Driving a Semi Tractor for Fun

[Ted]

I had a peterbilt 378 model with a unicab single sleeper. Lot of room in cab and basically open front to back. Had a 430 Detroit with a 15 speed. It had a pusher axle, so was a 4 axle tractor. I bob tailed it to Virginia to pick up a rgn trailer and got 14 mpg on the trip down. On trip back with 25000 lb trailer I averaged 11. I wouldn't let anyone touch it, as it got crazy good mileage and plenty of power. I pulled excavator and dozers around with it. I had about 10 other trucks with detroits and this one was by far best mileage. The one I pulled my camper with was a kenworth t2000 that had a 500 Detroit and autoshift 9 speed. Was basically a show truck with diesel genset that had been used for the show wicked, to tour the country. Pulled 5th wheel nicely. It only got about 8mpg. I've got a Volvo right now with a Cummings in it. The truck is cheap and parts aren't. It will be heading down the road soon and will be replaced. You won't get good mileage with a Cummings. I get maybe 6.

I don't know why I thought this, but my impression of Detroit Diesels was generally negative. It sounds that your experience with them is more positive, at least from a mileage perspective. Your statement on bad mileage from Cummins seems right. My friend said he got 5 MPG going back home with his K100 and a Cummins 400 Big Cam. He was doing 75 MPH and it's an older truck with the engine in unknown condition (although it seemed to run decent), but I had figured empty he should've gotten better than that.

 

[bnt83]

Well after spending a hour trying to figure how to post pics of the v12 truck and getting ticked off I give up. Never tried to post pics before and apparently I'm to old to figure it out.

I'll post it if you send it to me.

 

[Theboys]

By Detroit I'm talking of the 60 series engines. I've had bunch of them with little trouble. The cat engines were to expensive to keep together although they will beat the mileage of a big cam Cummings. I had detroits with over a million miles I didn't do much more than change oil. My first trucks had cat 1693ta engines in them and they ran great. Had three and they all got 5.25 mpg. When the first electronic engines came out I didn't want to own. After I bought my first ones in around 96 I hurriedly got rid of the mechanical engines for electronic. My fuel mileage went up by at least 20%. Now the old v12 would wear out in about 200000. Cummings are plentiful and fairly easy to work on but Detroit was my top choice.

 

[Ted]

I was assuming you meant the Series 60 Detroit Diesel, which at that point is newer than what I'm thinking.

I think I'm going to keep watching for something that's a good deal, and also think some about what the requirements would be. Since I have enough projects with the plane and the house at the moment it's not like I'm sitting around twiddling my thumbs. The kids keep on wanting to watch truck and tractor pulls. Watching some of these cab overs with enough power to do wheelies makes me think I wouldn't want to be that close to the engine when it blows the head off.

 

[weilke]

In Nebraska farmers can drive a semi without a cdl so maybe you can fit in that on your acreage. ....

In MD, to obtain farm tags for a truck, you need to submit your IRS schedule F to show that you have an active farming operation. Just owning land doesn't do the trick.

 

[Ted]

In MD, to obtain farm tags for a truck, you need to submit your IRS schedule F to show that you have an active farming operation. Just owning land doesn't do the trick.

I did look into claiming as a farm for the reduced cost here in Kansas, but it did require some proof that we weren't able to provide since we aren't actually a farm. I forget the details.

 

[Matthew]

KS has some interesting age limits for farm kids and driver's licenses. Your kids are almost old enough.

 

[Ted]

KS has some interesting age limits for farm kids and driver's licenses. Your kids are almost old enough.

When I looked at it it seemed my kids could get their licenses at 14. That wasn't based on farm, had to do with distance from town. Laurie was 14 when she got hers, they also lived out in the country. We're all for letting the kids get their licenses at a young age. We started Robert on steering basically as soon as he could reach the wheel. I'm working with him now on staying in the correct lane while driving the Ford 9N.

He'll have about 10 years until he can get his license (turns 4 on Saturday). That should be enough time to build him a car. We'll have to see what he ends up getting. Right now I'm thinking the main requirement is that it be some form of a project that we can work on together. That should be an easy sell assuming his interest in garage time keeps up.

 

[Matthew]

It's been a long time since my kids were learning to drive, but my recollection is that KS lets you get a learner's permit at 14, and you need a licensed adult (>=21) in the front seat. And you are not supposed to use the kid as a designated driver...just sayin'.

A Farm Permit lets you solo at 14 to/from school by most direct route between home and school, and "to or from farm job, employment or other farm related work"

http://www.ksrevenue.org/dmvgdl.html

We have graduated licenses now and I haven't had to learn all the different details. Back in the day you got your permit at 14 and your license at 16. Unless you lived on a farm, then you started driving when you could see over the dash. I know a lot of kids start driving to school in Jr High on the restricted license (15 yrs) that allows driving to/from school. Makes for interesting adventures when I drive through the Jr High school zone next to my house.

 

[Ted]

I think we were able to apply for the "farm permit" for to/from school as a factor of our location, but maybe not. I'm not worried about my kids being good drivers by the time they're 14, it'll more be a question of the standard teenage aspects (driving too fast, etc). Seeing as it's 10 years off, no reason in planning too much yet. I do plan on taking them racing to improve their skills and try to get them to keep the racing off the street (unlike their dad as a teenager...).

As for the not using the kid as the designated driver, yeah... my mom used to use me for her designated driver when I had a learner's permit and bragged about being able to drink as much as she wanted because I was her designated driver. My response was more or less:

'course, I also knew enough not to complain too heavily as I was a better driver than her the day I got my permit. As I valued my life, any time with her not in the left seat significantly increased my chances of living that day. The woman was the second worst driver in the history of the world. Her mother, my grandmother, was the worst. Trees would regularly jump out in front of them while driving. She had enough wrecks/claims that as a teenage male with a V12 rear wheel drive Jaguar, my insurance was less than hers (middle aged woman with a Volvo). Fortunately, she let her license expire. I doubt she could figure out how to start a modern car with one of the "start/stop" buttons.

 

[NealRomeoGolf]

CAT engines are the best. But I'm biased......

 

[Ted]

A bit of searching came up with a couple of interesting ones.

Diamond T:

International 4070 dump truck:

The dump truck could actually have some useful factors around our homestead, plus this one has a Detroit 8V71 2-stroke (the 2-stroke diesels interest me). The Diamond T says it has a Cummins of some sort. I actually like the look of that old International cabover. Major cool factor for that Diamond T.

 

[denverpilot]

If you can park it in the front lawn, and it goes dead like a month after you park it there... I'd say you're really catching on to this country redneck thing, Ted. LOL.

 

[Ted]

This (more or less) is our property:



So, technically yes, we would be parking any vehicle on our front lawn, but note that it's a rather... large lawn.

I think an old truck we'd probably try to do some level of restoration on. The Diamond T has some significant cool factor attributing to that. The International Transtar I'm liking, although the dump truck portion is less cool (but would be functional).

 

[Matthew]

Get the dump truck. You'd only need to take out the trash once every other year.

 

[Ted]

Get the dump truck. You'd only need to take out the trash once every other year.

We have trash service.

Since it has a sleeper cab, we figured it'd be good for when mom visits.

 

[pilottim]

I've wondered about this: Any AME's do the DOT physical too as a twofer?

I once got both from a doctor in Wisconsin. That was a few years ago and I haven't managed to make it happen again since then.

 

[Ted]

We've decided to do some shuffling of vehicles, since what we have really doesn't do what we need particularly well. Right now we have two sedans (BMW 740iL and Mercedes E55) and one light-duty pickup truck (Chevy Avalanche). We're planning on getting rid of two, potentially three (the E55 is the only one we might keep, but I'm leaning towards selling it). We'll replace them with a Ford Excursion, probably some other sedan that can be the backup kid-hauler, and then some form of truck with pickup/carrying capability.

So long as we have two vehicles that can haul the kids, that opens up a lot of options for the 3rd vehicle. I could easily go for a 3/4 or 1-ton pickup as I've had in the past. I'm also thinking that it might be a good opportunity to go get a semi or some 2+ ton truck. The 70s cabover sleepers are growing on me, mainly for the shorter overall length aspects and I think would make for a cool conversion plus I like the style with the round headlights. Although a conventional I suppose is probably easier to work on, more stable, and also has more interior room. Having not spent much time in either it seems like the cabovers do still have enough room for driver and passenger next to the engine.

 

[SoonerAviator]

Well, if you're getting an Excursion, that pretty much takes the place of the 3/4 ton truck. Just use a trailer if you need to haul anything heavy/dirty. Not much opinion on the cabover. I get that it would be a fun toy for a little bit, but I'd probably opt for one of those Western Hauler F-550/650s if I really wanted anything similar for real heavy (30K lbs+) towing like a cabover would do.

 

[Ted]

Well, if you're getting an Excursion, that pretty much takes the place of the 3/4 ton truck. Just use a trailer if you need to haul anything heavy/dirty. Not much opinion on the cabover. I get that it would be a fun toy for a little bit, but I'd probably opt for one of those Western Hauler F-550/650s if I really wanted anything similar for real heavy (30K lbs+) towing like a cabover would do.

We end up having a need for a truck-type vehicle beyond my wife's daily driver. There are plenty of times//days when I need to go to pickup wood or other larger items that require a truck or trailer. Right now with the Avalanche being the backup vehicle, I can take that. If the Excursion is the daily driver, I don't want to swap car seats just so I can go take that. The various F-550+ trucks have some appeal, although those end up being much more money.

 

[Zeldman]

So long as we have two vehicles that can haul the kids, that opens up a lot of options for the 3rd vehicle. I could easily go for a 3/4 or 1-ton pickup as I've had in the past. I'm also thinking that it might be a good opportunity to go get a semi or some 2+ ton truck. The 70s cabover sleepers are growing on me, mainly for the shorter overall length aspects and I think would make for a cool conversion plus I like the style with the round headlights. Although a conventional I suppose is probably easier to work on, more stable, and also has more interior room. Having not spent much time in either it seems like the cabovers do still have enough room for driver and passenger next to the engine.

Test drive one, and you may change your mind. The old cabovers were real kidney busters. I remember some of the ones I used to drive and I would spend half the time trying to hold myself in the seat while driving.

 

[Ted]

Test drive one, and you may change your mind. The old cabovers were real kidney busters. I remember some of the ones I used to drive and I would spend half the time trying to hold myself in the seat while driving.

True, I'm basing this purely on aesthetics. I do like the older style with some more round features to them. The roads around here are good which helps, I don't anticipate doing any long hauls. But I also don't want anything that's too uncomfortable.

So you'd say the conventionals are more comfortable? The extra interior space is certainly a consideration.

 

[Zeldman]

On cabovers the drivers seat is almost right over the left front wheel. The models I drove, mostly late 60s to late 70s models were pretty rough riding. Even with the new at the time air ride seats. Any mediocre bump in the road was accelerated by the time it went through the suspension, the seat and then me.

Of course things have changed considerably since my driving. Updated seats and better riding suspension may have smoothed the ride out.

Another point to consider is I was always the kid, so I never got the good equipment to drive. I always got the trucks no one else would drive....

I always thought the conventionals rode better. One problem on the older models with the big hood was not being able to see what is in front of the right front corner.

I have always been partial to the older Macs, since the first truck I ever drove was a '48 Mac. The steering wheel was as big as a hoola hoop.

 

[Ted]

On cabovers the drivers seat is almost right over the left front wheel. The models I drove, mostly late 60s to late 70s models were pretty rough riding. Even with the new at the time air ride seats. Any mediocre bump in the road was accelerated by the time it went through the suspension, the seat and then me.

Of course things have changed considerably since my driving. Updated seats and better riding suspension may have smoothed the ride out.

Another point to consider is I was always the kid, so I never got the good equipment to drive. I always got the trucks no one else would drive....

I always thought the conventionals rode better. One problem on the older models with the big hood was not being able to see what is in front of the right front corner.

I have always been partial to the older Macs, since the first truck I ever drove was a '48 Mac. The steering wheel was as big as a hoola hoop.

Good thoughts and experience. As I've said, this is a new realm for me (which is part of the appeal - learn about something new).

One thing with the cabover is I'd prefer to have an overall length under 30' mostly for maneuverability. That seems a bit harder to do with a conventional with a sleeper cab. Since the sleeper cab is something I definitely want, that makes me think the better compromise is on the hood. One that has air ride would certainly be preferred, although since I suspect those are normally in the rear I'd not expect those to make a huge difference up front, especially with you being positioned directly above that left front tire as you mentioned.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Good thoughts and experience. As I've said, this is a new realm for me (which is part of the appeal - learn about something new).

One thing with the cabover is I'd prefer to have an overall length under 30' mostly for maneuverability. That seems a bit harder to do with a conventional with a sleeper cab. Since the sleeper cab is something I definitely want, that makes me think the better compromise is on the hood. One that has air ride would certainly be preferred, although since I suspect those are normally in the rear I'd not expect those to make a huge difference up front, especially with you being positioned directly above that left front tire as you mentioned.

I believe "air ride" was referring to the brand / style of drivers seat.

Not the truck suspension with air bags.

What drives the need for the Ford Excursion over a nicer riding Expedition or 1/2 ton Suburban?

I agree you should get rid of the Avalanche. Those really don't function well as pickups.
Have you looked at the Dodge 2500 MegaCabs? Great pick ups, and plenty of cab room for car seats.

I just picked one up, and like it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Marky_24]

I learned to drive in an 80's cabover, now i own my own trucking company. For me its long nose Peterbilts or nothing ! But for a little put put truck a cabover would be fun

 

[Theboys]

I had a small international dump truck. Single axle Allison auto and dt466. Was a single axle with maybe a 13 ft dump. Could haul 10 tons or so of rock. Had a snow plow as I think it was a state or county truck. Anyway it drove great and rode pretty good. Had hitch on the back and I drove it sometimes instead of pickup. Think I bought on auction for 5500$. Would be perfect for you.

 

[Ted]

I believe "air ride" was referring to the brand / style of drivers seat.

Not the truck suspension with air bags.

What drives the need for the Ford Excursion over a nicer riding Expedition or 1/2 ton Suburban?

I agree you should get rid of the Avalanche. Those really don't function well as pickups.
Have you looked at the Dodge 2500 MegaCabs? Great pick ups, and plenty of cab room for car seats.

I just picked one up, and like it.

There are air ride seats and also air ride suspensions. I'd imagine that both have an impact on comfort.

To answer your question about an Expedition or 1/2-ton Suburban, I don't like 1/2-ton trucks. I've never driven one that I liked driving. I do like the way 3/4-ton trucks drive. We have a boat that weighs in at 7k and an unenclosed trailer that's rated for 7k that we'll tow our tractors with from time to time. We both liked the Excursion we used to have, and agree we never should've gotten rid of it. So, we'll go back. For the family truckster a pickup won't do the trick well.

I learned to drive in an 80's cabover, now i own my own trucking company. For me its long nose Peterbilts or nothing ! But for a little put put truck a cabover would be fun

Yeah, I'm not talking about something that will ever see 80k lbs, or even anywhere close. The intent is under 26k. So it'd really be for putting around, as you say.

If I were going to be looking at something for serious hauling, then I'd be looking down a different path without a doubt.

I had a small international dump truck. Single axle Allison auto and dt466. Was a single axle with maybe a 13 ft dump. Could haul 10 tons or so of rock. Had a snow plow as I think it was a state or county truck. Anyway it drove great and rode pretty good. Had hitch on the back and I drove it sometimes instead of pickup. Think I bought on auction for 5500$. Would be perfect for you.

I've thought about something like that as well and you're right it would fit my needs very well. One thing with those is that they're pretty much always a regular cab, and I don't want something that's got a larger cab associated.

 

[Marky_24]

I haul a lot of these all over the country. It might not have the cool old vintage look , but the price is right
http://www.ironplanet.com/for-sale/...ct|35,m|AM+General&rr=0.25&hitprm=&pnLink=yes

 

[Ted]

I haul a lot of these all over the country. It might not have the cool old vintage look , but the price is right
http://www.ironplanet.com/for-sale/Trucks-Conventional-Tractor-1980-AM-General-M916-6x6-Tractor-Truck-Kentucky/795163?h=5000,ct|35,m|AM+General&rr=0.25&hitprm=&pnLink=yes

The old military trucks definitely have some good cool factors. One friend of mine has a deuce-and-a-half that he ends up using for fun and as a box truck. I certainly could do a bobbed military truck, but that's less appealing overall.

I was looking at a few International 4700 series. There were more crew cabs than I had expected to find with prices not too far off from what I was looking at, but don't like the looks of them. Plus that's a conversion that's been done many times before. I realize trucks are supposed to be utilitarian, but this is also about some degree of fun if I go this route.

 

[Matthew]

I saw this thread again, earlier today, and I've had "White Freightliner Blues" bouncing around in my head all day.

Townes Van Zandt

And Lyle Lovett does a snappier version:

 

[Ted]

I saw this thread again, earlier today, and I've had "White Freightliner Blues" bouncing around in my head all day.

Townes Van Zandt

And Lyle Lovett does a snappier version:

That's exactly why I want a Kenworth or a Peterbilt.

Then again...

 

[Ted]

Bought an Excursion yesterday for the family truck, so now the next question is what to get for a truck - pickup, 2-tonish something or another, or semi.

But first we're going to sell at least the BMW and the Avalanche. I also have my Mercedes up for sale, but the Avalanche and the BMW are the real priorities. I like my Mercedes and it's a good car that does what we need it to. The Avalanche and BMW don't do what we need them to.

 

[SoonerAviator]

V10, 7.3L, or 6.0L on the Excursion?

Cabover if you like the look/nostalgia and don't mind driving an old, uncomfortable riding rig.
Conventional if you want better ride, more functional/modern setup, and larger selection of mfg's/options
Maybe a compromise like a Freightliner M2/Sportchassis if you intend to really use it.

 

[Ted]

V10, 7.3L, or 6.0L on the Excursion?

V10. The diesels command more of a premium than I'm willing to pay, and I don't much care for the 6.0L. Plus when you do the $/mile calculations for our use, the gasser is a better deal and also much quieter.

Cabover if you like the look/nostalgia and don't mind driving an old, uncomfortable riding rig.
Conventional if you want better ride, more functional/modern setup, and larger selection of mfg's/options
Maybe a compromise like a Freightliner M2/Sportchassis if you intend to really use it.

I'm kicking myself for not asking my friend if I could drive (or at least go for a quick ride in) his K100 when he came to visit. Really that sparked the long-time desire to have a semi of some kind and got me thinking. The cabover has to do with the look/nostalgia but also shorter overall length and the visibility that you get from basically being right at the nose of the truck. Driving one will tell me what I need to know about the comfort aspect, since my personal feelings on comfort are usually different from others.

Another question is access to the back. I am wanting to get something with a sleeper of some kind. With the cabovers as I understand it you have to climb over the engine to get in back, whereas with a conventional you have better access, so that's a consideration. Sorta like the difference between the 310 and the 414.

 

[Sac Arrow]

The old military trucks definitely have some good cool factors. One friend of mine has a deuce-and-a-half that he ends up using for fun and as a box truck. I certainly could do a bobbed military truck, but that's less appealing overall.

I was looking at a few International 4700 series. There were more crew cabs than I had expected to find with prices not too far off from what I was looking at, but don't like the looks of them. Plus that's a conversion that's been done many times before. I realize trucks are supposed to be utilitarian, but this is also about some degree of fun if I go this route.

I've been toying around with getting a deuce and a half myself. That would be my choice for a utility truck vs. a semi. Some of them had straight h-pattern shifting, and some had really funky non-sequential shift patterns.

 

[Ted]

I've been toying around with getting a deuce and a half myself. That would be my choice for a utility truck vs. a semi. Some of them had straight h-pattern shifting, and some had really funky non-sequential shift patterns.

Thing with my vehicles is I like to have something that I could take on a trip, drive at normal highway speeds, etc. Plus there's the potential for some sort of conversion and/or being able to tow larger trailers or items in the future.

 

[Sac Arrow]

Thing with my vehicles is I like to have something that I could take on a trip, drive at normal highway speeds, etc. Plus there's the potential for some sort of conversion and/or being able to tow larger trailers or items in the future.

Good point. Those struggle at normal highway speeds.

 

[Ted]

Good point. Those struggle at normal highway speeds.

Yeah, I want something that can still do 70+ without complaining or feeling particularly strained, especially while towing. Right now I'm restricted to 60 or so when towing with the Avalanche, just because it's so weak. When I had my diesel pickups towing at 80 was no big deal. Once when outrunning tornados I was doing 98 towing a 28' enclosed trailer with my Dodge (Cummins turbo diesel). At that speed the truck was perfectly steady, turbo howling, and getting about 5 MPG.

 

[denverpilot]

Yeah, I want something that can still do 70+ without complaining or feeling particularly strained, especially while towing. Right now I'm restricted to 60 or so when towing with the Avalanche, just because it's so weak. When I had my diesel pickups towing at 80 was no big deal. Once when outrunning tornados I was doing 98 towing a 28' enclosed trailer with my Dodge (Cummins turbo diesel). At that speed the truck was perfectly steady, turbo howling, and getting about 5 MPG.

You must not have had the 4.10 rear end on your Dodge... LOL. At 75 with the big trailer I'm over 2000 RPM. Faster would be impossible, well possible until the engine decided to let go spectacularly. But that's okay, trailer tires aren't typically even rated for 75 let alone faster. With the TPMS on them you can watch them get way too hot doing that anyway.