Knowing the FAA, the SI will be good for one year from the time you submitted the application.
FAA medical and OCD
- Thread starter Zep86
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Knowing the FAA, the SI will be good for one year from the time you submitted the application.
There are two dates of concern. The SI will have an expiration date and that's often from the time they make the decision. The other date is the expiration date of your medical which is by default the statutory number of months after the examination (in this case six). In some cases the FAA will shorten the duration (third class SIs usually say "Not valid for any class after one year"). However, the SI letter will give the process for the AME to issue on reexamination (usually on the spot).
That's what my liver SI said, but the "after one year" was measured from the date of submittal, not the date of approval, so it was only good for ~9 months. Just another reason I went Basic Med immediately.
Yeah, I've been off the SI for a while now. My (new) AME finally was able to convince the FAA that I never had the thing the SI was for and they should stop harassing me over it. It wasn't too onerous other than the fact that I was only on a one year renewal cycle on my third.
bbchien
Touchdown! Greaser!
I just had a third class airman who had been on Prozac for 12 years, off meds for 6 months, it took 18 months (in "pending") but he managed to convince the agency (D.C). that he never had anything, and was isused on 4 years of every 6 month physicals by -yours-truly- B4 they will let him go..
That is not quite the same, as having the experts say you had "recurrent disease---> certified on the SSRI pathway, and then reversed. My guy ONLY had the high level guy saying, "I doubt he ever had anything".
So I don't think one who certifies on the SSRI pathway has much of a chance off meds.
And for those who asked, there is a form of OCD, when severe enough, prevented the pilots in the accident, in question.....we think from making the "go around decision" in a timely manner. there are some folks with OCD for whom OCD does interfere with timely decision making. When OCD does that, for AVIATION, it affects reality testing and thus requires an SI B4 use of Basic Med.
That is not quite the same, as having the experts say you had "recurrent disease---> certified on the SSRI pathway, and then reversed. My guy ONLY had the high level guy saying, "I doubt he ever had anything".
So I don't think one who certifies on the SSRI pathway has much of a chance off meds.
And for those who asked, there is a form of OCD, when severe enough, prevented the pilots in the accident, in question.....we think from making the "go around decision" in a timely manner. there are some folks with OCD for whom OCD does interfere with timely decision making. When OCD does that, for AVIATION, it affects reality testing and thus requires an SI B4 use of Basic Med.
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P
Pilot Asker
Guest
Dr. Bruce, do you mind if I ask whether that was 18 months total, or 18 months once D.C. got the file? Asking as a non-revenue first-class applicant in a similar position. Deferred circa Memorial Day 2019, file went to D.C. mid-September 2019. Is it crazy to hope I might hear back by May 2020?
bbchien
Touchdown! Greaser!
That was total. DC sat on it for a whole year.
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Pilot 27
Guest
Dr. Bruce, what happens to the airmen if his medical is denied after going through that whole process? Is he/she out of luck or are there any options?
bbchien
Touchdown! Greaser!
He can the apply on the SSRI path provided he has none of the “excluders” in his past. But going the other way is NOT going to happen.
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Pilot 27
Guest
Thanks for the reply Dr Bruce. So if an airmen applies on the SSRI pathway on meds and is denied for whatever reason, they can’t apply at a later date on pathway 1/ off meds if the condition has been resolved and documented? It seems like ocd in this case or depression could possibly be treated if being on meds was not approved.
bbchien
Touchdown! Greaser!
They don't like OCD. (Full OCD). OCD is not on the SSRI certification list. It is "Try and convince us".
And if you have any severity excluders in your past anywhere- dual meds to control;, suicidality, hospitalization, cognitive instability.....one can't use that pathway.
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Pilot 27
Guest
Interesting, thanks for explaining more about this. My question is this, If an airmen isn’t successful at “try and convince us” for pathway II, can they reapply again pathway I if off meds and controlled, no excluders?
bbchien
Touchdown! Greaser!
Yes, if you have infinite resources.....
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Pilot 27
Guest
Hey James, any update on your medical? Hope all is well.
J
James Lacy
Guest
Yes, update. The day after Christmas a contact in DC told me that I was still two weeks out for a determination. That same day, Dec. 26th, I received certified mail with my SI. This brought my full journey to 2.5 years. To gain approval under "expedited" circumstances as a revenue airman, my submittal to DC on Dec. 17, 2018 resulted in a Dec. 26, 2019 SI approval.
Back to flying for work and things are great. Next cog screen coming up so unfortunate to have that constantly placed as an obstacle, but better than no path at all. Good luck!
P
Pilot 27
Guest
Great news James, glad to hear things are working out for you. Have you used anything to help prepare for the cog screen?
It's been a while since I've been on here for this post. I've made a few calls and even have gathered some information directly from the FAA about OCD, which was somewhat a surprise knowing how much of a stubborn bureaucracy it can be.
So, the FAA says that between 2015 and 2019, 52 pilots were SI'd for OCD/OCPD, with 3 final denials in that time period. It's the thinnest silver lining in creation, but it is possible. I did have conversations with Dr. Chien about this, he was a great resource and I thank him for his help.
I've got a few more steps in my quest for information and documentation before submitting a medical. I've been intentionally slow because I want to cross the t's and dot the lower cased j's.
Since I am going after a class 3, we'll how cost prohibitive they'll make the process... I am not expecting "easy", but maybe i'll catch them on a good day
So, the FAA says that between 2015 and 2019, 52 pilots were SI'd for OCD/OCPD, with 3 final denials in that time period. It's the thinnest silver lining in creation, but it is possible. I did have conversations with Dr. Chien about this, he was a great resource and I thank him for his help.
I've got a few more steps in my quest for information and documentation before submitting a medical. I've been intentionally slow because I want to cross the t's and dot the lower cased j's.
Since I am going after a class 3, we'll how cost prohibitive they'll make the process... I am not expecting "easy", but maybe i'll catch them on a good day
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Anonymous
Guest
Do you know if any were given an unrestricted medical? My AME said that was possible if you'd never taken an SSRI and have no cognitive issues, but the HIMS psych I've been working with said unlikely.
A
Anonymous
Guest
No worries. My SI actually arrived a few days after I asked, so...much better than a denial!
Awesome!No worries. My SI actually arrived a few days after I asked, so...much better than a denial!
May I ask, did you have a OCD diagnosis?
What kind of testing did they require from you?
A
Anonymous
Guest
Yup, OCD. No meds ever, currently in remission (as much as OCD can ever be). They required a psych eval (mine isn't a HIMS case, but I went straight to a HIMS psych, no screwing around with someone who didn't know aviation) and the full battery with the neuropsychologist. It's not something I'd like to go through again, but once they got the paperwork they wanted, they approved my SI incredibly quickly.
I had put this off for a long time since I assumed I had no shot, but it turned out to be not nearly as painful and complex as everyone warned me.
A
Aphelion
Guest
let me start by saying it was always my dream to become a commercial pilot I loved watching the planes at the airport and dreaming of owning a Cessna 150 one day (I set the bar low) my first real job was working at Northrop Grumman as a tooling designer designing molds for aircraft parts in my spare time I would read about aerodynamics and design planes in my head and on paper. now where it gets sad.
I am amazed by how cruel of a system the FAA can be I was given Zoloft by my family doctor around the age of 12 the doctor thought because I was acting strangely (what kid isn't quirky) and that because my Dad actually had OCD that it would be a good idea to give it to me as well, I later discontinued use of the medication around the age of 13 once I had stopped being "quirky". even though it has literally been a decade and I only took the medication as a young child it has absolutely been the most horrendous arduous and ridiculous pain in my rear that I have ever experienced. As a college student trying to go through flight school having to turn up 4,500$ for a neuropsychologist appoint (which was nothing more than an insulting barrage of children's logic puzzles) was very difficult to say the least and then after that having to pay an additional 4,500$ (I was not able to afford this) to see a "specially certified HIMS AME" 3 states away. on the bible I can guarantee that I am completely mentally fit and qualified, but because of the FAA's ludicrous and backwards testing standards/requirements I have had to throw away my dream of being a commercial pilot and I'm now missing 95% of my wallet to a complete waste. calling me and talking to me on the phone would have been an infinitely more accurate method to gauge whether I was mentally fit than the 10k of testing that they had requested I complete. I share this story to let others know of the suffering that they have caused me as well as the hope that someone of influence might see my story and actually make a difference and finally to warn other potential pilots that if they ever had to take Zoloft for OCD that they would be better off not disclosing that information to the "Fathers of Anti American Aviation" (FAA) this coming from someone who has always considered himself to be an upstanding and honest member of society. in my opinion such a ridiculous system lends me no other option considering how very unfairly and inhumanely I have been treated.
Best regards
dreamless,
If anyone seeing this would like to know about my story can text me at 385-333-8326
I am amazed by how cruel of a system the FAA can be I was given Zoloft by my family doctor around the age of 12 the doctor thought because I was acting strangely (what kid isn't quirky) and that because my Dad actually had OCD that it would be a good idea to give it to me as well, I later discontinued use of the medication around the age of 13 once I had stopped being "quirky". even though it has literally been a decade and I only took the medication as a young child it has absolutely been the most horrendous arduous and ridiculous pain in my rear that I have ever experienced. As a college student trying to go through flight school having to turn up 4,500$ for a neuropsychologist appoint (which was nothing more than an insulting barrage of children's logic puzzles) was very difficult to say the least and then after that having to pay an additional 4,500$ (I was not able to afford this) to see a "specially certified HIMS AME" 3 states away. on the bible I can guarantee that I am completely mentally fit and qualified, but because of the FAA's ludicrous and backwards testing standards/requirements I have had to throw away my dream of being a commercial pilot and I'm now missing 95% of my wallet to a complete waste. calling me and talking to me on the phone would have been an infinitely more accurate method to gauge whether I was mentally fit than the 10k of testing that they had requested I complete. I share this story to let others know of the suffering that they have caused me as well as the hope that someone of influence might see my story and actually make a difference and finally to warn other potential pilots that if they ever had to take Zoloft for OCD that they would be better off not disclosing that information to the "Fathers of Anti American Aviation" (FAA) this coming from someone who has always considered himself to be an upstanding and honest member of society. in my opinion such a ridiculous system lends me no other option considering how very unfairly and inhumanely I have been treated.
Best regards
dreamless,
If anyone seeing this would like to know about my story can text me at 385-333-8326
A
Anonymous
Guest
Wrong. Lying isn't worth it.
https://www.ajc.com/news/local-govt...th-issues-keep-flying/x9NZ6v6ufqewPaQRC8QpGL/
And the 10k is an exaggeration. My evaluations for history of OCD were half that. And I got certified. You would have learned, had you stuck it out, that the money and frustration involved is par for the course in aviation.
Rushie
En-Route
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Rushie
Guess in what universe I’d let a family doc give my kid an SSRI?
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s40501-015-0034-9
Your story is all too common. Psychoactive meds for children should be the very last resort, after all other options are exhausted, and that means taking a hard honest look at the family dynamic and the kid’s daily life. It could be as simple as getting him outside for sunshine and exercise, or pulling him out of an atrocious school environment. Not to mention look for physical causes.
I know a 12 year old girl who is having behavioral problems, depression, and anxiety. The doctor put her on an anti-depressant and an anti-anxiety drug. After several months with no improvement they finally decided to check her hormones. She’s got hyperandrogenism! (too many male hormones - not good in girls.) Her parents are taking her off the drugs and consulting a specialist in gynecological endocrinology.
When she grows up and wants to be a pilot, now she will have to explain the psyche meds to the FAA, in addition to the hormone disorder, totally avoidable if they’d not jumped to dx: mental disorder, in a kid hitting puberty and suddenly acting strange.
Physical and environmental causes should be the first thing you look for in children.
I’m sorry you got screwed by these people. Not disclosing it isn’t the answer. You might get away with it but if you auger in, it won’t go well for your estate. I wouldn’t do that to your family.
B
B Bailey
Guest
I know this was some time ago and you may never see this, but I am about to start this same unfortunate journey and would like to pick your brain if possible. Is there a way I can contact you?
E
Emily17!!!
Guest
B. Bailey, did you ever get certified?
It's always the date of the examination. Even if the FAA took longer than the "not valid after" date to issue.
bbchien
Touchdown! Greaser!
We just got this. This is how bad it is....
It's been a while since I've been here, but to just let those know who are looking for hope, the FAA officially allows fast tracking of applications of people who have a history of depression and OCD. The new rule took affect this week, it seems. It looks like as long as there aren't compound mental health issues, an AME can green light an application. It looks like the FAA is moving into the 21st century.
bbchien
Touchdown! Greaser!
Yes but look at all the provisos. That is VERY VERY restricted authority. We reviewed that with the FAS last Friday at a grand rounds....
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