Garmin 175, 3 Aspens and LPV

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Hunt-man

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Hunt-man
A buddy has 3 Aspens and wants a 175 installed.
Then the shop says it costs an additional $4000 to have LPV.
I look at Garmin online info and I don't see why this could be. Their advertising sounds like LPV is in the box and ready to go.....
 
Thread works better if the first post began, "..... walk into a bar"
 
AggieMike88 said:
Thread works better if the first post began, "..... walk into a bar"
Click to expand...

A Garmin 175, 3 Aspens and LPV walk into a bar. Garmin asks "What do you call a 5k race with all the ministers of the local churches?" Aspen says "A Rev Run"

LPV says "I just took my PPL written. There was a question about a suitcase sitting on the floor in a dark room that I answered wrong. It really tripped me up"

 
It’s probably a software license thing caused by whatever he bought in the Aspens or an interface issue.

Doesn’t his shop know how to write up a detailed estimate listing what they need to buy?
 
denverpilot said:
It’s probably a software license thing caused by whatever he bought in the Aspens or an interface issue.

Doesn’t his shop know how to write up a detailed estimate listing what they need to buy?
Click to expand...

Ok. He and I were just confused why getting LPV approach capability out of the 175 would be an additional 4k in addition to the 175.
I'll suggest he get a written estimate. This stuff confuses him more than it does me, and I'm confused about it.
 
Should you be working with a shop that is confused about installation issues that he can’t figure out for you and just tosses it over the fence?
 
WDD said:
Should you be working with a shop that is confused about installation issues that he can’t figure out for you and just tosses it over the fence?
Click to expand...

It isn't like that... it is a good shop. My friend isn't good with technical things, especially electronics. He's a VFR pilot. So who know what he had them do on with the Aspens.
He just felt that $4000 in addition seemed very expensive for a box that says it does LPV.
I've been hoping he will get an instrument rating, so I was suggesting the LPV capability.
 
Hunt-man said:
It isn't like that... it is a good shop. My friend isn't good with technical things, especially electronics. He's a VFR pilot. So who know what he had them do on with the Aspens.
He just felt that $4000 in addition seemed very expensive for a box that says it does LPV.
I've been hoping he will get an instrument rating, so I was suggesting the LPV capability.
Click to expand...
It's not the Garmin. By the default configuration, the 175 should be spitting out LPV data. However, the Aspen might need a software license to display the LPV data. Software unlocking seems to be their revenue model. If it's not license locked, then they are wired up incorrectly.
 
It’s because it also requires the install of the gad29b to interface and without that you’d only have a serial connection. LPV requires air data also and you need arinc429 for that via the gad29.. That’s my guess!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Indiana_Pilot said:
It’s because it also requires the install of the gad29b to interface and without that you’d only have a serial connection. LPV requires air data also and you need arinc429 for that via the gad29.. That’s my guess!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Gad29 is only around $500
 
My question is what is the 175 gonna communicate & nav to/with? I thought Garmin mostly likes to play with Garmin? The normal seems to be the G5?
 
The GPS 175 will interface with almost all legacy nav indicators...even a VOA 5. The whole point of the new gps is to make installation and connectivity less expensive. Compatible indicators are listed on ACSpruce info for GPS175.
 
Ie5.jpg just had a Garmin 175, Aspen E5 and a used Garmin GTX330 installed. They removed my DG and TC, moved my AI to the TC's location. Removed my old mode C encoder because the Aspen E5 is now the encoder for the GTX330 with an IFR recertification all for under 3K labor. And yes the GPS 175 and Aspen E5 gives me LPV approach.
 
Doug Reid said:
The GPS 175 will interface with almost all legacy nav indicators...even a VOA 5. The whole point of the new gps is to make installation and connectivity less expensive. Compatible indicators are listed on ACSpruce info for GPS175.
Click to expand...
I've been considering a GPS175 as a budget entry into the gps ifr world. My Cherokee currently has a Narco 12D+ nav/com, Narco ID-825 CDI, and Collins AMR350 audio panel. Stratus ESG transponder for adsb out. ID-825 was not listed as a compatible cdi on the Garmin or Spruce sites. Does that mean it is definitely NOT compatible and I'd have to add another cdi for LPV?

I realize that I'd still have to rely on my current Stratus/iFlyGPS solution for adsb in rather than being able to display traffic on the gps175, but that doesn't concern me. Mostly interested in the most cost-effective way to get IFR capable gps in the plane.
 
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It should interface to the Aspen! You may need an ARINC 429 module for LPV. RS232 will get you LNAV.
 
Hunt-man said:
It isn't like that... it is a good shop. My friend isn't good with technical things, especially electronics. He's a VFR pilot. So who know what he had them do on with the Aspens.
He just felt that $4000 in addition seemed very expensive for a box that says it does LPV.
I've been hoping he will get an instrument rating, so I was suggesting the LPV capability.
Click to expand...

I fly a PC-12 that the only reason we can’t fly LPV, is because Honeywell wants 30 grand for an unlock code.
 
MuseChaser said:
I've been considering a GPS175 as a budget entry into the gps ifr world. My Cherokee currently has a Narco 12D+ nav/com, Narco ID-825 CDI, and Collins AMR350 audio panel. Stratus ESG transponder for adsb out. ID-825 was not listed as a compatible cdi on the Garmin or Spruce sites. Does that mean it is definitely NOT compatible and I'd have to add another cdi for LPV?

I realize that I'd still have to rely on my current Stratus/iFlyGPS solution for adsb in rather than being able to display traffic on the gps175, but that doesn't concern me. Mostly interested in the most cost-effective way to get IFR capable gps in the plane.
Click to expand...

GPS-175 and a G5 HSI and you are covered. Or dual G5s. Then your CDI and annunciation status is right in front of you. No CDI required for IFR. The price of an installed GI-106A/B will take you a long way toward a G5. I removed my GI-106A but am considering whether or not to keep it for an upgrade of NAV/COM 2.
 
chemgeek said:
GPS-175 and a G5 HSI and you are covered. Or dual G5s. Then your CDI and annunciation status is right in front of you. No CDI required for IFR. The price of an installed GI-106A/B will take you a long way toward a G5. I removed my GI-106A but am considering whether or not to keep it for an upgrade of NAV/COM 2.
Click to expand...
Appreciate the reply, and what you suggest makes good sense. I recognize that, IFR-GPS-wise, I'm at the point where I don't know what I don't know....I've studied enough and taken enough practice tests to know I can pass the written, and have flown enough with my CFI to get to the point where we did some approaches and were about to do a cross country (twice over the years before life got in the way), but always using VOR and ILS approaches which is all the capability my plane has.

You wrote, "No CDI required for IFR" ... I thought a connected CDI was required for LPV approaches. Is that incorrect?

I'd love to complete my IR in the next couple months, but my recent annual/renovation was a wallet-buster. While I would LOVE to take your advice and go the G5 (or dual G5) route, that would zoom past my budget at mach speeds right now. I could cough up enough money for a gps175 and do an owner-assisted installation, but adding a G5 or two would be beyond my finances and probably enough beyond my installation experience that I'd have to completely rely on a shop for the full installation. Maybe not...won't know until I dig into it. So far, I've done a Stratus ESG and antenna and a four place intercom installation, and my A&P was sufficiently happy with my work to ask me to continue working with him.

Around $4k? Sure. $14k (or more)? Sadly, not a chance at least this year. @chemgeek ...we both fly in the same neck of the woods... do you think I could complete the IR training and checkride with the equipment I currently have (vor/ils capability only) and kick the gps upgrade down the road for a year or so? I know some of the VORs are either closed or frequently ots.. are their still enough approaches in the area?
 
If you have the G5s, you don't need a separate conforming CDI. (The G5 is your CDI and annunciator.)

You don't need to have IFR GPS to earn the IR. I did mine with only VOR/LOC/ILS/ADF equipment. However, you will discover that to access many airports outside metro areas you will need GPS to make use of the best, or in many cases, the only approaches. In our neck of the woods, so many VORs are out of service or scheduled for decommissioning that it can be challenging to file a legal airways route some days. With WAAS GPS it's not a problem. A trip I took to Pittsburgh and back last year had 2 or the airways VORs out of service, one permanently.

When you are ready to take the WAAS plunge, plan carefully. You don't want to be changing out avionics later. A WAAS GPS and GI-106 is really nice--I flew with that configuration for years. But I ripped it out for a couple of G5s and ditched the vacuum system in the process last year. If I were doing it from scratch today, I would go directly for the G5s, even if I had to save shekels a little longer.
 
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chemgeek said:
If you have the G5s, you don't need a separate conforming CDI. (The G5 is your CDI and annunciator.)
Click to expand...
I understood that part...just read your "No CDI required for IFR" statement as a standalone, rather than as a condition/result of your G5 installation recommendation. Sorry for the misread, and thanks for the clarification. Any thoughts on the feasibility of completing ifr training sans gps in our area?

Edit...thanks...just saw you added to your previous post. Great advice...much appreciated.
 
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The G5 comes in 3 flavors according to the Garmin site - Attitude Indicator ($2300), DG/HSI ($2600), HSI with nav interface i.e. GAD 29 adapter ($3125). Would the AI work as an indicator, or do I need the HSI version? The HSI requires the installation of GMU 11 Magnetometer. The unit cost $275 but it is labor intensive to install. Shop quoted 8 hrs to perform a magnetic survey to find a mounting location in wing or rudder that is free from magnetic interference.

I've attached Appendix C of the Garmin 175 install manual. G5 is an approved indicator, and is listed both under EFIS as the ADI version and under EHSI as an HSI version.

The consensus is that if a G5 is installed with the 175, it should be the HSI version. Why not install the AI version and save $1000?
 

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  • Garmin 175 Install Manual Appendix C.pdf
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