, ice, or hardware.
Nowhere near the protection of a good motorcycle or aviation helmet, but much lighter and better ventilated... kind of like a vented hard hat, but closer-fitting and with straps to secure it.
 
weilke said:
I flew on a training mission with CAP a while ago. Pilot wore slacks and a poloshirt, the guy in the front right seat came fully equipped with flight-suit and a helmet. Thought it was a bit funny, but well, takes all kinds. 10 minutes into the flight we took out a bigger bird (probably a crow), luckily it hit the strut and didn't come through the windshield. After we landed to clean up the bird guts and check for damage, the helmeted observer mentioned 'and now you know why I wear this silly thing'.

Most bird strikes happen at low altitudes. So if you do anything that involves poking around at bird altitudes (Ag, survey, pipeline), wearing at least eye protection is not entirely crazy.
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Good point on the eye pro, I got lucky when I had a windshield smashed that it was the right side!

Another thing to consider if you are going to wear a helmet is emergency egress. Having practiced it with a helmet and my in-progress race car it is amazing the difference having a bigger head has when you are in a hurry. NASA also requires a HANS device that will add an additional hurdle.
 
I was thinking more along the lines of a skateboarding helmet- just enough to keep the rough part of the interior from knocking you out. I know my skiing helmet and the skateboarding helmet I use on a bicycle are not that much of a nuisance.
 
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