Fixed Gear Vs. Retracts

And yet even though 5 to 10 thousand RVs are flying, you would be hard pressed to find more than a handful ‘converted’ to retracts.


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That's more than you'll find sporting turbo jet or turbo fan engines on each wing . . . My point was that RVs aren't limited like certified planes. If the owner wants, an RV can be set up as a retract during build or later--very unlike the "options" available to the owners of thousands of Cherokees (who would have to sell their fixed gear plane and buy a retract model).
 
That's more than you'll find sporting turbo jet or turbo fan engines on each wing . . . My point was that RVs aren't limited like certified planes. If the owner wants, an RV can be set up as a retract during build or later--very unlike the "options" available to the owners of thousands of Cherokees (who would have to sell their fixed gear plane and buy a retract model).

Agreed. The point I didn’t really make is that given the popularity and performance of Van’s designs, few have tried to ‘improve’ on them by sucking up the gear


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Agreed. The point I didn’t really make is that given the popularity and performance of Van’s designs, few have tried to ‘improve’ on them by sucking up the gear.

But even Van "improved" them by changing from tail dragger to trike, and from tandem seating to side by side. Of course, changing the seating is rather difficult after the plane is built . . . .
 
Ok got it. You are saying fixed gear is more fun because in theory you spend more time flying the airplane than repairing it. I suppose there is some merit to eliminating one potential risk, but remember, there are lots of ways to ding and airplane on landing and fixed gear pilots do it all the time. Prop strike, ground loop, collapsed nose gear, depart runway, etc.

I know there is the old saying- "There are two types of retractable pilots, those who have done a gear up and those who will do a gear up.", but I think if you dig deeper, you will find plenty of pilots who have flown for decades without a gear up and plenty more who retire from a decades long flying career in retractable planes that never did a gear up landing. I personally have gone about 16 years so far in a Cessna Cutlass, then a Piper Arrow IV and now a Mooney. No gear up landings. It doesn't have to be a sure thing.

You're right though, I love retractable gear planes and it is tough to consider anything with fixed gear to own. I am considering a Vans RV down the road, but oh how I wish they made a Vans RV-9RG, or an RV-7RG. :(

Yes... I can ding a plane a lot of ways, and retractable gear adds one more potential ding on top of all the other dings.

If you are looking at Vans, you should consider an RV-10. Compared to a Mooney Ovation Ultra, the RV-10 has higher useful load, more Kts per HP (although 25 kts slower at CRZ due to 50 fewer ponies), and slightly better fuel economy. All of the Van's planes are notable for their excellent flight qualities and enjoyable handling, and they have a large, passionate following (see "Van's Air Force").
 
For those who want retracts, nothing else will do. I just ain't one of them.

I'm not really for or against retract, but for us where else could we go 150kts on 10gph with a 4cyl engine? Efficiency was the name of the game, retract (and a very robust airframe) came along with it.

I personally have gone about 16 years so far in a Cessna Cutlass, then a Piper Arrow IV and now a Mooney. No gear up landings. It doesn't have to be a sure thing.

Amen, brother! I'm at 11 Mooney years and counting.

I'm somewhere between you guys, but I'm not saying, because.....well.......jinx.
 
That doesn't make any logical sense, and certainly that hasn't been my experience.

As far as hull loss coverage is concerned they are insuring replacement (if that's what you want covered, in motion or not), and my experience is that premium is directly related to the insured value of the airplane, regardless of whether it's a single or a twin, retractable or not.

If your broker is saying you as a pilot are four times the liability risk just because you are flying a retractable, I'd go looking for another insurance company.

When I bought and started flying my Aztec my insurance slightly more than doubled. But the insured value of the hull was also twice my immediately prior fixed gear Piper single, and I have 6 seats vs 4, which the insurer told me increased the liability coverage cost.
Late to this thread, but I agree with this. When I first started flying my friend's Cardinal RG as a non-equity partner, I had zero retract time and adding me to her contract increased her premium by less than 100% - so it was a good deal for her. We were told the premium would be based on the retract time of the less experienced pilot. Today my insurance premium on my own plane (same make/model) is $400 less than that because I have about 800 hours in retracts. It certainly costs more to insure a retract than a fixed-gear plane, but it should not be four times as much unless you're currently flying something with a hull value much less than half of that of the retract you are considering. And your premium should go down as you gain more hours, if you currently have little or no retract time.
 
But even Van "improved" them by changing from tail dragger to trike, and from tandem seating to side by side. Of course, changing the seating is rather difficult after the plane is built . . . .

Yes Van designed new models and configurations for his line of kit planes (though in much more restrained manner than say the folks at Maule). And practically every builder makes dozens of improvements on their plane. There’s a small industry dedicated to producing and selling improvements. It’s actually noteworthy when someone builds a ‘stock’, completely unmodified example.

With that said, there is a strong family resemblance within the line; low wing cantilevered monoplane of mostly aluminum construction, constant chord wing, fixed gear, recip powered. Change any of those characteristics and one has ventured off Van’s path. Nothing wrong with that unless you want Van’s blessing.

They are really fine designs.


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I'm not really for or against retract, but for us where else could we go 150kts on 10gph with a 4cyl engine? Efficiency was the name of the game, retract (and a very robust airframe) came along with it.





I'm somewhere between you guys, but I'm not saying, because.....well.......jinx.

I’m not even flying a retract and wouldn’t dare say any of that! Joking aside, retracts are cool and Mooneys particularly so. I would add “and a very good wing” to the list of good stuff.

So given all the mnemonics, buzzers and interlocks used to get that gear down, let me share what I used to do to keep the belly paint pristine in my racing sailplanes. When racing, it was not unknown to spend an hour circling 500’ AGL and often a wingspan from the trees trying to ‘save’ a flight. That might be one turn from landing in a cornfield, cow pen or even a highway. No stabilized approach or checklist here. Some pilots put a tennis ball on the spoiler handle to remind them to drop the gear first along with other tricks.

My procedural trick was to ALWAYS open the vent window after dropping the gear. On a normal Airport landing with a pattern, I did it on pattern entry. During an off field landing I would do it just as I gave up. The roar of the wind blowing thru the vent, in an otherwise silent sailplane, broke the spell so to speak. It was an aural indication that the gear was down and one that I could mentally confirm without moving my hands from the controls or taking my eyes off the herd of cows I was landing next to. It also was an aural check on airspeed at a time when looking at the instrument was not recommended.

Since I no longer fly gliders with retracts, I’m comfortable sharing


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Since I no longer fly gliders with retracts, I’m comfortable sharing
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If you can't hit the airport with your keys, you are WAAAAAY too far away.
 
My "secret" to always remembering to put the gear down isn't really a technique - it's just that I have never had confidence that the gear will actually go down and lock, and that fact is always uppermost in my mind as I approach any airport for landing. It's with good reason too, since I have had intermittent downlock failures in my airplane (since fixed, hopefully), an intermittent problem where both up and downlock indicators would be on simultaneously in my friend's plane, and most recently a failure of my plane's gear to retract after takeoff. I don't have any special technique or checklist in fact (though I habitually GUMPS once or twice after pulling the handle) - I just cross my fingers every time I enter the pattern or cross the FAF. That is not to say that I won't someday forget and do an unforced belly landing, but the far likelier scenario is a mechanical failure or loss of hydraulic fluid in flight.

For all the stress, I still don't regret buying a retract. There are few fixed gear airplanes in my price range that go significantly faster than a 172. If I have any regrets, it's that sometimes I wish I had bought a Mooney - but I had at least a couple of reasons to prefer the 177RG.
 
I owned a Swift, a retractable gear airplane, for several years. The gear had been overhauled shortly before I bought it. All new bushings, hardware, flex lines, etc. Other than fixing one hydraulic down lock which developed a leak, about a 1-2 hour job, I don't know I ever spend much money on the landing gear other than tires. The annual took a little bit longer because of the retract test and emergency extension test required, which incorporated a recurring AD inspection. I bought my own set of jacks, but I don't consider them in the cost since I still have them. My IA came to my hangar so having the jacks made it easier than having to go borrow or move plane just for the test. Otherwise, the maintenance was only slightly more than for my J-3 Cub and that was related to avionics and such. Insurance was about the same for both based on similar hull values.

I sold the Swift a couple of years ago after buying an RV-4. Operating costs are about the same as the Swift with maintenance being a bit cheaper because of not needing certificated parts. For example, I recently replaced both my master and starter relays and my starter relay to starter cable. The relays were $20 each from Van's and the #2AWG wire cost about $15 for 10 feet from a welding supply shop. Better wire with more flexible wire and better heat resistant insulation Insurance is about the same. Just one FAA-PMA relay for a plane will run well north of $100. I had about $60 total invested.

The retractable gear adds weight and the Swift, without gross weight increase STCs, will run out of useful load pretty quickly not to mention the ability to lift it efficiently. The RV-4 will carry two 200# people, full fuel and a 10# baggage. It will then fly out of a grass strip on 100 degree humid summer day and clear the trees at the end of the runway by 300+ feet everytime...and then still climb 1000fpm.

Speed...just because the gear retracts, it doesn't make it fast. The RV-4 will absolutely run off and leave the Swift in terms of speed. The Swift (with climb prop) would indicate 125mph at 2500rpm. I could push it up to 2700 redline and see 140mph. The RV-4 will indicate 140mph at 1900 with a wood prop. At 2450, average is 155mph IAS. While the Swift was a delight to fly, the RV-4 puts a much bigger grin on my face.

Then, there is the Cub. A whole 'nother aspect of flying. It also puts a big grin on my face too. :D
 
I didn't go out looking for planes saying "I want to buy a retract." In fact, I don't think that really enters into my list of requirements one way or another. If speed is what you want, you can get some very fast fixed gear. Personally, we got very much into the styling and utility of Navions and the fact it was a retract just came with the overall package. If you think Swifts are the best aircraft, you'll have to take the fact it's a taildragger AND a retract, for example.

I have a friend with a Cessna 195. He came barreling down on his buddy with a smaller-engine Navion (not me) and shot passed him saying over the radio "Must be nice having retractable gear."
 
Even with my preference for fixed gear, I would take a 177RG in a heartbeat. I know I'm not being consistant, but there are just some planes I can't say "no" to.
 
If I were to get a retract I think I'd like a P2006T, a P68 or an Mu-2. And a hefty skid plate. Maybe some outriggers near the wingtips while we're at it.
 
OP, i think you are comparing oranges to apples. I also agree with the person in your first response. I believe you need to watch some videos instead of make them.

With those objections stated, comparing aircraft requires consideration of more than one difference. I own and fly both. They are different animals. A retractable usually involves many differences other than the gear configuration. Most retractables are designed with different goals than those considered when designing a fixed gear aircraft.

I think that if you want to compare models with fewer differencspes other than gear configutpration, look at planes that are available both ways. The Cherokee Six/Saratoga come to mind. Maybe a 182/182RG would be worth looking at.

For me, my two planes are different animals for different purposes. My retract is for traveling and my taildragger is for local, fun flying.
 
Yes... I can ding a plane a lot of ways, and retractable gear adds one more potential ding on top of all the other dings.

If you are looking at Vans, you should consider an RV-10. Compared to a Mooney Ovation Ultra, the RV-10 has higher useful load, more Kts per HP (although 25 kts slower at CRZ due to 50 fewer ponies), and slightly better fuel economy. All of the Van's planes are notable for their excellent flight qualities and enjoyable handling, and they have a large, passionate following (see "Van's Air Force").

No, no big engines for me. My main point of possibly switching to Vans is just to save money, not spend more money. My current Mooney has a Lycombing IO-360 in it, the same as a lot of RV-6s and 7s. If I do make the switch someday, I will be looking for an RV-9a with a IO-320 and CS prop. I hope to reduce my fuel burn even more.

As to the RV-10 vs. Mooney Ovation, other than a greater useful load, the rest is just Vans Kool Aid. Take the Ovation, throttle it back to the typical cruise speed for an RV-10 and then check the fuel burn.
 
If I have any regrets, it's that sometimes I wish I had bought a Mooney - but I had at least a couple of reasons to prefer the 177RG.

I have some hours in the fixed gear version of the Cardinal and I have to say, that when I get too old and stiff to be able to easily load myself into the Mooney, I will be looking at Cardinal RGs. You really can't beat the egress of the Cardinal with any GA plane. It's hands down the easiest plane to get in and out of. Also with the RG, the view looking down must be pretty nice.
 
I have some hours in the fixed gear version of the Cardinal and I have to say, that when I get too old and stiff to be able to easily load myself into the Mooney, I will be looking at Cardinal RGs. You really can't beat the egress of the Cardinal with any GA plane. It's hands down the easiest plane to get in and out of. Also with the RG, the view looking down must be pretty nice.
Yes I think they are sweet planes, and great for sightseeing because of the wide view out the front windshield. They're just not as fast as Mooneys with the same engine (my cruising speed tops out at about 130 KTAS), and there is also the fact that they depend on hydraulics to even be able to get the gear down manually. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Mooneys with the Johnson bar have a direct mechanical linkage to the gear... is that right? That's a bit of peace of mind that I wish I had, though ironically it might make me likelier to forget to put the gear down. (Or maybe not... if it takes as much effort as I've been told.)

But the main reasons I opted for the Cardinal RG (my particular Cardinal RG, anyway) were (a) the panel the previous owner had installed and (b) the greater roominess. I didn't think it would be possible to carry a full-size bicycle in back of a Mooney without a lot more disassembly than I was willing to do on a regular basis. And it's enough of a struggle to get a large dog crate in and out of my Cardinal, I would dread undertaking the task in a Mooney.
 
Mooneys have more room inside than many people think. I know several pilots who routinely put bikes in the back, removing both wheels and using a grill cover to keep chain grease away from the upholstery.

Be aware that there are three different "sizes" of Mooney. My biking friends all have mid-body planes (F-K), a foot longer than my short body one (A-E). The long body planes (L-V) have much more baggage space than the rest.

The manual gear handle is attached directly to the gear mechanism; when it was electrified, the Johnson bar was cut off and the electric motor hooked up to the same spot. When I look at the floor indicator to confirm gear position, it's just a hole in the floor with the red and green markings painted onto the mechanism. It's remarkably simple.
 
Yep, the removing both wheels part is exactly the "more disassembly than I was willing to do on a regular basis" that I was talking about. The front wheel is all I have to remove to fit my bike into my Cardinal. I have no problem with doing that, but I have no interest in carrying around cleaning gear for the chain, or soap to scrub my hands after handling it as I'd need to in order to remove, and later reattach, the rear wheel.

And thanks for confirming what I thought about the Johnson bar mechanism. That simplicity is exactly what I wish Cessna had designed into the Cardinal RG's gear mechanism. What they gave us works pretty well and is surprisingly reliable when you consider its complexity... but because it relies on hydraulics, there are failure modes where you're going in on your belly no matter what you do (short of the legendary tow bar trick, which sounds likelier to result in either damage to the gear or pilot injury or death than successful deployment).
 
... but because it relies on hydraulics, there are failure modes where you're going in on your belly no matter what you do...
:confused: o_O

Is there some other retract mechanism energy source where the failure modes don't result in landing on the belly, or is absolutely 100% failure proof?

When you look at the abuse hydraulics get in industrial environments (hoes, dozers, dump trucks & drilling rigs among the examples) and how they keep on working, the repeatedly inspected and "overserviced" hydraulic systems on planes would seem the epitome of reliability. Certainly I don't spend any time concerning myself about mine when I am flying...it's probably the least of my worries of all the things that can go wrong.
 
Yep, the removing both wheels part is exactly the "more disassembly than I was willing to do on a regular basis" that I was talking about. The front wheel is all I have to remove to fit my bike into my Cardinal. I have no problem with doing that, but I have no interest in carrying around cleaning gear for the chain, or soap to scrub my hands after handling it as I'd need to in order to remove, and later reattach, the rear wheel.

You don't have quick release wheels fore and aft? Kind of eliminates the need for chain cleaning gear (a waste of time, you need to relube it before riding then clean again before taking home, then relube it . . . ) and hand soap.

Disclaimer: I've kept an old towel under the seat of my truck since forever. Adding a small hand towel to the back of the plane seemed natural. There's often a couple of disposables back there, too. Lots of dirty / greasy parts on airplanes.
 
:confused: o_O

Is there some other retract mechanism energy source where the failure modes don't result in landing on the belly, or is absolutely 100% failure proof?

I don’t know about 100% failure proof, but a Johnson Bar makes the muscles on the idiot between the headset cups the energy source.
 
:confused: o_O

Is there some other retract mechanism energy source where the failure modes don't result in landing on the belly, or is absolutely 100% failure proof?

When you look at the abuse hydraulics get in industrial environments (hoes, dozers, dump trucks & drilling rigs among the examples) and how they keep on working, the repeatedly inspected and "overserviced" hydraulic systems on planes would seem the epitome of reliability. Certainly I don't spend any time concerning myself about mine when I am flying...it's probably the least of my worries of all the things that can go wrong.
The most obvious failure mode that's specific to hydraulics and doesn't affect direct mechanical control mechanisms (like the Mooney Johnson bar) is a massive leak. Lose enough fluid and you can't even pump the gear down manually. And some folks here have cautioned that the same outcome is possible due to internal leaks that cause fluid pressure to bypass the gear.

That's not to say that there might not be failure modes in a Johnson bar mechanism that result in belly landings, but the fluid loss one for hydraulic systems is apparently rather common. I was almost involved in such an incident in a 182RG during my first checkout session. Gear didn't lock down when I put the lever down, putting it up only brought them part way up. We did manage to get the gear down and locked by pumping, but later learned that the plane had so little fluid it was something of a miracle that we were able to. I've never forgotten that experience and it's made me very nervous about hydraulic gear systems. Maybe a little more so than is reasonable, I don't know.
 
You don't have quick release wheels fore and aft? Kind of eliminates the need for chain cleaning gear (a waste of time, you need to relube it before riding then clean again before taking home, then relube it . . . ) and hand soap.

Disclaimer: I've kept an old towel under the seat of my truck since forever. Adding a small hand towel to the back of the plane seemed natural. There's often a couple of disposables back there, too. Lots of dirty / greasy parts on airplanes.
Sure I have quick release on both, so what? The problem isn't with the lock mechanism, it's that the gear sprocket is on the rear wheel and there's no way to avoid handling the chain both in taking it off and putting it back on. Towels help but they're not enough as far as I'm concerned. I wouldn't want to handle stuff inside the cockpit - like my iPad for one, but even the yoke and other controls - having only wiped my hands off with a towel. I've never gotten my hands that dirty doing a pre-flight, and if I had to do something that did, I would duck into the bathroom and wash my hands before flight. That doesn't happen very often though.

And I agree with you about cleaning the chain - it's not something I would want to do every time I flew with the bike anyway.
 
I don’t know about 100% failure proof, but a Johnson Bar makes the muscles on the idiot between the headset cups the energy source.

I was expecting someone to come up with that one. :p

So if it's such a good system why did Mooney abandon it?
 
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... but the fluid loss one for hydraulic systems is apparently rather common...

Total fluid losses in hydraulic systems are anything but common, even in systems that are abused as I noted earlier. If hydraulics were as fragile and unreliable as you seem to think you wouldn't find them on commercial airliners carrying tens of thousands of people every day.

The routine maintenance on hydraulic systems is neither exotic, or particularly expensive. There's lots of things on my airplane that have a measurably higher chance of failure than the hydraulics.
 
:confused: o_O

Is there some other retract mechanism energy source where the failure modes don't result in landing on the belly, or is absolutely 100% failure proof?

No, there is no 100% failure proof gear. Not even fixed gear. However, the manual Mooney gear comes close. Failure to retract, or extend is very, very rare. The manual gear has no emergency extension system because it would be pointless. There is a very real threat of gear collapse if the system isn't maintained, but the maintenance is pretty easy, the inspections simple and the parts to avoid collapse pretty dang cheap.

When they went to make the Mooney gear electric, they did a pretty good job and it still eliminates the hydraulics of other retractable systems, but it introduced new failure modes. Both versions of the electric actuators have mechanical systems to extend the gear in case of electrical failure, but unfortunately, they both have weak points that have caused failures... but, these failures are very, very rare.

I always admired the Piper Cherokee series retractable system. It's hydraulic, but the hydraulics are used to keep the gear up, so if there is a leak and the hydraulic pressure leaks out, the gear just comes down with just gravity. If the electrics fail, you open a valve, releasing the hydraulic pressure and the gear comes down with gravity. Kinda slick and I know it works. Used to fly a Piper Arrow IV and I once had an electrical failure, a bad gear switch and the emergency release valve + gravity worked as promised. :cool:
 
I was expecting someone to come up with that one. :p

So if it's such a good system why did Mooney abandon it?

Marketing pressure. It requires some about of strength, manual dexterity and practice. Flipping a switch anybody can do. It was the '60s and everything was becoming push button, electric and automatic. All the other manufacturers were offering retractable gear at the flip of a switch. Mooney had to follow suit to be competitive. It turns out the buyers really wanted that too. There was a period from 1966 to 1968 that both type of gear was available, and the buyers chose electric in big numbers.

Ask yourself, why don't cars have manual roll up windows anymore? They are more reliable and they're easy to use.
 
Love my gear system in the Arrow. Will miss it when I trade airplanes. Only issue I had in 320 hours was failure to retract last year when the powerpack pump finally went. Big whoop, gravity put it back down and green with the pressure dump (emer ext switch).

The point about Cessna hydraulics is noted. That said, not all hydraulics systems are created equal. The Apache/Aztec gear system is pretty versatile in the way it routes fluid. The pickup point for the full-time circulation lines is physically high on the reservoir canister. That means that if a leak within the full time running/(idling) side occurs while you're flying, the hydraulic fluid will be spilled overboard only to the point where the pickup tube cavitates on the reservoir. When you go put gear or flaps down nothing will happen, since both the gear and flap handles are merely mechanical diverter-valves in the hydro-pak and not actual "switches", electric or otherwise. At any rate, at that point you still have enough fluid on the reservoir to use the hand pump, because its pickup point is as you guessed it, the dead bottom of the reservoir. Select the gear or flap valve in the desired position and pump away. Done.

And if all that fails, you have a CO2 bottle as a last ditch. Give some semblance of a look at the hoses and fittings during annual, and that system is actually pretty knuckle-dragging reliable. What's also interesting about the Apache/Aztec is it allows the installation of a Vero Beach gear (PA-28/32/34/44) style electro-hydraulic powerpack as a backup, essentially turning the thing into a modern Piper gear system, sans the gravity drop trunnions. That's a lot of versatility and options (5 in total if you include a second engine driven pump installed on the right engine) for an airplane that in normal configuration has the bottom half of the tires exposed anyways (unless modded with pretentious clamshell doors, I keed I keed).

Fixed gear zealots make much to do about retracts. That's cool with me, I know the objective premiums of mx and insurance over fixed, and if it keeps the market soft for me to enjoy, the mo' better.
 
I was expecting someone to come up with that one.

So if it's such a good system why did Mooney abandon it?

Probably the same reason the more reliable and simple manual transmission is becoming nearly impossible to purchase in cars.

People are lazy and marketing works. Early automatics SUCKED. But hey, pushbutton convenience!

Plus you’re talking about a long gone era where everyone was still enamored with buying electric appliances for their kitchen. Dishwashers were a big hit.

Pushing a button to put the gear down was the equivalent of today’s dream of having a robot do all the housework.

Different times. The Mooney handle likely felt “dated” to the aircraft review pundits of the day.

And completion was fierce. Mooney’s competitor was advertising their fancy Land-o-Matic landing gear. Haha. If they could make gear that could make all landings easy, surely the Johnson Bar was outdated and in need of “upgrade” right?

(And your computer needs a faster processor and more RAM every year to go to the same websites you went to last year. And your pocket computer plus phone doesn’t take phone calls much anymore but needs a 6.5” screen and 128 GB of storage, bigger than my first hard drive by sixfold that was the size of four of those “book” things that now I read on my tablet or eReader.)

All evidence so far indicates by far that the most common failure in the landing gear system is the loose nut between the headset cups anyway. The systems for putting the gear up and down are way more robust than the moron behind the yoke.

Hydraulics weren’t exactly new when they were put in airplanes either. It was mostly a cost issue and complexity issue. Every kid on every farm knew how to fix a blown hydraulic line long before they were installed on airplanes built out of 30s era tractor engines and 40s era car parts in Wichita. Generators didn’t like the surge needed to start a stalled hydraulic pump. Alternators with higher output and more consistent output at low RPM in prep for landings, were much happier with it.

The modern aircraft trend is back toward simplicity and not bothering to suck the gear up at all, if we disregard the 70s era classics we’re all mostly flying for economic reasons. The airframes are more aerodynamic and they fly with less power needed to go fast without bothering to suck the gear up at all.

The FAA is even rumbling about removing the retract requirement on some ratings as long as modern cockpit tech is taught in its place.

That’s how far down the path we are, in a modern sense, of dumping the gear handle altogether in light aircraft.

So, no real need to analyze why simple mechanisms like the Mooney early gear were replaced with the flick of a switch. Of course thy were. You had to suck the gear up back then to go fast. LoPresti and fiberglass and composites were still a pipe dream back then. And “pushbutton convenience” was a marketing “thing” back then. Levers and gears were “so 1940s”.

We just don’t see the real demand for retracts anymore. The SR22T and TTX and other modern airframe owners aren’t screaming at the manufacturers to suck the gear up. They’re faster than anybody else most of the time anyway. Certainly faster than us 70s spam can metal airplane drivers.

FAA requiring them for certain certificates has kept a lot of retracts that would otherwise have been put out to pasture long ago, alive and barely maintained so Commercial and CFI candidates can go bomb around the pattern putting them up and down and up and down and up and down as they practice their power off 180s.

The modern airplane owner’s insurance companies seem to like the trend away from retracts, too. And insurance really drives much of this industry. Insuring a retract in a club or school adds a dollar amount commensurate with the accident rate, which as mentioned above, is mostly not caused by hydraulic or other system failures. It’s caused by pilots not putting the gear down.

Although I will admit hearing about the CFI ride with a Fed here locally that ended in a nose gear collapse on the last landing was pretty darn entertaining. That one was mechanical and the candidate passed I heard. The airplane was plenty checked out for airworthiness prior to takeoff, I’m sure. Why mention it?

Because most of us couldn’t spot a real gear problem in a preflight anyway, if we saw it. I’ll honestly say I could have looked under that airplane’s nose and probably not seen anything the candidate and a Fed didn’t see that would cause the nosegear to fold after touchdown at a normal landing rate of descent.

The retract fleet is getting really really old. Stuff is going to break. And does. It takes a good mechanic to know when to replace parts that are worn out and how often they fail.

Certain problematic systems have promoted more dramatic common changes like many owners of much older 210s taking the gear doors off. Gear works fine. Doors can become a problem. So they just yank them off and lose a couple of knots and call it a day. Cessna even did away with them on the newer ones eventually, so anecdotally even they gave up on them.

I’ve never read of anyone needing to modify the Mooney lever system. It “just worked”. It even had some built in abuse protection. Try to push that handle forward above the gear extension speed or even just flying fast, your arm muscles reminded you that you were doing something possibly dumb. Hydraulics will just push the metal out into the slipstream and let the wind load bend it or stress the connection points.

Let’s go one step further. Not trying to be anti-PC here but smaller people and ladies have taken up flying since the days of Mooney’s heyday. Muscle power available doesn’t always match the average available back then. I flew a checkride in an airplane with busted electric trim. It was a heavy plane, and the tiny manual trim wheel was a pain in my butt.

That same airplane the owner got the electric trim fixed when a customer showed up who simply didn’t have the arm strength to mess with that wheel for hours and hours of training flights back to back. She’s a good pilot. She’d do absolutely fine manually managing it in a real electric trim failure. But asking her to do it fifty or sixty times like I did in the same airplane for my rating? Just rude. So they fixed it.

Now I’m kinda jealous. They even fixed the autopilot while they were at it. That would have made my checkride a bit easier. Or maybe I’m not jealous and appreciated the extra work. I don’t really know. I survived it fine, either way.

Electric powered retractable landing gear is a feature that came, and now mostly has gone. It won’t be a very long time until the first time anyone sees it is in multi training. And that’s going to get expensive because Primacy and repetition of not having it will be a *****.

To try to alleviate that, many are teaching to always check the gear is down even in non-retracts from Day One. Not a completely awful idea.
 
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Total fluid losses in hydraulic systems are anything but common, even in systems that are abused as I noted earlier. If hydraulics were as fragile and unreliable as you seem to think you wouldn't find them on commercial airliners carrying tens of thousands of people every day.

The routine maintenance on hydraulic systems is neither exotic, or particularly expensive. There's lots of things on my airplane that have a measurably higher chance of failure than the hydraulics.
I admitted my perspective might be slightly biased because of my personal experience. Why belabor the point? And OF COURSE there are systems with a measurably higher chance of failure than hydraulics, I never said otherwise, just that that particular kind of failure WILL result in a very expensive belly landing, with no action by the pilot possible to avoid it. I would submit, though, that the reason total fluid loss is so rare probably has more to do with the requirement for frequent inspection and replacement than inherent robustness. And my anxiety over this is partially due to the fact that I've yet to have a mechanic suggest replacing all my hoses at annual even though I believe Cessna recommends this every 5 years. I've owned my plane now for 8. I'm going to have a talk about this with the guy that does my annual this year, when I drop the plane off.
 
Fixed and retractable both have one thing in common, I can't afford either.
 
We just don’t see the real demand for retracts anymore. The SR22T and TTX and other modern airframe owners aren’t screaming at the manufacturers to suck the gear up. They’re faster than anybody else most of the time anyway. Certainly faster than us 70s spam can metal airplane drivers.

An interesting thing about both these planes is, both were originally intended to be retractable gear because the engineers knew they would be even more efficient that way, but the FAA certification proved to be too much and retractable gear was abandoned in favor of fixed gear to save a load of money and time. Certifying an all new design here in the US to part 23 standards is almost impossible and adding retractable gear just increases that difficulty. Pretty much all the certified piston retractables we fly today (Bonanzas, Mooneys, 210s, Sierras, Arrows, etc) would be impossible to certify now.
 
The only gear malfunction I’ve ever heard of on a Johnson bar Mooney was a friend who’s gear was repaired incorrectly. It is true that there can be a real learning curve for the bar. There certainly was for me. But I wouldn’t have gotten a Mooney without. Very little to break or fix. Only aircraft I know with no emergency gear release.
 
Ask yourself, why don't cars have manual roll up windows anymore? They are more reliable and they're easy to use.

In theory, perhaps. In practice, I've had far more manual roll up window failures than I have electric roll up window failures.
 
An interesting thing about both these planes is, both were originally intended to be retractable gear because the engineers knew they would be even more efficient that way, but the FAA certification proved to be too much and retractable gear was abandoned in favor of fixed gear to save a load of money and time. Certifying an all new design here in the US to part 23 standards is almost impossible and adding retractable gear just increases that difficulty. Pretty much all the certified piston retractables we fly today (Bonanzas, Mooneys, 210s, Sierras, Arrows, etc) would be impossible to certify now.

What about the certification process is so onerous?
I heard there is a couple of drop tests and extension tests.
BTW, the parachute system on the Cirrus requires the landing gear to absorb impact energy, otherwise they have to make it much bigger. Contrary to popular belief using the chute doesn’t land like a feather on a pillow.
 
From the CAPS guide: "The airplane will descend under the canopy at less than 1700 fpm and ground impact is expected to be equivalent to dropping from a height of 13 feet (about 4 meters). The airframe, seats and landing gear are all designed to absorb the impact energy."
 
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