Egyptian A320 missing

RudyP said:
I was also of the opinion that airlines seemed to cancel at times due to low load factor but I am willing to be corrected on this assumption.
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I have been an airline pilot for over 25 years and have never seen a flight cancel due to low bookings. I've even flown an airplane out-and-back from the hub completely empty.

People who think flights are being cancelled due to low loads are confusing the cause and effect.

When an airline is forced to cancel a flight due to a lack of airplanes (maintenance, no spares, etc.) or lack of crews (crews timing out, out of reserves, etc.) then the airline will cancel the flight which has the least overall impact on the operation. In other words, they won't cancel an overbooked flight with no re-route options just because the airplane that broke happened to be the one originally assigned to the flight. They will cancel the flight that has the least impact and swap the airplanes and/or crews around to best cover the remaining schedule.

The point that people miss is that a flight is being cancelled only because the airline does not have an airplane and/or crewmember to complete the flight. If they were not short of airplanes/crews the flight would operate--even if empty.
 
Lindberg said:
Flights get cancelled everyday and it's dealt with. So it isn't like a cancellation is catastrophic. A couple of years ago, when the union was fighting with AA, pilots were canceling flights for minor issues not affecting airworthiness. Life went on.
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Even if a pilot writes up some BS squawk, he does not cancel the flight. That isn't his call. If it is not an airworthiness issue and Mx/MOC says the airplane is good then the pilot can try to refuse the flight but he had better have a good reason that will stand up when the Chief Pilot talks to him. If he still refuses, another pilot will be called to take the flight. It might cause a delay but rarely a cancellation and if it does, that pilot will have a lot of explaining to do.
 
Does the A-320 have Lithium-ion batteries in the avionics compartment?? There are now reports of smoke alarms in a lav and in the avionics compartment reported over ACARS.
 
I strongly suspect a bomb was placed on the airplane by someone cleared to work on the ramp.

In other news, the head of TSA was doing a happy dance on TV about this crash.
 
Which pilot had the flight simulator at home ??? Surprised CNN has not determined that yet :eek::confused:
 
orange said:
Losing radar contact at 37k feet would mean that the plane broke up, correct? Or could it have nosedived into the ground and a controller didn't notice the dive until disappeared? RIP.

Article says there were 56 passengers onboard, that like 1/3 capacity. Foreign airlines make the flight regradless of number of passengers. US airlines would find a reason to cancel the flight if it was less than 3/4 full.
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That is BS nonsense.
 
JimNtexas said:
I strongly suspect a bomb was placed on the airplane by someone cleared to work on the ramp.

In other news, the head of TSA was doing a happy dance on TV about this crash.
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Jeh Johnson will get his money.
 
Bobcat1 said:
Looks like he's joking. A few more posts into this thread and you'll see that the both of you are on the same page. Orange, however, is your guy.

I've never seen an airline cancel a flight due to a light load factor. It just doesn't happen.
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I suck at the Internet

Sorry for the confusion
 
mscard88 said:
But old Richard Quest is still spouting his bs, and Mary. :rolleyes:
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I can't stand Quest. You'd think that with the high number of real aviation professionals or experts that are available that they'd use someone more credible and knowledgeable.
 
Lindberg said:
I'm not sure why we discussing it in this thread, but just about any American frequent flyer has experienced it. Of course that isn't the reason they give, but I'm sure you could find a legitimate pretextual reason to cancel any flight. Of course sometimes they need the aircraft to move even though it's half empty, but I don't think anybody claimed it happens every time. But if you've got ten flights and nine planes, which one's getting cancelled? Or back to back half empty flights to the same destination? I've seen many times the earlier flight is cancelled and all the passengers magically fit on the next flight. In fact, it happened to me the last time I returned from SFO, and I happened to wind up on the later flight next to an FA commuting to her base, who confirmed it happened regularly.
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I've experienced something like that twice. Actually got to my destination earlier on the flight I was transferred to than the ETA of the cancelled flight on one of them. The other time was not a big deal either, walk a few feet to another gate, get on plane. The seats sucked though, lost my good boarding number. Both times there were not many of us that had to be moved to other flights. Amazing coincidence that airplanes with a lot of empty seats seem to have a lot of maintenance issues.
 
Interesting. Hopefully this will help them narrow the scope of the investigation.


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Still makes an incendiary device a good possibility.
 
Lindberg said:
I don't understand why it's always, "cockpit voice recorder indicates this or that...." The CVR doesn't indicate anything, it records noises. So let us hear the recording or give us a transcript. The third-order analysis is useless.
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But, but, "sources say..."

I don't know how Egyptian "NTSB" works, or how or when transcripts will be released. I haven't heard anything about the FDR info.
 
Matthew said:
I don't know how Egyptian "NTSB" works,
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maybe Steve Martin can help explain ...

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Matthew said:
But, but, "sources say..."

I don't know how Egyptian "NTSB" works, or how or when transcripts will be released. I haven't heard anything about the FDR info.
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Last week there were reports that the FDR confirmed the earlier reports of fire in the front of the aircraft and avionics bay. FDR stopped recording just before the aircraft started dropping out of the sky. Earlier this week, CVR was reviewed and that also confirmed the crew was dealing with smoke etc. Actual transcripts were not released.
 
A big question is whether the fire near the cockpit started in the lav immediately behind the cockpit, or in the avionics bay.

The layout is here.

I'd guess that a forensic inspection of the fire damage might be the only way to figure out how the fire started.
 
Reuters and the NYT are reporting today that the plane broke up in flight:

http://ca.reuters.com/article/topNews/idCAKCN1022PB

EgyptAir Flight 804 broke up in midair after a fire

(Reuters) - Evidence gathered in an investigation into the crash of EgyptAir Flight 804 in the Mediterranean Sea in May shows the plane likely broke up in midair after a fire near or inside the cockpit that quickly overwhelmed the crew, according to Egyptian officials involved in the inquiry, the New York Times reported on Friday.

But the officials could not determine whether the fire thought to have caused the crash had been set off by a mechanical malfunction or by a malicious act, the report said.

 
Sac Arrow said:
It seems like the media has concluded it's terrorism. Oh yeah so has Donald Trump. But I don't think anyone has a clue yet what happened.
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The difference is, the media will not condemn themselves for jumping to a conclusion.

Gotta get that mat....
 
bflynn said:
The difference is, the media will not condemn themselves for jumping to a conclusion.
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When has Trump ever condemned himself for anything?
 
bflynn said:
The difference is, the media will not condemn themselves for jumping to a conclusion.

Gotta get that mat....
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I just mentioned Trump as an aside because he did make the comment. The post wasn't aimed at Trump, it was aimed at the media.
 
GRG55 said:
Reuters and the NYT are reporting today that the plane broke up in flight:

http://ca.reuters.com/article/topNews/idCAKCN1022PB

EgyptAir Flight 804 broke up in midair after a fire

(Reuters) - Evidence gathered in an investigation into the crash of EgyptAir Flight 804 in the Mediterranean Sea in May shows the plane likely broke up in midair after a fire near or inside the cockpit that quickly overwhelmed the crew, according to Egyptian officials involved in the inquiry, the New York Times reported on Friday.

But the officials could not determine whether the fire thought to have caused the crash had been set off by a mechanical malfunction or by a malicious act, the report said.
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Didn't we know this at the time it went down?
 
Lindberg said:
Didn't we know this at the time it went down?
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If you follow the speculations, as usual after this sort of incident we knew "everything" within nanoseconds of the plane crashing, and long before the recorders were retrieved. :rolleyes:

On a more serious note, what I read in the posted link is confirmation (from the investigation) that the plane did not hit the water intact, and there's no evidence there was an explosive responsible for the breakup in flight.


James331 had an insightful post early in this thread...
James331 said:
Kinda sounds like someone trying to see what controls they have left.
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...but still firmly in the category of intelligent speculation at that point in time.
 
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