Rich D
Pre-Flight
I don't even bother removing the extra stuff, that's what the tail skid is for, I just taxi and go! :wink2:
Flying Wild Alaska
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I don't even bother removing the extra stuff, that's what the tail skid is for, I just taxi and go! :wink2:
How does this work for tail draggers?
Tom-D
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Tom-D
It's actually a fact.
Tom-D
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Tom-D
Simple........ It doesn't.
Say what?
Why not?
Tom-D
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yep, when a 207 is loaded to the max gross weight less the pilots weight, the CG will be aft of the aft limit. when the pilot sets in the seat that will bring the nose gear back to the ground and the aircraft will be at max gross weight, and the CG will be at the aft limit.
It requires a bit of shuffling some times to get this right.
I understand now. Quoting my question about tail draggers removed the context to your answer. I guessed that's what was going on in the show, but took it with a bit of salt knowing it was a TV show.
Tom-D
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The way they did it, isn't the way it's done.
when the service providers deliver supplies to their customers (packing camps) they get a weight slip from the store, add the pilot weight and load to under the max gross with the fuel required to make the flight with reserves.
The POH has weight stations for the aircraft that say at X station weight can not exceed, at XX station weight can not exceed and so forth.
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I agree.... you need a accurate calculated weight number. Otherwise you could load real heavy stuff close to the main gear and light stuff rearward.. That could set you up to be extremely overweight without the plane settling on the rear tie down ring... IMHO
Ben.
Tom-D
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Usually each package/box has a weight on it. load per the POH and it will go down.
denverpilot
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I saw a few aircraft departing OSH that looked a tad heavy...
Anymouse
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Total Stud Bush Pilot
The 207 was an improvement on the 206. The fuselage was stretched, which got the rear cargo door out from underneath the flap. With the 206, if you left the flaps down and tried to open the cargo door, you would damage it. In fact, on the 206 there is a "squat" switch that disables the flaps if the cargo door is open so they don't come down on it.
The engine compartment was also stretched allowing a baggage compartment up front. For those that are familiar with Cherokees, this compartment was similar to what the Cherokee Six has up front.
Cessna also put a passenger door on the 207. With the 206, the passenger has to either crawl over the pilot seat, or enter through the cargo door.
Probably the best improvement was the landing gear though. If you ever have the chance to compare a 206 with a 172 side by side, you'll notice that the wing span of the 206 is significantly longer, however the gear on the 206 is not as wide as a 172. This makes for a very tippy airplane. I've saw one that got tipped over in 20 knot wind. You won't see that with a 207 because the landing gear is A LOT wider. Also, the 206 gear is a spring, whereas the 207 gear is tube (not sure if I described that right, but it makes a difference by reducing the bounce factor on hard landings). With the wider gear, you can "cheat" on crosswind landings by landing in a crab assuming you're landing on something other than a paved runway (gravel or ice).
I have no idea why Cessna chose the 206 over the 207 when they restarted the single piston engine line.
Ddayle
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OK so they exaggerate a bit, if they made it all seem safe they would have no audience among the non- aviation crowd. I like the show, it has airplanes. Any airplane are better than NO airplanes. Who would want to watch Aunt Maude flying around LA? LA might be more dangerous, but try to show that on TV... Fail. Dave
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Pilawt
Actually, the wingspan of the 172, 206 and 207 are all exactly the same (36'0" with strobes - absent the aftermarket wingtip fuel tank mod), but you're right about the MLG width.
Before the 1968 model year, all high-wing Cessnas had the flat, spring-steel MLG derived from Steve Wittman's original design. The C-177 Cardinal (1968) introduced the wider-track, tapered steel tube MLG that flexed fore and aft as well as up and down, and gave a better, more stable ground ride.
The C-207 (1969) was the second model to be produced with the tubular gear.
The tubular gear spread to the C-210 in 1970, C-150 and C-172 in 1971, and C-182 in 1972. For comparison, a C-172L with tubular gear has a 13" wider track than a 172K with spring gear. A spring-gear 206 has a main gear track of 8'1"; while the track of a tubular-gear 207 is an even ten feet.
Tubular MLG was never used on the C-180/185. The C-206 was the only tri-gear model that never got the tubular gear -- even the new C-206H still has the flat spring gear. I have heard that the necessary internal fittings for tubular gear would interfere with the double doors on the C-206.
Interestingly, the C-207 and the C-150 are the only strut-braced high-wing models that were never produced with the cuffed ("Camber-Lift") wing leading edge introduced on the rest of the line in the early 1970s. In the case of the 150, the cuffs performed badly in spin tests (13 turns to recover from a 2-turn spin); and as to the 207 the company felt the anticipated sales volume didn't warrant the R&D and flight test investment.
The 207 was also never factory-tested or approved for floats (which may have prompted Cessna to stick with the 206 for re-start production).
Former Cessna Manager of Flight Test & Aerodynamics William Thompson wrote of the C-207 (Cessna - Wings for The World: The Single-Engine Development Story):
"The most-rearward limit of the center-of-gravity envelope is an amazing 42% of the mean aerodynamic chord (MAC). This value is believed to be the most-aft limit of any lightplane, and, of course, it is made possible by the extremely long tail arm."
Thompson observed that the long tail arm also made for better controllability, stability, trim, and transitional stick forces, compared to the C-206.
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Anymouse
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Total Stud Bush Pilot
I stand corrected. And I'm sure I knew that at one time since it was required knowledge for my 1st Part 135 checkride.
dell30rb
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Y'all prob won't hear from me for awhile...
Tom-D
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For any one thinking of a Cessna as a purchase, that should be required reading, as is the " Standard Catalog of Cessna Single engine aircraft" by Jim Cavanagh.
Skylane81E
Final Approach
my only gripe with 207s is the angle of the front door windows makes the plane look bent.
Anymouse
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Most times the prop goes too fast for me to see it. :wink2:
Little airplanes like mine can't fly IFR - don't tell the FAA.
Tom-D
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Knowing that aircraft is a PA 12, it probably isn't equipped with any thing that isn't required to be legal VFR.
weight means every thing when you operate off airport.
They were reffering to a Cessna 207
AggieMike88
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The original "I don't know it all" of aviation.
The quote of the series happened tonight.
Ariel duringntheninterview as she was taxiing the C150 for the first time....
"I just want to be 100% comfortable. Be able to close my eyes and just land that plane easily before I solo."
I never knew Ponts was that good of a CFI to teach "blind" landings!
Ariel duringntheninterview as she was taxiing the C150 for the first time....
"I just want to be 100% comfortable. Be able to close my eyes and just land that plane easily before I solo."
I never knew Ponts was that good of a CFI to teach "blind" landings!
Jim Logajan
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Even the narrator thinks she'll get her certificate in 40 hours - Ponts is that good!
Seriously though, I thought the last couple episodes were generally pretty good. Glad to see Ariel is in a real trainer.
Tom-D
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Oh ......... wait....... I have a different opinion...
does Bull Scat ring a bell ?
remember these are part 135 aircraft.
Jim Logajan
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Would you want this guy to be your CFI?
+1
I was incredibly surprised that she was starting out in the 206/207/whatever. She must have needed 3-4 pillows so she could see over the glareshield! She said she was the only one of the family not a pilot. Has this come up before?
But, since this is TV, I wonder if it was deliberate (the 206).
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Ddayle
Line Up and Wait
why not?
looks to me like he has good motor skills. I hope you are not suggesting that being a skateboarder & doing stunts is somehow wrong. It seems hypocritical to condemn him for excess risk taking, just as much of the public condemns aviation as risky. Dave P.S. I am not a skateboarder.
Ariel just has to endure 23 more hours of crying then Dad will hand her her "license."
It's too bad those small planes can't fly in clouds. It must be scary.
cavmedic
Line Up and Wait
why not?
He needs to wear a helmet. I think flying in a Cessna with Ariel at the controls is riskier.
MadseasoN
Line Up and Wait
Eh. Couldn't finish watching last night's episode. I got tired of hearing the CFI say "uh oh" every 10 seconds. Yeah, I know it's edited that way, still annoying though. I do like the show though and I hope it stays on for a few more seasons.
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I have heard (not confirmed) that due to FAA scrutiny this will be the last season.
Really? Ya think they get a few phone calls about landing with pax VFR in 1 mile 700 feet is legal?
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Greg Bockelman
There is a LOT of uncontrolled airspace up there. One mile and clear of clouds. Depends on what their OP SPECS allows.
denverpilot
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Great. More "relationship" based reality shows on TV and fake round-the-world races where everyone in the race ends up on the same commercial airliner or train every leg.
I could see Jim shutting down the TV production if it started causing him problems, though. Not worth it. Or the TV show producers would have to sweeten the pot a whole lot.
That's what happened to about every "Ice Road Truckers" season. They were specifically uninvited back.
I kinda expected that when you saw "The Polar Bear" taking off and pounding with an improperly secured load of generators repeating "That's not on me." as they were beat to hell.
