Fixed pitch prop annual?

ircphoenix

ircphoenix

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ircphoenix
My 140 has a fixed pitch prop. There's no entry in the prop logbook from the last annual. I'm being told by one person that I absolutely positively have to have a proper annual sticker for the prop, and the mechanic who did the annual is saying that there's no requirement that there be a specific log entry for the prop.

Who is right?
 
Is the person who's telling you that you need to have an annual sticker for the prop an A&P IA? Did the sign-off on the annual say that the entire plane was inspected in accordance with an annual inspection pursuant to the appropriate FAR? I think that the IA who did the annual is right, but I'm not an IA so I'm just giving you my thought process on how I would answer the question if it were my plane coming out of annual.
 
ircphoenix said:
My 140 has a fixed pitch prop. There's no entry in the prop logbook from the last annual. I'm being told by one person that I absolutely positively have to have a proper annual sticker for the prop, and the mechanic who did the annual is saying that there's no requirement that there be a specific log entry for the prop.

Who is right?
Click to expand...
Who?? the guy who is telling you that 91.409 says your "AIRCRAFT" must have an annual, and the prop is simply a part of the aircraft, as is the engine, and the ANNUAL sign off goes in the A/F log.

Ask your know it all to show you where the FARS tell you a prop or engine needs an annual?
 
I got three annual inspection stickers from my IA...finally (another story I've shared here) one for each of the logs.
 
Everything I've read says that some IA's do the prop sticker just because. Not because it is mandated. And the IA that did my annual said the same thing... That the prop is part of the aircraft and the annual sticker in the airframe log covers it.
 
ircphoenix said:
Everything I've read says that some IA's do the prop sticker just because. Not because it is mandated. And the IA that did my annual said the same thing... That the prop is part of the aircraft and the annual sticker in the airframe log covers it.
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I've always got 3 stickers, I also understand the logic of not needing the prop one, but wouldn't it have been easier, and better customer service for your IA to just over you the one sentence sticker?
 
There is no requirement to have more than one logbook or "maintenance record". But you can also have as many as you want. Only the "aircraft" gets an annual but people like their other logbook to show the inspections as well. The typical entry is that they were inspected in accordance with a 100-hour inspection.
 
James331 said:
I've always got 3 stickers, I also understand the logic of not needing the prop one, but wouldn't it have been easier, and better customer service for your IA to just over you the one sentence sticker?
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There are many reasons why I will never again use the services of the shop that annualed my plane last year.
 
For what it's worth, this is a subject that is debatable even at the FAA level. At least one of the maintenance inspectors at the FSDO local to me says you need a signature in each logbook. Others say that one in the airframe logbook is sufficient.
 
Just because you got a sticker in a prop or engine log, does it mean anything?
 
Timbeck2 said:
I got three annual inspection stickers from my IA...finally (another story I've shared here) one for each of the logs.
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Would your A&P-IA complete an annual on a removed engine ? and place a sticky in the engine log?
 
Tom-D said:
Just because you got a sticker in a prop or engine log, does it mean anything?
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Like a cow sticker, or a banana sticker? No

One that states a annual was done with a signature on it, yes
 
mondtster said:
For what it's worth, this is a subject that is debatable even at the FAA level. At least one of the maintenance inspectors at the FSDO local to me says you need a signature in each logbook. Others say that one in the airframe logbook is sufficient.
Click to expand...

Which is why I don't get why the IA wouldn't just print up another sticker, I mean Avery stickers ain't that expensive.
 
James331 said:
Like a cow sticker, or a banana sticker? No

One that states a annual was done with a signature on it, yes
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no ...

Well.... it does man the IA does not know the rules.
 
James331 said:
Which is why I don't get why the IA wouldn't just print up another sticker, I mean Avery stickers ain't that expensive.
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Can your IA complete an annual inspection on a removed engine?
 
James331 said:
Which is why I don't get why the IA wouldn't just print up another sticker, I mean Avery stickers ain't that expensive.
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and as soon as these entries are seen by a buyer the creditability of the A&P-IA goes down. and the price does too, because the maintenance must be f---up too.
 
Tom-D said:
and as soon as these entries are seen by a buyer the creditability of the A&P-IA goes down. and the price does too, because the maintenance must be f---up too.
Click to expand...

Are you saying if someone sees stickers in a log book vs writing on the actual page??
 
James331 said:
Are you saying if someone sees stickers in a log book vs writing on the actual page??
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You trying to spin the thread? you know that is not what I said.
 
Tom-D said:
You trying to spin the thread? you know that is not what I said.
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Frankly Tom, I have no idea what your trying to say.

..was this your spin off about hypothetical guy trying to annual his airplane and engine, even though the engine isn't in the plane, if so, I'm glad you brought that up, because it's like every pilot I know, they have these disassembled planes they are always trying to get annualed lol
 
Tom-D said:
Who?? the guy who is telling you that 91.409 says your "AIRCRAFT" must have an annual, and the prop is simply a part of the aircraft, as is the engine, and the ANNUAL sign off goes in the A/F log.

Ask your know it all to show you where the FARS tell you a prop or engine needs an annual?
Click to expand...
Um,

43.11 Content, form, and disposition of records for inspections conducted under parts 91 and 125 and §§135.411(a)(1) and 135.419 of this chapter.

(a) Maintenance record entries. The person approving or disapproving for return to service an aircraft, airframe, aircraft engine, propeller, appliance, or component part after any inspection performed in accordance with part 91, 125, §135.411(a)(1), or §135.419 shall make an entry in the maintenance record of that equipment containing the following information:
 
GlennAB1 said:
Um,

43.11 Content, form, and disposition of records for inspections conducted under parts 91 and 125 and §§135.411(a)(1) and 135.419 of this chapter.

(a) Maintenance record entries. The person approving or disapproving for return to service an aircraft, airframe, aircraft engine, propeller, appliance, or component part after any inspection performed in accordance with part 91, 125, §135.411(a)(1), or §135.419 shall make an entry in the maintenance record of that equipment containing the following information:
Click to expand...
That equipment is the aircraft IAW 91.4o9 (a) as we were referring to in this thread.
Plus how o you pass this off ?
https://www.faa.gov/about/office_or...015/stanley - (2015) legal interpretation.pdf
 
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Do you document engine and prop p/n & s/n with your A/F log entry? What happens a month after annual when the prop is damaged and an unscrupulous individual replaces it with another (used) prop, of lesser quality than the one you annualed, and without making a logbook enty. You assume responsibility or it?
 
The AIRCRAFT gets an inspection. That covers everything from the prop spinner to the aft navlight on the rudder. That is signed off as an ANNUAL inspection on the AIRCRAFT. The whole damned thing.

Now as a courtesy I generally also sign off a 100 hour inspection on the engine (if there is an engine logbook) and a 100 hour inspection on the prop (if there is a prop logbook) but it is only as a courtesy to mechanics that come along behind me that wonder when the last time these two entities got a looksee, even though IAs know that an ANNUAL inspection covers them both.

Does that PLEASE put this thread to rest?

Thanks,

Jim
 
It was covered with the chief counsel post. Don't know why there was continued argument.

This isn't a "should" thing. There are a lot of things that SHOULD be done certain ways but are done in ways that are technically legal/compliant.
 
I'm surprised your FP prop plane has a separate log for the prop... But that's just me...
 
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