Disastrous First (and Last) Annual - Advice Needed

Any updates on this @obw ??
Did you ever contact the FSDO? That’s the story line I was wondering how played out??
 
Did someone do the work necessary to determine how much repair is needed? I know a retired sheet metal guy looking for a piper…
 
I started this thread asking for advice. I recently reread all of the input and am very grateful for all the advice (and sympathy) that I got. It certainly helped with my decisions over the last 6 months.

For legal reasons I am not able to go into details, but I did want to provide an update on the situation with the Cherokee. As I mentioned before, I was completely unsuccessful trying to resolve the issue amicably, or even getting a response to my calls, emails, and text messages. I therefore hired a lawyer and I’m happy to say we were able to recover some of my money. I then sold the plane ‘where is/as is’ to Wentworth, and they came to the airport, took off the wings and hauled it off on a flatbed truck. All told, I’m still out $10K+, but feel better about everything than I did back in January. I still have a couple of legal angles on-going, and also have been in contact with the Nashville FSDO about the situation, so there may be more progress in the future.

As I was reaching some resolution on the Cherokee 160, my mechanic let me know that he was going to be selling an 1977 Archer for one of his clients who was giving up flying due to medical issues. My mechanic had been servicing the plane for almost 30 years and knew it inside and out. It had been always hangared and generally flew ~50 hours per year, with ~3200 hr TT and ~1200 SMOH. He was upfront about it not being perfect - one of the cylinder compressions was ~68 over the last couple of annuals, so it might need some engine work in the not-too-distant future, and would likely need a paint job within the next couple of years. Some of the instruments such as the autopilot were also a bit flaky. But it had great bones, flew really well and had absolutely no trace of corrosion!

The owner agreed to sell it to me for the Vref value without listing it on the open market. My mechanic’s knowledge of the plane and his endorsement were frankly priceless, and I felt that I would be kicking myself if I let it get away. So I’m now the very happy owner of an Archer and am flying it every opportunity that I get.

I hope to continue to tap into the insights of the community here, but on much more constructive topics than corrosion, dishonesty, deceit, etc! Looking forward to hearing your input in the future on panel upgrades, engine advice, paint shop recommendations….


Happy Independence Day to all our US members!
 
An Archer is a great plane, you will love the extra horsepower! Thanks for the update, glad things are working out for you.
 
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obw said:
I started this thread asking for advice. I recently reread all of the input and am very grateful for all the advice (and sympathy) that I got. It certainly helped with my decisions over the last 6 months.

For legal reasons I am not able to go into details, but I did want to provide an update on the situation with the Cherokee. As I mentioned before, I was completely unsuccessful trying to resolve the issue amicably, or even getting a response to my calls, emails, and text messages. I therefore hired a lawyer and I’m happy to say we were able to recover some of my money. I then sold the plane ‘where is/as is’ to Wentworth, and they came to the airport, took off the wings and hauled it off on a flatbed truck. All told, I’m still out $10K+, but feel better about everything than I did back in January. I still have a couple of legal angles on-going, and also have been in contact with the Nashville FSDO about the situation, so there may be more progress in the future.

As I was reaching some resolution on the Cherokee 160, my mechanic let me know that he was going to be selling an 1977 Archer for one of his clients who was giving up flying due to medical issues. My mechanic had been servicing the plane for almost 30 years and knew it inside and out. It had been always hangared and generally flew ~50 hours per year, with ~3200 hr TT and ~1200 SMOH. He was upfront about it not being perfect - one of the cylinder compressions was ~68 over the last couple of annuals, so it might need some engine work in the not-too-distant future, and would likely need a paint job within the next couple of years. Some of the instruments such as the autopilot were also a bit flaky. But it had great bones, flew really well and had absolutely no trace of corrosion!

The owner agreed to sell it to me for the Vref value without listing it on the open market. My mechanic’s knowledge of the plane and his endorsement were frankly priceless, and I felt that I would be kicking myself if I let it get away. So I’m now the very happy owner of an Archer and am flying it every opportunity that I get.

I hope to continue to tap into the insights of the community here, but on much more constructive topics than corrosion, dishonesty, deceit, etc! Looking forward to hearing your input in the future on panel upgrades, engine advice, paint shop recommendations….


Happy Independence Day to all our US members!
Click to expand...


Nothing I hate worse than a "used car salesman" (or even a new one, at that, lol). Glad things "mostly" worked out for you.
 
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obw said:
I started this thread asking for advice. I recently reread all of the input and am very grateful for all the advice (and sympathy) that I got. It certainly helped with my decisions over the last 6 months.

For legal reasons I am not able to go into details, but I did want to provide an update on the situation with the Cherokee. As I mentioned before, I was completely unsuccessful trying to resolve the issue amicably, or even getting a response to my calls, emails, and text messages. I therefore hired a lawyer and I’m happy to say we were able to recover some of my money. I then sold the plane ‘where is/as is’ to Wentworth, and they came to the airport, took off the wings and hauled it off on a flatbed truck. All told, I’m still out $10K+, but feel better about everything than I did back in January. I still have a couple of legal angles on-going, and also have been in contact with the Nashville FSDO about the situation, so there may be more progress in the future.

As I was reaching some resolution on the Cherokee 160, my mechanic let me know that he was going to be selling an 1977 Archer for one of his clients who was giving up flying due to medical issues. My mechanic had been servicing the plane for almost 30 years and knew it inside and out. It had been always hangared and generally flew ~50 hours per year, with ~3200 hr TT and ~1200 SMOH. He was upfront about it not being perfect - one of the cylinder compressions was ~68 over the last couple of annuals, so it might need some engine work in the not-too-distant future, and would likely need a paint job within the next couple of years. Some of the instruments such as the autopilot were also a bit flaky. But it had great bones, flew really well and had absolutely no trace of corrosion!

The owner agreed to sell it to me for the Vref value without listing it on the open market. My mechanic’s knowledge of the plane and his endorsement were frankly priceless, and I felt that I would be kicking myself if I let it get away. So I’m now the very happy owner of an Archer and am flying it every opportunity that I get.

I hope to continue to tap into the insights of the community here, but on much more constructive topics than corrosion, dishonesty, deceit, etc! Looking forward to hearing your input in the future on panel upgrades, engine advice, paint shop recommendations….


Happy Independence Day to all our US members!
Click to expand...

Without pictures it didn’t happen! LOL. Congrats, and enjoy the journey.
 
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Congratulations obw, sounds like you got at least half your money back, which is much better than I thought you would get. When the dust settles please come back and tell us the rest of the story.
 
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obw said:
I wish the Cherokee 160 didn't happen, but hoping for better luck with the Archer! Here's a photo...
Click to expand...
obw said:
I wish the Cherokee 160 didn't happen, but hoping for better luck with the Archer! Here's a photo...
Click to expand...

The club I was in back in the 90’s had an Archer. I got my instrument rating in it, and made many XC with the young family back then. It’s a good honest 128 kt true airspeed plane. Enjoy!
 
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So what you're saying is that it wasn't your last annual?

Congratulations on the recovery all around. I hope you have many years of good flying with the Archer.
 
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Thanks for the update and congrats on the plane!

It has, no doubt, been a long road for you and still more to travel on this. But you, and many of us, have learned a lot from your experiences.
 
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Daleandee said:
Thanks for the update and congrats on the plane!

It has, no doubt, been a long road for you and still more to travel on this. But you, and many of us, have learned a lot from your experiences.
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I'm one of those that learned from this as I purchased a Cherokee 180. It sucks you had to go through what you went through, especially after seemingly doing everything right. My dad's first plane was a 160. For what we got it for we decided a pre-buy wasn't necessary, and some of that was knowing where to look for corrosion from your story. It helped that the inspection panels were already there on this one. And the title search from AOPA was nice knowing it was always Midwest based before going to look at it.
imagejpeg_0_11.jpg
 
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Racerx said:
I'm one of those that learned from this as I purchased a Cherokee 180. It sucks you had to go through what you went through, especially after seemingly doing everything right. My dad's first plane was a 160. For what we got it for we decided a pre-buy wasn't necessary, and some of that was knowing where to look for corrosion from your story. It helped that the inspection panels were already there on this one. And the title search from AOPA was nice knowing it was always Midwest based before going to look at it.
View attachment 97954
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That sure is a nice looking Six!
 
I’ll admit that I lost track on this thread for a while and have not read every page. My largest ache was that you would never buy again and we lost an owner/comrade to shady business practices.

So glad to see the Archer is in your hands. You will lose a lot more than $10K in ownership with all planes but I hope never again to nefarious folks. Great looking Archer!
 
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obw said:
I hope to continue to tap into the insights of the community here, but on much more constructive topics than corrosion, dishonesty, deceit, etc! Looking forward to hearing your input in the future on panel upgrades, engine advice, paint shop recommendations….
Click to expand...
Congrats on the purchase and I'm glad to hear you got some resolution. I'm also impressed after going through all that you still decided to buy another plane. I had a hangar collapse on my plane from sheer negligence of the hangar owner and neighbor and I know all too much about dishonesty and deceit, but it's great to see that you're moving on and moving past this.
 
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I was pretty disillusioned by the whole thing - I was very close to giving up on plane ownership and was even wondering if I should continue to fly at all. It wasn't at all clear how I could confidently buy a plane in the future, even if I wanted to. I got very lucky that my A&P - who I have 100% trust in - was getting a plane ready for sale, and the plane fit my mission completely. Needless to say, I'm very grateful to my mechanic.
 
As @TheFB said, 10K is nothing in the grand scheme of owning your own plane. My first annual was $11,500, it's just part of it. You are going to love that archer!
 
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Archer might be my favorite of everything I have flown. Have lots of fun with it!
 
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