Fore flight Log time vs Hobbs - Logging

[TRocket]

This thread made my head hurt, holy crap. What the hell is "foreflight time"??? Talk about over-analyzing. Time is time, there are no variations of it. If the plane is running and you are responsible for it (or SIC in an operation that requires it), that amount of time whether you look at the hobbs or your watch, is the time you log. I don't mean to sound rude or anything, but lets not be silly.

 

[wrbix]

IMHO, silly is splitting the hairs of a couple of hours, or fractions of hours, here and there.
Where/when will these make a difference? What am I missing here?

 

[MD11Pilot]

One of the things that I am sure many pilots guesstimate in their logbooks is IMC time. On a 2.5 hour trip in and out of the clouds here and there only adds up to a tenth here and there. There is no IMC meter they I'm aware of so just ball park it and never gets challenged!

Very true statement here. I was once tasked with doing preliminary interviews at a small airline I worked for (calling them in, checking they had all the required paperwork, licenses and just a few gut level questions) and one of the things that caught my eye was someone with lets say 5000 hours TT and then list 1500 hours IMC time...and they lived in Texas or Florida etc. Ten percent is usually acceptable in my mind. I asked one fellow what constituted IMC time and he said anytime he couldn't see the horizon and his wing tips...I pointed out that in my jets you never see the wing tips...what about at night, over the Atlantic or Pacific on a clear moonless night? I look at the flying background...jet...less credence...check or freight in a smaller plane...lots more instrument time.

In the end, my gut feeling as to whether I wanted to spend time in the cockpit with you was the overriding parameter.

 

[bluesideup]

The Log time debate has been going on for a long time and most people agree that if you are in an aircraft with the engine started, for the purpose of flying, and you are actually getting off the ground, you can log it, until you are back on the ground and turn the engine off, basically Hobbs time.
I do not know of anyone that has challenged that.
That said there are some apps that will let you Track the flight and generate a .kml file that starts after the aircraft is moving, over 6Kts, and you can use that. There are others that want gear off the ground to gear touching the ground.....
As to the IMC / IFR most pilots will overstate that time. In many locations you are on an IFR flight plan and you may only get 3- 5 min. of IMC. Most pilots will log that as at least 0.1 Hr. which is very common, the tendency is there to log something regardless of it being exact.

 

[flyingron]

The FAA doesn't care as long as you are reasonable. The definition is from the time the aircraft first moves under its own power for the purpose of flight until it comes to rest. Engine running time is pretty close (I argue mine begins to move slightly as soon as the engine fires). However, the intent is clear. Taxi time when you are going to fly does count as pilot time.

The flip side is time in service, which essentially is time off the air for most things. The FAA allows tach time, but I don't have a recording tach so I have a hobbs on the gear switch.

 

[denverpilot]

Since I *write down* times for my own reference while flying... I could care less what the logging gadgets (either FF or MyFlightBook) say about what time it was when I *LOOKED AT MY FRAKKING WATCH*.

 

[bluesideup]

..The flip side is time in service, which essentially is time off the air for most things. The FAA allows tach time, but I don't have a recording tach so I have a hobbs on the gear switch.

In addition, there are many / most of the Rotax based acft that are not allowed to use Tach time, everything is Engine On/ Off, / Hobbs.

 

[Ghery]

Other than the time logged in a glider (no Hobbs), I've logged Hobbs time for my entire flight time. Whatever works...

 

[cgrab]

I have no Hobbs in my plane. I start the timer when I turn off the fuel pump after engine start. I keep a notebook of flights and put the start-to-shutdown time in that and use it to calculate the difference in Tach time. They are pretty close so I use the Tach time in my log book. It helps when I forget to log a flight and have the numbers right in front of me. I figure in 40 flights a year I may be off by as much as an hour. Since the only one who cares about my flight time is the insurance company, I doubt they worry about one hour.