Figuring out the wind?

A slip is a slip. I think the archetypal "sideslip" is envisioned as a slip where the nose is aligned with the desired track. A "forward slip" is envisioned as a slip where the nose is not aligned with the desired track, in a direction opposite the bank. There are many combinations of yaw and roll that will provide the same drift correction (if any), but provide different drag profiles. An experienced pilot can choose combinations that produce a desired drift correction and descent rate. I had fun the other night during night currency flying slipping in on short final after amply avoiding the unlit ridge on base.
 
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luvflyin said:
Go around. And stay on the centerline with the plane ‘aligned’ on the centerline. Now there’s some training value
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About time we had some humor in this thread!
 
luvflyin said:
I was serious. Not that you would do it normally to land. But in the spirit of @Ryan F. ’s post #48
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So you should go around if you're using a slip to lose altitude and align for a x-wind? Since I always slipped to land my blind tailwheel airplane regardless of wind, I guess there are hundreds of landings I should have gone around on then. Now ya tell me!
 
luvflyin said:
Go around. And stay on the centerline with the plane ‘aligned’ on the centerline. Now there’s some training value
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luvflyin said:
I was serious. Not that you would do it normally to land. But in the spirit of @Ryan F. ’s post #48
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Why would I go around? A slip is not a big deal. In fact, it is what I normally do. I realize that dragging it in with power seems to be the popular thing to do now days, but I tend to avoid that - particularly when almost the whole pattern is over water (happens frequently).
 
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Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
What happens if you are high and have a crosswind at the same time?
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Then you TURN the airplane's nose away from the wind a little and cross the controls some more.

Or go around and do it right the next time.
 
RoscoeT said:
So you should go around if you're using a slip to lose altitude and align for a x-wind? Since I always slipped to land my blind tailwheel airplane regardless of wind, I guess there are hundreds of landings I should have gone around on then. Now ya tell me!
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No. Like I said it would just be something to do as a training exercise. A couple CFI’s said that they like the students to side slip from far out on final as training. Both said that later in training they do the usual crab on final and then kick it into a side slip to align with runway and touchdown. I’m sure they probably teach forward slips as an altitude losing maneuver, which can be done in a crab. It could be done while side slipping from far out also. Yer in a side slip staying aligned, yer high, ya put in the appropriate inputs to get some forward slipping altitude loss going, then back to the slide slip.
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
Why would I go around? A slip is not a big deal. In fact, it is what I normally do. I realize that dragging it in with power seems to be the popular thing to do now days, but I tend to avoid that - particularly when almost the whole pattern is over water (happens frequently).
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See post above
 
RoscoeT said:
Are you intentionally being obtuse? He's saying what if you're slipping to lose altitude which happens to also put the wing down in the direction to counter x-wind. What kind of slip is that for all the pedants here? This side slip vs. forward slip nonsense doesn't change the fact that if the airplane moves off your intended track based on wind variation, that you gotta do something about it, using the exact same inputs regardless of what kind of nonsense named "slip" you're in.
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I'm not being obtuse, intentionally or otherwise; I'm just declining to make assumptions. Slipping in a crosswind will already cause a steeper approach than the crab method, so if I'm "high and have a crosswind at the same time," I may do nothing out of the ordinary. (The trickier question is what to do if I'm low and have a crosswind.) If I can tell between base and short final that I'm so high or the crosswind is so light that the amount of side slip for crosswind will not be sufficient for the altitude I need to use, I'll add something else. Maybe flaps, maybe a forward slip--still in the same direction and using the same control inputs as a side slip. If I'm too high on short final, depending on the runway, I might go around.

But this all still seems to support slipping for crosswind landings, rather than crabbing, because it is one tool, that by only varying its degree, can be employed all the way from downwind to touchdown. The crab & kick method has no such advantage, and its disadvantages lead to confusion like what's demonstration in the original question of this thread.
 
Lindberg said:
But this all still seems to support slipping for crosswind landings, rather than crabbing, because it is one tool, that by only varying its degree, can be employed all the way from downwind to touchdown. The crab & kick method has no such advantage, and its disadvantages lead to confusion like what's demonstration in the original question of this thread.
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Crabbing on approach involves a lot less drag and discomfort for passengers who aren't familiar with having that falling-out-sideways feeling. To crab down to 15 feet and then transition to the slip is not a big deal once you've done it a few times. Start by doing it at a higher altitude, maybe 50 feet. Go around if it doesn't come off right. Keep trying until you get it right, then try it at a lower altitude. It's just another skill to have in your skill set, and it's handy.

Moreover, it's nice to be able to do much more than the PPL syllabus teaches. Like taildragger training. Or spins. Or off-airport landings. Too many folks are afraid of learning more stuff once they're licensed. I don't understand that. Most of us were told that the license was a license to learn, remember?
 
Lots of food for thought fir the OP but unless I missed it, no one mentioned another common pair of mistakes that leads to this problem:

Forgetting about aerodynamics knowledge:

As you slow the airplane and lift the nose to touchdown on the mains, what happens to airspeed? What happens to the effectiveness of your flight controls? What do you need to do to counteract this?

Follow through:

Where should your flight controls end up by walking speed after touchdown? Are they there? Hint: Where should they be for taxi to the taxiway?

Flare/Touchdown should be the beginning of a continued movement of your flight controls ... except rudder, once the nosewheel is planted such that steering is working. (Different deal in a taildragger.)

Are you applying your aeronautical knowledge of what happens to flight controls as you slow, and following through throughout the entire landing down to taxi speed?

Fly it until it’s tied down! :)
 
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