Has uAvionix announced an AV-30C with magnetometer?

I wonder how accurate the internal magnetometer will be? Garmin and Aspen require magnetometers to be mounted remotely in magnetically clean locations on the airframe to maintain accuracy.
 
chemgeek said:
I wonder how accurate the internal magnetometer will be? Garmin and Aspen require magnetometers to be mounted remotely in magnetically clean locations on the airframe to maintain accuracy.
Click to expand...

I would think it would pretty easy to make accurate since it should be pretty easy to electronically compensate it for errors.

Brian
 
brcase said:
I would think it would pretty easy to make accurate since it should be pretty easy to electronically compensate it for errors.
Click to expand...

The remote magnetometer for the Garmin G5 system is a three axis device, which I suspect would be impractical to compensate in all three dimensions in a complex and potentially dynamic electromagnetic environment such as an aircraft panel. I suspect that is why they need to be mounted remotely to accurately function.
 
I have seen no mention of it with regards to the certified variant, but the service bulletin for the latest firmware update for the experimental variant explicitly talks about the internal magnetometer, and having to send the unit back for hardware modification if desired. Also talks about the various modes it can be used (aiding DG only, or aiding DG and AHRS) https://uavionix.com/downloads/AV-3...in Upgrade to 2.1.1 UAV-1005757-001 Rev A.pdf I'll be very curious how well it works.
 
Good catch @Ryan Klems !

It could be the case that the MOD-002 of the certified version has the internal magnetometer but the firmware for it hasn't been released yet. Is it possible that they're simplifying the C/E production lines and don't ever plan on enabling it for the C version?
 
Last edited:
Have they managed to get the stupid thing to not precess like crazy? I flew one of them in the loaner Navion my mechanic gave me and it was darn near unusable.
 
flyingron said:
Have they managed to get the stupid thing to not precess like crazy? I flew one of them in the loaner Navion my mechanic gave me and it was darn near unusable.
Click to expand...
Apparently so, if you have MOD-002 of the E version and hooked up to a GPS.
 
asicer said:
I guess it's accurate enough to assist the DG but not accurate enough to be considered a fully slaved system like the G5?
https://uavionix.com/downloads/AV-30-E/AV-30-E Pilots Guide UAV-1004233-001 Rev D.pdf

View attachment 99936
Click to expand...

That sounds reasonable. The internal magnetometer probably helps fix the drift issue the units are experiencing without magnetometer input. The G5 HSI is rock solid with the remote megnetometer, and if the solution is off by more than a few degrees, you get an alert on the display. I sometimes see this alert momentarily during initial climbout, when one of the G5s disagrees with the other by a couple of degrees. It always resolves in a few seconds.
 
Does this apply only to the E version or the C version as well?
 
I spoke to one of their engineers at Oshkosh, who pretty frankly said they have no plans right now to make the certified version work with a mangetometer. The short version of a longer conversation was "it's a lot of work to re-certify it with one, so we're just not going to do it." Didn't leave me with a very high opinion of the company if they don't have or won't dedicate the engineering resources to a feature that the market more or less demands. Turned us off from Uavionix and sent us to the Garmin tent. Say what you will about Garmin, but lack of resources isn't in the vocabulary over there.
 
Yea, I like my AV-30C but I don't use the DG heading function anymore, just switched it to GPS track and use the compass if I want to know my heading. I emailed Uavionix about it and asked if I could install the latest update for the 30E and they said I could but it would then display itself as being an E on the boot-up screen. I'm not sure if the update fixes the heading drift issue so I never bothered doing it.
 
bradg33 said:
I spoke to one of their engineers at Oshkosh, who pretty frankly said they have no plans right now to make the certified version work with a mangetometer. The short version of a longer conversation was "it's a lot of work to re-certify it with one, so we're just not going to do it." Didn't leave me with a very high opinion of the company if they don't have or won't dedicate the engineering resources to a feature that the market more or less demands. Turned us off from Uavionix and sent us to the Garmin tent. Say what you will about Garmin, but lack of resources isn't in the vocabulary over there.
Click to expand...

Sounds like exactly the same approach uAvionix is taking with their skyLIght product to have a right wing match to the skyBeacon. Meanwhile lots of other products from them get certified and to market. In retrospect that makes other options for ADS-B out look more attractive, sigh.
 
From where do you download the latest firmware upgrade for the AV-30E?
 
Last edited:
bradg33 said:
I spoke to one of their engineers at Oshkosh, who pretty frankly said they have no plans right now to make the certified version work with a mangetometer. The short version of a longer conversation was "it's a lot of work to re-certify it with one, so we're just not going to do it." Didn't leave me with a very high opinion of the company if they don't have or won't dedicate the engineering resources to a feature that the market more or less demands. Turned us off from Uavionix and sent us to the Garmin tent. Say what you will about Garmin, but lack of resources isn't in the vocabulary over there.
Click to expand...
I don’t understand this comment. The guy was saying if there was a market willing to pay, they’d certify, but there isn’t. The market demanding something has to be big enough to justify spending money to certify something. Otherwise we would be complaining that they want Garmin prices for bandaid type avionics. Their approach allows them to focus their efforts that fit their mission as a company.
 
aggie06 said:
I don’t understand this comment. The guy was saying if there was a market willing to pay, they’d certify, but there isn’t. The market demanding something has to be big enough to justify spending money to certify something. Otherwise we would be complaining that they want Garmin prices for bandaid type avionics. Their approach allows them to focus their efforts that fit their mission as a company.
Click to expand...

Objectively, a magnetometer is a pretty important piece of a modern digital "DG" or HSI. The fact it wasn't certified with one to begin with was a big miss.
 
I've managed for decades with using my wet compass as a magnetometer coupled with a suction DG. And isn't the AV-30 advertised as a simple replacement just for the latter.
 
Bathman said:
I've managed for decades with using my wet compass as a magnetometer coupled with a suction DG. And isn't the AV-30 advertised as a simple replacement just for the latter.
Click to expand...

If you're going to spend a few thousand dollars to buy and install a "modern" replacement, wouldn't you expect it to come with a magnetometer? Especially when the competing product - the G5 - has one for only a little more money?
 
Bathman said:
And isn't the AV-30 advertised as a simple replacement just for the latter.
Click to expand...

Yes but the drift is far more than you'd expect due to precession with a mechanical DG.
 
bradg33 said:
Objectively, a magnetometer is a pretty important piece of a modern digital "DG" or HSI. The fact it wasn't certified with one to begin with was a big miss.
Click to expand...
So it wasn’t designed in a manner that everyone is comfortable with it. That design choice wasn’t hidden. You’re making my point. No one had to buy it.
 
Florida Flyer said:
When linked to a GPS they work great
Click to expand...

Uh, no it does not. I fly with the AV-30C all the time. Heading mode is borderline useless.

The problem is GPS NMEA strings are typically 10Hz in most older devices. I don’t know the rate in say a modern G1k but when hooked up to the GNS400 I would think the strings come in 5 or 10Hz. That’s a lot of lag.
 
Trogdor said:
Uh, no it does not. I fly with the AV-30C all the time. Heading mode is borderline useless...
Click to expand...

Well GPS doesn't give you heading, it gives you your track. If you have the AV-30 in heading mode it's not getting it from the GPS. You can change it to TRK mode and it works fine. Of course it's not giving you your heading but you still have a compass. What do people use heading for nowadays anyway? We used to use it in a calculation with estimated wind to get an idea where we were actually going but GPS does all of that for us now.
 
Last edited:
Silvaire said:
What do people use heading for nowadays anyway? We used to use it in a calculation with estimated wind to get an idea where we were actually going but GPS does all of that for us now.
Click to expand...
Plug it into the GPS (along with IAS and temp) to get estimated wind.

Also, ATC vectors.
 
asicer said:
Plug it into the GPS (along with IAS and temp) to get estimated wind.

Also, ATC vectors.
Click to expand...

Well I already said that but we used VOR bearing and "plugged" it all into one of these
e6b.jpg
But honestly, who does that nowadays? What are you going to do with estimated wind? The GPS is already displaying your track, ground speed and ETA. Not much left to figure out.
ATC vectors is about the only time you use heading and everyone still has a wet compass.

I was just trying to correct the statement that the AV-30 doesn't work when coupled to the GPS because it does, but not for heading, it has to be switched to track.
 
Silvaire said:
Well I already said that
Click to expand...
I said it backwards. :)
Silvaire said:
But honestly, who does that nowadays? What are you going to do with estimated wind?
Click to expand...
I do it for long XC en-route entertainment. I also include it in PIREPS if I get the chance. I wouldn't doubt that I'm in the minority, though.

If the AV30C could output the heading on a ARINC429 bus, the Garmin boxes (GTN-series, GPS175, GNC355, GNX375) can continuously output a wind vector as one of the data fields overlaid on to the map. I'd bet many people would find that useful.
 
asicer said:
...I do it for long XC en-route entertainment...
Click to expand...

Nothing wrong with that :cheerswine:

asicer said:
...If the AV30C could output the heading on a ARINC429 bus, the Garmin boxes (GTN-series, GPS175, GNC355, GNX375) can continuously output a wind vector as one of the data fields overlaid on to the map. I'd bet many people would find that useful.
Click to expand...

Well it depends on where this "heading" data is coming from. For the past 50 years or more airliners have had inertial reference and flux gates (magnetometers) as well as a bunch of other expensive stuff in the quest to get stable heading information all just so they could figure out their track and groundspeed.
But GPS already has that stuff covered so there's not much left for us to do other than follow the magenta line. I'm not sure how well the internal magnetometer works, they normally need to be put out on the wing or somewhere away from any sort of magnetic interference.

The main reason "heading" is still used for anything is because theoretically not everyone has GPS.
 
Installing 2 Av-30-C's next week at annual. I reached out to Uavionix Support and they verified that the current version shipping does include an internal magnetometer to be used in the future to assist with the drift issue. Is the current version the model number ending with -002?


Does the current version of the AV30c contain an internal magnetometer?
Yes, it will be used to aide the drift of the DG with the next service bulletin notice.

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top