Helicopter pilot schools and advice

C

Carley O'Burke

Filing Flight Plan
Joined
Mar 25, 2019
Messages
6
Display Name
Display name:
iamthecarley
Hello, my name is Carley and I WILL be a helicopter pilot - there is absolutely nothing else I want to do besides fly. I am currently in the saving-money phase and am scheduling a medical examination this week but I am 29 and I hear the clock ticking. Although I have nowhere near what I need to begin actual training yet (without financing), I am very aware that time is money and vice versa and don't want to wait too long until I do have cash to go forward. My questions are these (any and all advice, input, guidance is so much appreciated):

1. I am compiling all the information I can find on rotor wing flight schools in my general area, but there seems to be enough conflicting, unclear, or outdated information online that I'd like to ask people. I live in southeast Texas with less than 2 hours commute to Houston. What are good places/CFIs to consider, and where should I stay away from and why?

2. Does ATP flight school offer helicopter pilot training, or do they only train for fixed wing?

3. Would it be feasible or a complete waste of my time to get certified as fixed wing first and then crossover to rotor wing?

4. What other suggestions does anybody have? What am I missing, and what should I be asking? I am hungry for information and guidance of any kind.

Thank you all in advance!


Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk
 
I have 0 rotor wing experience, so I can't answer many of your questions. I do think it would be a waste of time to get your PPL ASEL and then move into rotor if you are planning on going commercial. One common thing I do see posted on boards by helicopter pilots is that the training is significantly more expensive and the jobs are significantly harder to come by and pay less. You are competing with guys who come out of the military with thousands of hours and valuable experience. Not trying to be full of negativity, just forwarding what I have read. What I would start doing though is studying up on the FAR/AIM and the FAAs handbooks they publish. Get a jump start on the knowledge materials for the written tests. Do not wait to take the written tests.

https://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/handbooks_manuals/aviation/helicopter_flying_handbook/

Also if it makes you feel any better, I am 28 and am about 90 hours into fixed wing with goals to get my commercial. Not trying to fly for the airlines, but I am trying to make a career out of aviation. Many other people on here at all age ranges doing the same.
 
Last edited:
Thank you so much. No I don't hear negativity, I don't want to just hear what I'd like to hear regardless of the accuracy, I want real answers, so I appreciate it.

My second choice would to become an ag pilot. But I've heard those jobs are also hard to obtain. To be honest, anything in the air is just fine. I don't want to not pursue this simply because I don't get what I want when I want it.

I spoke with someone who suggested investing in an aircraft for my training. What are your thoughts? Although I most certainly don't have the funds to invest in that yet, if it is a good idea I will dogear it for when I can.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk
 
Carley O'Burke said:
Hello, my name is Carley and I WILL be a helicopter pilot - there is absolutely nothing else I want to do besides fly. I am currently in the saving-money phase and am scheduling a medical examination this week but I am 29 and I hear the clock ticking. Although I have nowhere near what I need to begin actual training yet (without financing), I am very aware that time is money and vice versa and don't want to wait too long until I do have cash to go forward. My questions are these (any and all advice, input, guidance is so much appreciated):

1. I am compiling all the information I can find on rotor wing flight schools in my general area, but there seems to be enough conflicting, unclear, or outdated information online that I'd like to ask people. I live in southeast Texas with less than 2 hours commute to Houston. What are good places/CFIs to consider, and where should I stay away from and why?

2. Does ATP flight school offer helicopter pilot training, or do they only train for fixed wing?

3. Would it be feasible or a complete waste of my time to get certified as fixed wing first and then crossover to rotor wing?

4. What other suggestions does anybody have? What am I missing, and what should I be asking? I am hungry for information and guidance of any kind.

Thank you all in advance!


Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

How about the Army?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
If you want to get paid to be in the air - for helicopters - your best bet is military training. If military is a no go, the road is going to be pricey regardless of fixed wing or fling wing. If you go part 61 you're going to have to pay for at least 250 hours of experience before you can get paid to fly. This could be minimized to about 60-70 hours or so with an instructor if you are GOOD. But that still leaves about 200 additional hours of plane rental. The theoretical break even point between it being cheaper to rent vs cheaper to own on a per hour cost is around 100 hours per year. But then you still have to acquire the aircraft. Which, unfortunately probably isn't going to be a helicopter. But you can sell the aircraft after you're done with it.

After you get that 250 hours your paid options to accumulate enough hours to get a flying career are going to be flight instruction, banner towing, glider towing, MAYBE some sight seeing gigs. Most flying jobs outside the airlines are unfortunately driven by insurance. Most/all corporate gigs are going to require a ATP (1500 hours) and then on top of that probably another 1000 hours to satisfy insurance requirements. There's a few here that have done the airline route (paging @jordane93 ) and they can give you more details.

If you want to get in the air and get paid quick (relative term) get a 6 figure job and pay for all your own training, win the lotto, or find someone else (Uncle Sam, a different rich uncle, or...well...not going there) to pay for it.
 
Bellanca_Pilot said:
How about the Army?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
I've been asked that before. My reason at this time for not going that route is that I want a more direct way to be certified commercially. I also feel that it would be somewhat disingenuous of me too go that route. I am not opposed to it so much as I don't think it's as direct as I'm wanting. Please give me more information if I'm off track.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk
 
EdFred said:
If you want to get paid to be in the air - for helicopters - your best bet is military training. If military is a no go, the road is going to be pricey regardless of fixed wing or fling wing. If you go part 61 you're going to have to pay for at least 250 hours of experience before you can get paid to fly. This could be minimized to about 60-70 hours or so with an instructor if you are GOOD. But that still leaves about 200 additional hours of plane rental. The theoretical break even point between it being cheaper to rent vs cheaper to own on a per hour cost is around 100 hours per year. But then you still have to acquire the aircraft. Which, unfortunately probably isn't going to be a helicopter. But you can sell the aircraft after you're done with it.

After you get that 250 hours your paid options to accumulate enough hours are going to be flight instruction, banner towing, glider towing, MAYBE some sight seeing gigs. Most flying jobs outside the airlines are unfortunately driven by insurance. Most/all corporate gigs are going to require a ATP (1500 hours) and then on top of that probably another 1000 hours to satisfy insurance requirements. There's a few here that have done the airline route (paging @jordane93 ) and they can give you more details.

If you want to get in the air and get paid quick (relative term) get a 6 figure job and pay for all your own training, win the lotto, or find someone else (Uncle Sam, a different rich uncle, or...well...not going there)
Click to expand...
Thank you for all the information. That exactly why I want many points of view to help me make the best decision I can.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk
 
Carley O'Burke said:
1. I am compiling all the information I can find on rotor wing flight schools in my general area, but there seems to be enough conflicting, unclear, or outdated information online that I'd like to ask people. I live in southeast Texas with less than 2 hours commute to Houston. What are good places/CFIs to consider, and where should I stay away from and why?

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

There is a helicopter flight school at E70 near New Braunfels TX. Low cost of living here.
 
It sounds like your first decision is just that, decided FW vs. rotor. If rotor, expect to go through CFII and then get 1000 hours built up before being eligible for that next job flying a turbine such as tours. It is a long road but worth it if you love to fly helicopters. As a side note, my son followed in my footsteps and TODAY he starts his first turbine job flying tours after doing just what I described.
 
In addition to the advice already given.... start making contacts in the helicopter world. Of all walks and employers. Build your network of who knows who and what they can do (alliteration ftw!)

With a good network, you can find lots of unadvertised opportunities for both training, experience, mentoring, and possible employment.


Someone to add to your list is Pat Brown, who is AOPA's "You Can Fly" Ambassador for Texas. And he is based in Houston. While he is more plugged in to the fixed wing community than rotary, he might have some good info for you of who to go talk to. He can be found at pat.brown@aopa.org. And tell him Mike Farlow from Denton, TX said howdy!
 
FWIW, Sevier County Choppers in Pigeon Forge, TN offers a helicopter program and they guarantee you a CFI job and also a Turbine job doing tours if you complete their program. Might be worth looking into.
 
retpd2001 said:
It sounds like your first decision is just that, decided FW vs. rotor. If rotor, expect to go through CFII and then get 1000 hours built up before being eligible for that next job flying a turbine such as tours. It is a long road but worth it if you love to fly helicopters. As a side note, my son followed in my footsteps and TODAY he starts his first turbine job flying tours after doing just what I described.
Click to expand...
Congratulations to your son! You must be proud and he must be too.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk
 
AggieMike88 said:
In addition to the advice already given.... start making contacts in the helicopter world. Of all walks and employers. Build your network of who knows who and what they can do (alliteration ftw!)

With a good network, you can find lots of unadvertised opportunities for both training, experience, mentoring, and possible employment.


Someone to add to your list is Pat Brown, who is AOPA's "You Can Fly" Ambassador for Texas. And he is based in Houston. While he is more plugged in to the fixed wing community than rotary, he might have some good info for you of who to go talk to. He can be found at pat.brown@aopa.org. And tell him Mike Farlow from Denton, TX said howdy!
Click to expand...
Thank you!

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk
 
Carley O'Burke said:
I've been asked that before. My reason at this time for not going that route is that I want a more direct way to be certified commercially... Please give me more information if I'm off track.
Click to expand...

At the end of Warrant Officer Flight Training, walk down to the FAA and take the military competency test and it’s done. Not much more direct than that.

Carley O'Burke said:
...I also feel that it would be somewhat disingenuous of me too go that route. I am not opposed to it so much as I don't think it's as direct as I'm wanting. Please give me more information if I'm off track.
Click to expand...

Of course you’ve got to want to serve, first.

I don’t understand the disingenuous comment though. Most (not all) civilian RW missions are flown by the military. Would you consider the National Guard as option if by more direct you mean getting a civilian job to fly helicopters.
 
A good breakdown on the civilian path to getting started as a commercial helicopter pilot. Be prepared to take out some serious loans.

http://www.autorotate.org/PHPAInfo/BecomingAHelicopterPilot.aspx

If you wanted to bypass all that, then the military route would be the way to go. No, it wouldn’t be as direct because you have an obligation to them first. However, you wouldn’t be paying out $50K, then getting hired as a CFI but your training would be paid for and you’d most likely make more military than civilian...at least the first several years. Not to mention, you’d be flying some serious hardware that will set you up for higher paying civ jobs when you get out. I’d caution the military route though, as it’s not for everyone. You’d need to be committed to serve at least 6-8 years (Army WOFT). Can’t stress enough what TCABM said above. You have to want to serve. The training is intense and there’s a significant amount of additional BS that goes with military service. Outside of the Army, you won’t be getting a guaranteed helo spot. Not that you should take that in consideration though, since all branches have helos to choose from.

If you elect to stay civilian then go to a school like Ryan mentioned above (Sevierville). I work with several guys who went there and the owner works for our company as an EMS pilot. Just saw him the other day actually. Just be prepared to work several years for somewhat low pay ($40-50K) before moving into a decent paying job. Even then, it won’t come close to the major airlines unless you get some overseas contract and most of those are dominated by former military.

Good luck.
 
Last edited:
Hey guys!

My name is Clay, and I'm a new one here. I'm also thinking of becoming a single-engine plane pilot, but I'm not sure what does that requires. Can anyone help with some links to resources where I can read more about it? Thanks. I'm from California)
 
Beginning your flight training in airplanes will get you into the world of aviation quicker and cost a whole lot less.

Many of those less expensive hours will count toward advanced certificates as "powered aircraft." Look at 61.129(c) Aeronautical experience.

Only 50 hours in helicopters are required for a commercial certificate and only 35 of those must be PIC time.

In other words, aeronautical experience is more than just wiggling a cyclic stick and can be gained in any aircraft...
 
I recommend you search for a 99s chapter in your area and join them. You don't have to be a pilot (or student) to join them.
My chapter has 3 copter pilots out of the 36 members. You may get lucky and find a helo aviatrix near you who can give you more advice/insights.
 
Definitely a prime time to get in the industry. What the article doesn’t go into though is the bottleneck of 200-300 hr pilots trying to get their first CFI gig. Plenty of COM RW pilots out there. The industry is short on the top not the bottom. If you can stick it out through the CFI / tour years and get at least 2,000 hrs, the door will be wide open. Or, save a little money by getting FW ratings and go to the regionals like everyone else is doing. ;)

http://rotorfx.com/its-official-helicopter-pilot-and-mechanic-shortage-verified/
 
First of all, for get about the clock. I personally have worked with 2 helicopter pilots who are in their 80s. <--- that is not a typo.

I know several people who didn't even start flying until their 40s and 50's. <--- again, not a typo. It's not so much how late you start, but how late do you want to fly? Me personally I started flying when I was a 13 and I'm 60 today. I'm in great shape and can easily see myself flying another 20 years. I L-O-V-E flying. I never get tired of it.

Before I get to your questions, i have a question for you. Why WILL you be a helicopter pilot? What do you want to do? Just fly for fun or do you want to pursue a career flying helicopters. If it's just for fun, I'm sorry but I would highly discourage it. It's far to expensive and much to dangerous to be a low time, occasional helicopter pilot. I always tell people the most worthless rating is Helicopter PPL.

If you want to pursue a career, well then good on you and 'Welcome to the Dark Side".

#1. Welcome to 'The Internet"... I always tell people the best (least expensive) way to get through flight training, is to, if at all possible, fly every day until you're done. This means a fat wallet. The longer you drag it out and the slower you pay for it, the more money it's going to cost you in the long run. The faster you can go, the cheaper it's going to be. As for flight schools, find one that has enough helicopter vs students that you can be assured there is always one available for your lesson. This goes for instructors too. There's nothing worse than showing up for your lesson and the helicopter is in maintenance, or out on a cross country, or the instructor is sick, etc... and while we're on the subject, it's ok to use different instructors. You should, you'll learn different things from different instructors. Consider the older guys too, the one who's there instructing because he enjoys instructing, not just because he's building hours for that first 'real' job. So taking these things into consideration, find a school that you think fits the bill. Some people travel across country, or even around the world to go to a flight school that can offer these things.

#2. I don't think so, but I don't know. Call them and ask.

#3. It depends. There's a lot of variables here. I started as a fixed wing pilot and flew a long career in Alaska before deciding to get my helicopter ratings, so it worked for me. But the question is, Do you want to fly airplanes? If yes, then do it. If you only want to fly helicopters, then flying airplanes first will not help you in the long run. It'll even make it more expensive.

#4. Interview your potential instructor. Ask them what kind of flying experience they have. Ask them how much time they have. Ask them why they're instructing. Ask them how many students the've passed and how many failures they've had. Ask them what's the average flight time required for their students to go from mere mortal to helicopter pilot. If you have the money to fly everyday, or at least several times a week, and a dedicated student, you should be able to obtain your PPL in the 40-50 hour range, otherwise expect longer. Ask the flight school what happens if the helicopter you normally fly isn't available? What if the instructor isn't available? Some will try to tell you you can't (or shouldn't) fly with another instructor. BS. You're the customer, this is your money, and it's a good experience as well. Ask them if they'll give you a block rate (discounted price) for paying down X number of dollars. Most places will.

Most schools use the Robinson R-22. I'm not a fan, but there is a financial consideration here. If you train in something other than the R-22, and for whatever reason that helicopter becomes unavailable, and you end up having to transition to a R-22, there is a time requirement before you can solo. Moral of the story, as much as I hate to say it, just do your initial training in the R-22 so you don't end up having to spend more money than necessary. Another point, if you plan on getting your instrument, which you should if you plan on being a professional helicopter pilot, again, just do all your training in the R-22 because dollars to doughnuts, that's going to be your instrument trainer.

I'm sure there's more, but that's about all I've got for now off the top of my head.
Best of luck to you,

PJ
 
@Carley O'Burke

Do you have any Army National Guard helicopter units in your area? When I was stationed out in California (and lived in Reno) the Army National Guard unit based at Stead was trying really hard to get my son to go to Basic Training -> Warrant Officer Candidate School -> flight school right off the street on their dime (he was 19 at the time). They're flying both Chinooks and Blackhawks and in desperate need of additional pilots. He went a different route in the end, but they were serious about getting him to join.

Can't hurt to stop by and speak with the recruiting team or one of the pilots.

Cheers,
Brian
 
Did someone already mention that you should never ever under any circumstances pre-pay for an entire rating ? If your training is going well and there is a discount for buying 10hrs at a time, you can consider risking that money. But don't become another one of the sheep that puts down $50,000 with a helicopter school that promptly closes after cashing your check.
 
Just to mention another path. There are some police agencies that train their own pilots. The typical progression is street cop first, then tactical flight officer/medic then pilot trainee, then pilot. The odds of succeeding are low, but if you can get in that way, you get your training for 'free'. Oh, and it comes with a law enforcement pension. Did I mention the odds are low ?
 
Last edited:
While both the OP and the second questioner are young, I'd point out: Make sure you can qualify for the highest-level Medical you might need. That's probably a First Class Medical. It would suck to do all this training and find out some unexpected health issue blocks your career path. I'm sure others can provide additional information.
 
weilke said:
Did someone already mention that you should never ever under any circumstances pre-pay for an entire rating ? If your training is going well and there is a discount for buying 10hrs at a time, you can consider risking that money. But don't become another one of the sheep that puts down $50,000 with a helicopter school that promptly closes after cashing your check.
Click to expand...

G-Man said:
While both the OP and the second questioner are young, I'd point out: Make sure you can qualify for the highest-level Medical you might need. That's probably a First Class Medical. It would suck to do all this training and find out some unexpected health issue blocks your career path. I'm sure others can provide additional information.
Click to expand...

These are both excellent points and should definitely be followed. You'd be surprised how many flight schools out there, both fixed and rotor, who have closed their doors over night leaving students stranded and broke.

PJ
 
G-Man said:
While both the OP and the second questioner are young, I'd point out: Make sure you can qualify for the highest-level Medical you might need. That's probably a First Class Medical. It would suck to do all this training and find out some unexpected health issue blocks your career path. I'm sure others can provide additional information.
Click to expand...

Yes. This!

Two years ago I was thinking about buying $15,000 worth of prepaid helicopter lessons at American Helicopters for $10,000 from a young man who had an indefinite delay in getting his medical. I ended up not doing it as there was a non-zero risk of my wife smothering me in my sleep had I done this ;-)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top