Four Out Of Four Out Of Towners Scrapped Flights

kimberlyanne546

kimberlyanne546

Final Approach
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Display name:
Kimberly
TangoWhiskey from POA (Troy) was in town yesterday for business and I had the plane reserved for a Bay Tour at night. As usual, the weather had other plans for me so we met in Danville for a beer instead.

He came all the way from Texas and we had to scrap the flight due to 1,000 foot ceilings. By the end of the evening my airport was 300 feet so I know it would have never worked.

This is the FOURTH time I've had a plane reserved and / or gone to the airport and had to cancel due to cloud cover. First was a POA member from the East Coast, next was my uncle who I only see once a year from Los Angeles, next was my Dad who I don't see that often from San Jose, and finally Troy.

I'm four for four now and learning quickly how mother nature is now in charge of my flying!

Thanks, Troy, for coming out and listening to all my aviation stories. Next time - hopefully - you can bring your wife and spend the weekend and I will take the two of you around SF (my hometown). And of course next time we will go flying!!!

6769998095_bcecce036c_m.jpg
 
"Time to spare?.........Go by air!"

I met a man who was going to an interview with the airlines in the 1930's. They gave him an airline ticket, but advised him to take the train if the weather was bad.

Some things don't change. Good decision on your part. Get used to it.
 
Scrapped a Bay Tour for 1000' ceilings? Hell, the coolest views of the bay are when the tops of the GG Bridge are in the clouds.
 
Henning said:
Scrapped a Bay Tour for 1000' ceilings? Hell, the coolest views of the bay are when the tops of the GG Bridge are in the clouds.
Click to expand...

Henning, you KNOW I have 1,000 to 4,000 foot peaks on the way to / from and around the GGB. The towers are 800 feet and you have to be above that. Skyscrapers are higher and recently someone said Alcatraz is protected and requires 2000 feet or something of clearance.

How again would we have done a takeoff or landing in Petaluma? TPA is 1100 feet, and no thank you, I'm not scud running.
 
SkyHog said:
Time for the IR?
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I knew someone would say this. Driving back from the bar, I couldn't even see a car length in front of me. Ground fog, low ceilings, how would IFR training help? This was planned to be a "sight seeing" / "picture taking" / enjoy yourself flight. In this case instrument would not have helped. I am not about to go night IFR with low hours with a man I've never met and risk both our lives and see nothing but darkness. No thanks.
 
kgruber said:
"Time to spare?.........Go by air!"

I met a man who was going to an interview with the airlines in the 1930's. They gave him an airline ticket, but advised him to take the train if the weather was bad.

Some things don't change. Good decision on your part. Get used to it.
Click to expand...

Thanks. There is a REMOTE possibility I might take an airplane in March to "go somewhere" about 200nm away, but only if I build in 1-2 days on either end of the flight as "buffer". My understanding is that in GA I can plan a trip if I leave padding for waiting out the weather.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
I knew someone would say this. Driving back from the bar, I couldn't even see a car length in front of me. Ground fog, low ceilings, how would IFR training help? This was planned to be a "sight seeing" / "picture taking" / enjoy yourself flight. In this case instrument would not have helped. I am not about to go night IFR with low hours with a man I've never met and risk both our lives and see nothing but darkness. No thanks.
Click to expand...

As one works on an instrument training - they begin to grasp what they can and cannot fly in and often it is a surprise to them (in both directions).
 
Solution: tell your out-of-town friends not to bring the weather with them when they visit!
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
I knew someone would say this. Driving back from the bar, I couldn't even see a car length in front of me. Ground fog, low ceilings, how would IFR training help? This was planned to be a "sight seeing" / "picture taking" / enjoy yourself flight. In this case instrument would not have helped. I am not about to go night IFR with low hours with a man I've never met and risk both our lives and see nothing but darkness. No thanks.
Click to expand...

The problem isn't getting out and touring around, you probably would have been able to fly over cloud tops and maybe see some peaks of mountains and the bridge, the problem is getting back to Petaluma. Your only recourse would have been KSTS via the ILS, or maybe Napa using the localizer but even that's iffy.
 
What's the point of sightseeing the Bay area if you can't see anything? By the way, that picture looks photoshopped...
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Henning, you KNOW I have 1,000 to 4,000 foot peaks on the way to / from and around the GGB. The towers are 800 feet and you have to be above that. Skyscrapers are higher and recently someone said Alcatraz is protected and requires 2000 feet or something of clearance.

How again would we have done a takeoff or landing in Petaluma? TPA is 1100 feet, and no thank you, I'm not scud running.
Click to expand...

The cool thing about flying is you can go around things...:wink2:
 
Sac Arrow said:
The problem isn't getting out and touring around, you probably would have been able to fly over cloud tops and maybe see some peaks of mountains and the bridge, the problem is getting back to Petaluma. Your only recourse would have been KSTS via the ILS, or maybe Napa using the localizer but even that's iffy.
Click to expand...

Petaluma has an LPV down to 270ft now. Pretty spiffy, I've used it for real on a couple of occasions.
 
Henning said:
The cool thing about flying is you can go around things...:wink2:
Click to expand...

HENNING!!!!!

This is ME we're talking about.

I got LOST (sort of - well - misdirected) on the way back up the coast VFR from Monterey.

I would hit something. How can I go around stuff I cannot see, with no GPS and "hoping" I'm right about where I am. Bad idea.
 
pericynthion said:
Petaluma has an LPV down to 270ft now. Pretty spiffy, I've used it for real on a couple of occasions.
Click to expand...

When I am able to afford instrument training I will let everyone know. For now I'm working on the following:

1. Getting better gear (just got an old, used ICOM nav / radio backup, BF just got me a used iPad 1st gen 16GB 3G version and he's gonna put Foreflight pro on it).

2. (Costs the most money) Switching to a better flight school with cheaper, newer, faster, better, more well equipped planes (flew last weekend in bad weather to do a couple of landings to get to know their CFI, was hoping to do a checkout, real checkout scheduled for tomorrow) to save time / money / worry / etc.

3. When money allows, get my taildragger training at Skypark (they even have free parachutes) on a tiny, 20-30 foot wide, 2400 foot long runway with grass practice area, while doing acro training, upset training, spin / recovery training (I want to for safety not for "fun"). This is STRICTLY to become a better pilot / get better stick and rudder feel.

4. Start renting taildraggers on a regular basis in addition to the tri-gear planes to keep both "current". I love small, light planes but realize the utility of 4-seaters like the 180hp 172 I'm getting checked out in tomorrow.
 
I remember when I started my training that it seemed every time I would schedule a flight the weather went against me. I thought it was a personal grudge my mother nature against me, it didn't have anything to do with the time of year, no way!! I know how you feel an hopefully one of these days the weather will cooperate.
 
steingar said:
What's the point of sightseeing the Bay area if you can't see anything? By the way, that picture looks photoshopped...
Click to expand...

Yeah, I know, it sure does... 'cuz Spike and others can attest that I don't usually look that good. :)

Kimberly, thanks SO MUCH for going out of your way to make it easy for this to happen. I had a tight schedule with corporate activities, but she drove over an hour to make a 20 minute trip for me. She found a delightful bar in a great walking community with free parking (in CA?!). We finally got to meet and put avatars and aliases with faces and voices and names.

By the time we were done at the bar, we pulled out the phone and checked Foreflight; it depicted O69 as pink (low IFR), with 200' ceilings; Kimberly made the right call. She impressed me when, earlier in the day, she said she was going to wait til after 4pm to 'make the call', as that's when she knew they issued the latest TAFs for our proposed departure time. Good job, Kim, knowing your resources and when they refresh!!
 
CMTowner said:
I remember when I started my training that it seemed every time I would schedule a flight the weather went against me. I thought it was a personal grudge my mother nature against me, it didn't have anything to do with the time of year, no way!! I know how you feel an hopefully one of these days the weather will cooperate.
Click to expand...

I mean, yeah, even last weekend, I had a check out scheduled in a 172. I arrived at 12pm planning to "kill four hours" waiting it out if all we had to deal with was gusting winds. In training, I'd never canceled a flight due to winds. Four hours later, and cloud cover, rain, and gusts to 25kts crosswind I was so bummed I turned to the CFI and said "can we fly - for fun - so I can get some time with you in some TERRIBLE conditions? Like just a lesson, not a check out?" She said yes, but that I'd be tossed around a lot. So off we went. As I began my preflight I climbed up to check the fuel. The plane almost blew over the winds were sooooo strong! I started regretting my decision. I went anyways and when we got to the runup the tach didn't work. The lights didn't light and it was displaying "833" rpms even at runup (increase power). We had to go back and I secretly thought "thank goodness". The IA met us and asked me what was wrong and I turned off the plane, back on again, and all was fine. We flew about 0.7 - 0.9 and did roughly 5 landings. By then the winds had died down and when we checked the weather at our computer in the flight school it said only 7 knots. I'm going back this weekend but if for some reason the weather cancels my check out AGAIN I will be super bummed.
 
TangoWhiskey said:
Yeah, I know, it sure does... 'cuz Spike and others can attest that I don't usually look that good. :)

Kimberly, thanks SO MUCH for going out of your way to make it easy for this to happen. I had a tight schedule with corporate activities, but she drove over an hour to make a 20 minute trip for me. She found a delightful bar in a great walking community with free parking (in CA?!). We finally got to meet and put avatars and aliases with faces and voices and names.

By the time we were done at the bar, we pulled out the phone and checked Foreflight; it depicted O69 as pink (low IFR), with 200' ceilings; Kimberly made the right call. She impressed me when, earlier in the day, she said she was going to wait til after 4pm to 'make the call', as that's when she knew they issued the latest TAFs for our proposed departure time. Good job, Kim, knowing your resources and when they refresh!!
Click to expand...

You can thank my CFI for that one! He was really anal when it came to weather briefing. Super detailed about:

What is the information
How old is the information
When will the new information come out
Should you wait until you have the BEST information
Etc.

I don't mind the drive and as I said you're "one of the good ones" and I would have driven twice as far for the chance to meet you. You're one of the reasons I hang around POA. Thanks for putting up with me.

Kimberly
 
Bob Bement said:
Why don't you guys come down to AZ. The weather is great.
Click to expand...

Bob I wish I could - ! I had to put a bunch of money "on account" with my new flight school to avoid paying any monthly dues / sign up fees / etc - to get the discounted rates and the ability to rent the plane after hours.

Hopefully Gastons and if not then maybe some Oregon / California fly-in or something like that.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
Kinda defeats the purpose of a sight seeing trip, don't you think?

:wink2:
Click to expand...
Yeah, that was my first thought too. But then sometimes it's cool to see the Bay Area blanketed by a low layer with the peaks and the bridges peeking out. Of course that probably also means it's close to or below minimums.
 
Everskyward said:
Yeah, that was my first thought too. But then sometimes it's cool to see the Bay Area blanketed by a low layer with the peaks and the bridges peeking out. Of course that probably also means it's close to or below minimums.
Click to expand...

With my limited flying budget I limit myself to "near perfect" flying conditions. My choice of course. I could "legally" fly in crap but at this stage (and beginner-ness) I still want to see as much of the ground as I can see. Just last night, I decided not to look at my GPS (cell phone) and actually found my own way back to the freeway onramp after meeting Troy. I used to ALWAYS get lost, even on my way HOME - so flying by seeing the ground and getting a general sense of where I am on a map is really helping me in the car too!
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
With my limited flying budget I limit myself to "near perfect" flying conditions. My choice of course. I could "legally" fly in crap but at this stage (and beginner-ness) I still want to see as much of the ground as I can see. Just last night, I decided not to look at my GPS (cell phone) and actually found my own way back to the freeway onramp after meeting Troy. I used to ALWAYS get lost, even on my way HOME - so flying by seeing the ground and getting a general sense of where I am on a map is really helping me in the car too!
Click to expand...
The only problem when using my aviation sense of direction in a car is that sometime I know I want to go THAT WAY but there is no road leading in that direction. :idea:
 
Everskyward said:
The only problem when using my aviation sense of direction in a car is that sometime I know I want to go THAT WAY but there is no road leading in that direction. :idea:
Click to expand...
This happens A LOT in San Francisco. Those one way streets, dead ends, hills, and traffic going HEAD ON (you have to turn either left or right) can drive you bonkers.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
TangoWhiskey from POA (Troy) was in town yesterday for business and I had the plane reserved for a Bay Tour at night. As usual, the weather had other plans for me so we met in Danville for a beer instead.

He came all the way from Texas and we had to scrap the flight due to 1,000 foot ceilings. By the end of the evening my airport was 300 feet so I know it would have never worked.

This is the FOURTH time I've had a plane reserved and / or gone to the airport and had to cancel due to cloud cover. First was a POA member from the East Coast, next was my uncle who I only see once a year from Los Angeles, next was my Dad who I don't see that often from San Jose, and finally Troy.

I'm four for four now and learning quickly how mother nature is now in charge of my flying!

Thanks, Troy, for coming out and listening to all my aviation stories. Next time - hopefully - you can bring your wife and spend the weekend and I will take the two of you around SF (my hometown). And of course next time we will go flying!!!

6769998095_bcecce036c_m.jpg
Click to expand...



That's a happy smile!
 
Henning said:
Scrapped a Bay Tour for 1000' ceilings? Hell, the coolest views of the bay are when the tops of the GG Bridge are in the clouds.
Click to expand...

I think you mean when the tops are out of the clouds like this (and no, last night was not this nice):

021711_TRAV_SF_JMG_7253-500c2.jpg
 
I landed at Petaluma today and tried out a couple of the creek trails with my folding bike. Seemed like a nice friendly airport.
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
If you come to Texas, does that mean we might get some clouds and rain?
Click to expand...

I'll bet if I come, you'll get rain. I swear lately I've been a drought buster. Indiana may start paying to keep me away! I've been there 3 out of the last 8 weeks and it has rained or snowed all but one of those days.
On top of that, each time leave there and come back to ATL, whatever weather I had there has moved into Georgia by the time I arrive here. Sheesh..... I had 3 weeks off from 19 Dec to 9 Jan and I'll bet we got 3 VFR days out of it.


We're starting to think serious Seasonal Affect Disorder (SAD) here.
 
jesse said:
As one works on an instrument training - they begin to grasp what they can and cannot fly in and often it is a surprise to them (in both directions).
Click to expand...

Yup - that.

A while back I was trying to get out of an airport as a dry cold front was approaching and pushing the overcast out, and was talking to tower about a SVFR departure because I knew I could climb on top through the holes quickly and weather was improving 10 miles downrange. I was surprised when tower responded that the airport was VFR and weather was improving. I was thinking WTF? This is legal VFR and people think it's OK to fly in this with only 40 hours? If I didn't know for a fact that I would be in the clear in 5 minutes, I would have been back at the house.
 
Everskyward said:
Yeah, that was my first thought too. But then sometimes it's cool to see the Bay Area blanketed by a low layer with the peaks and the bridges peeking out. Of course that probably also means it's close to or below minimums.
Click to expand...

It's also cool underneath with the tops of the bridge and the hills in the bases of the clouds. OAK is always an easy out airport on those days if you get into a bind and often you can slip out into the clear to the east up the river. You can also find Rio Vista airport very easily next to the bridge. It's the Tulle Fog that can really mess with you. The good thing is the conditions are typically dead calm at the same time. It's weird being able to make a visual approach all the way down in the clear and bright and go hard IMC the last 10'. It's a lot like round engine taildraggers, you just look forward to keep the plane going that way and watch your peripheral vision for your ground cues and hold your attitude until you tag.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
When I am able to afford instrument training I will let everyone know. For now I'm working on the following:

1. Getting better gear (just got an old, used ICOM nav / radio backup, BF just got me a used iPad 1st gen 16GB 3G version and he's gonna put Foreflight pro on it).
Click to expand...

Kimberly,
I have an iPad2 (with Foreflight) and also a Garmin 496. You might want to add one of the Garmin Aeras to your list. I had an incident involving situational awareness on my long cross country that convinced me it was a safety thing and I ended up buying it before I got my ticket. It will definately improve your safety on cross country flights and can keep you out of airspace you don't belong in. It is also good for finding the nearest airport/ATC, FSS frequencies, etc. at the touch of a button. Foreflight is great for flight planning and does give you a moving map in flight, but a yoke mounted Garmin is much easier to use in flight.
John
 
+1 a used 295 296 ~$5-600 will help you and is somewhat affordable
My 296 still keeps up with the 495 as fast as we fly in 172s
 
John221us said:
Kimberly,
I have an iPad2 (with Foreflight) and also a Garmin 496. You might want to add one of the Garmin Aeras to your list. I had an incident involving situational awareness on my long cross country that convinced me it was a safety thing and I ended up buying it before I got my ticket. It will definately improve your safety on cross country flights and can keep you out of airspace you don't belong in. It is also good for finding the nearest airport/ATC, FSS frequencies, etc. at the touch of a button. Foreflight is great for flight planning and does give you a moving map in flight, but a yoke mounted Garmin is much easier to use in flight.
John
Click to expand...

Thanks but luckily the airplane I'm getting checked out in tomorrow has a GPS!
 
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