Does Garmin Pilot or Foreflight Have CDI For RNAV

[Sinistar]

I haven't started my IR yet but have done a few practice ILS approaches using the KX155 NAV and the CDI. We don't have a navigator yet (planning for later 2020). Our home field and the next closest field are RNAV only and some days not much traffic. The fields with ILS are farther away. So it would be nice to practice RNAV (purely VFR) at these two fields just to get good at the approach, descents and generally using the CDI.

I know Garmin Pilot and Foreflight can overlay the approach plates. But does either of them have a CDI widget or whatever that can be used along with the RNAV approach plate to practice approaches? This is not for any type of IFR backup purpose...just to aid in practice.

An aside: Why don't the tablet makers also offer that highway in the sky like thing that the Cirrus displays have. It should be easy enough to add to their synthetic vision. Seems like it would be quite useful even if just helping planning descents into airports.

 

[Kent Wien]

This would be a great tool for night VFR approaches just to ensure terrain clearance. Descending into a dark hole can be dangerous. As far as I know, Garmin and Foreflight don’t offer this feature though.

 

[murphey]

Didn't Austin Meyer [Laminar Research - Xplane] develop an app that does exactly that? I can't remember the name but it was based on the synthetic vision with the highway in the sky concept. Rats....can't get into the ios app store on the computer, need to be on the tablet or phone. Stupid.

Got it....Xavion....

http://xavion.com/

 

[Jmcmanna]

Foreflight has a CDI feature along with synthetic vision (if you have the right equipment in your plane to feed it data). You would have to load each waypoint into the flight plan on the Approach, but the CDI will give you course guidance. Given an emergency situation, I would be comfortable shooting an RNAV approach using Foreflight.

 

[jordane93]

Do you have access to a sim? You can do some good practice there.

 

[midlifeflyer]

I haven't started my IR yet

***
So it would be nice to practice RNAV (purely VFR) at these two fields just to get good at the approach....

FIrst, Foreflight and a few other apps with an HSI display have a pseudo CDI. Pretty simple.

But, second, there have been a good number of discussions on multiple forums indicating that the two sentences I quoted from your post contradict each other.

 

[midlifeflyer]

Foreflight has a CDI feature along with synthetic vision (if you have the right equipment in your plane to feed it data). You would have to load each waypoint into the flight plan on the Approach, but the CDI will give you course guidance. Given an emergency situation, I would be comfortable shooting an RNAV approach using Foreflight.

Foreflight will load them for you if you load the procedure.

 

[Blatham489]

Don’t even need any equipment to get course guidance, only needed for AHRS data.

 

[Jmcmanna]

Foreflight will load them for you if you load the procedure.

Oh! I have been doing it the hard way! TIL

 

[lancie00]

You can do it in Garmin Pilot but you have to select all of the waypoints. I haven't found a way to load an approach.

 

[RussR]

But, second, there have been a good number of discussions on multiple forums indicating that the two sentences I quoted from your post contradict each other.

Man, I couldn't agree with Mark more. Haven't started your IR yet, but want to practice using an iPad to get "good"? Those are mutually exclusive.

Take some lessons and practice what the CFII and you are working on. Otherwise you may (will) build bad habits that are twice as hard (and expensive) to break.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

I didn't see where the RNAV data to ForeFlight was listed. Be aware that if the GPS source is from a hand-held GPSr (Bad Elf, Stratus/Stratux, iPad GPS, etc), the data you see may be incorrect. I've personally observed deviations of a mile with a hand-held. It doesn't happen very often, but something to keep in mind.

 

[midlifeflyer]

You can do it in Garmin Pilot but you have to select all of the waypoints. I haven't found a way to load an approach.

Yeah, Garmin has always had a thing about not wanting to make it easy to load full approaches in non-approved units. Goes back to the small x96 handhelds.

 

[David Megginson]

I haven't started my IR yet but have done a few practice ILS approaches using the KX155 NAV and the CDI. We don't have a navigator yet (planning for later 2020). Our home field and the next closest field are RNAV only and some days not much traffic. The fields with ILS are farther away. So it would be nice to practice RNAV (purely VFR) at these two fields just to get good at the approach, descents and generally using the CDI.

I know Garmin Pilot and Foreflight can overlay the approach plates. But does either of them have a CDI widget or whatever that can be used along with the RNAV approach plate to practice approaches? This is not for any type of IFR backup purpose...just to aid in practice.

An aside: Why don't the tablet makers also offer that highway in the sky like thing that the Cirrus displays have. It should be easy enough to add to their synthetic vision. Seems like it would be quite useful even if just helping planning descents into airports.

Garmin Pilot has a CDI (as does ForeFlight), but you'll have to manually enter the approach waypoints with GP rather than just loading the approach.

Note, too, that the GP CDI (not sure about FF) will stay in Terminal sensitivity, unlike a real IFR GPS CDI, which will scale to higher sensitivity during an approach, so it will be only a very loose approximation.

 

[Sinistar]

I was mainly wondering about the vertical. I can practice VOR for lateral/track but the closest ILS (for vertical) are kinda far away. So thought it would be nice to use RNAV to practice the descent portions if there was any glideslope/vertical indicator on the tablet. We'll probably get a GNC355 and corresponding CDI this summer but thought it would be nice to start practicing. The practice approaches I have done so far are with my CFII. I'm getting the hang of the procedures but I need to re-learn the approach (descent) as the inner-PPL in me wants to hit the numbers and thus I tend to come in low on the approach. I often have the SynVis screen up and use the track indicator but I have never seen any vertical guidance. I guess I never thought of entering all the approach waypoints. I've been mainly focused on the final approach portion to get better the correct descent rate.

 

[David Megginson]

I was mainly wondering about the vertical. I can practice VOR for lateral/track but the closest ILS (for vertical) are kinda far away. So thought it would be nice to use RNAV to practice the descent portions if there was any glideslope/vertical indicator on the tablet. We'll probably get a GNC355 and corresponding CDI this summer but thought it would be nice to start practicing. The practice approaches I have done so far are with my CFII. I'm getting the hang of the procedures but I need to re-learn the approach (descent) as the inner-PPL in me wants to hit the numbers and thus I tend to come in low on the approach. I often have the SynVis screen up and use the track indicator but I have never seen any vertical guidance. I guess I never thought of entering all the approach waypoints. I've been mainly focused on the final approach portion to get better the correct descent rate.

If you just practice ILS approaches on a PC-based sim like FlightGear or X-Plane, you will learn the same skill. I find zero difference tracking the analogue/radio-based GS on an ILS approach and the digital/GPS-based GS on an LPV approach (except for the lack of minor scalloping sometimes in the latter).

 

[David Megginson]

An aside: Why don't the tablet makers also offer that highway in the sky like thing that the Cirrus displays have. It should be easy enough to add to their synthetic vision. Seems like it would be quite useful even if just helping planning descents into airports.

Because from our altitudes, the "spot that doesn't move" approach from the 1940's Stick and Rudder works just as well, and keeps your eyes outside the plane instead of fixated on the panel.

About 15 years ago, I went on a demo flight in an SR-22 when I was thinking of selling my Cherokee and buying a fractional owership. The sales pilot kept trying to get my head down into the panel looking at unnecessary bells and whistles, so I had to pretend to pay attention while actually keeping my eyes outside scanning for traffic in busy VFR airspace. At the end, he wanted to demo the "highway in the sky" stuff, and I finally gave up and said "would it be OK if I just landed the plane instead?"

 

[Jim_CAK]

I haven't started my IR yet but have done a few practice ILS approaches using the KX155 NAV . . .

Like the others mentioned it is best if you hold off on doing approaches on your own until you start working with a CFII. Probably the best prep work you can do while flying now is work on precisely holding your heading and altitude. Learn to trim for hands off flying. It will really help when your under the hood. Good luck with the rating.

 

[David Megginson]

Like the others mentioned it is best if you hold off on doing approaches on your own until you start working with a CFII. Probably the best prep work you can do while flying now is work on precisely holding your heading and altitude. Learn to trim for hands off flying. It will really help when your under the hood. Good luck with the rating.

Great advice! Also, practice holding a precise indicated airspeed and descent rate at the same time. If you can set yourself up quickly to fly (e.g.) 90 KIAS descending at 500 fpm, that's a good start. Then try changing it to 90 KIAS at 400 fpm and 90 KIAS at 600 fpm. Then try it with different indicated airspeeds and descent rates. Those skills will take you most of the way to being able to fly an ILS approach well.

 

[John Myers]

Garmin Pilot has a CDI (as does ForeFlight), but you'll have to manually enter the approach waypoints with GP rather than just loading the approach.

Note, too, that the GP CDI (not sure about FF) will stay in Terminal sensitivity, unlike a real IFR GPS CDI, which will scale to higher sensitivity during an approach, so it will be only a very loose approximation.

The biggest limitation in using ForeFlight or Pilot or any of the other EFBs is CDI scaling. To my knowldge ForeFlight does not have terminal sensitivity and will only use en-route, which is coarse (2nm). I suspect this is intentional and don't expect it to change. https://support.foreflight.com/hc/e...Cross-Track-Error-Deviation-scale-on-the-CDI-

All GPS navigators have a set way in which they change scaling, and WAAS does this in a relatively complex way that takes the ideas from the ILS and LOC approaches and improves it with the capabilities GPS offers. This is a big part of getting good at these types of approaches. To my knowledge there are no iPad apps that replicate WAAS CDI scaling.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

There is no value in "practicing" with a CDI on an EFB in an airplane.

In fact, there's likely negative value in that you'll develop skills and habits that are incorrect, and need to spend some time getting the CFII to beat them out of you.

If you feel the need to practice - Just start on the rating with an instructor. Learn a good scan. THEN practice - Whether in the airplane or using a flight simulator.