Desktop Simulator Recommendations

IK04 I took Arnold's posts as him saying he does not have an instrument rating which if he really has an ATP cannot be correct. Makes me wonder if he holds an ATP or does not understand his license.

Rumpole of the Bailey is a great British series our local PBS stations carry from time to time. Jeanie (SWMBO) here and I love it!

The Redbird FMX1000 is one of my favorite GA Training Devices (TD). It closely (not identically) models the 172 and G1000. With the upgraded video it is even more realistic and fun. We have found it to be effective and reliable. The few times we have experienced issues Redbird has been very responsive.

We also have another TD by one of their competitors which uses touch screen technology and does not have motion. This second TD is easy to configure for different aircraft including changing from yokes to side sticks. Unfortunately, the touch screen does not accurately represent the feel of using actual controls which, in my opinion, takes away from the training experience.

They are both fun but in my opinion the Redbird is superior.
 
14 C.F.R. § 61.67 (a) Privileges. (1) A person who holds an airline transport pilot certificate is entitled to the same privileges as a person who holds a commercial pilot certificate with an instrument rating.

"Makes me wonder if he holds an ATP or does not understand his license."

Impuning (in case you need a little help from Merriam-Webster - to assail by words or arguments : oppose or attack as false or lacking integrity) my honesty and integrity as rhetorical flourish is just not polite.

No instrument rating:

ATP ASMEL, COMM SES, ATR72, ATR42, SD3
CFI, AI, ME

The ATP checkride includes all of the maneuvers, procedures and knowledge required of an instrument rating issued to a PVT or COMM pilot, except to higher standards. Because of this there is no need for a separate rating and when the ATP was issued my COMM/INST went away.

But then again I may not have passed two ATP checkrides, multiple type rating rides, multiple six month proficiency checks both 121 and 135 over 20 years and my name might not even be Arnold. Only the Shadow knows.
 
I downloaded X plane 11 the trial package but have not used it yet. I'm wondering if I can use one of my son's USB game controllers to control X Plane?
 
Arnold said:
That is interesting. First I didn't know one could get a Ph.D. in flight simulation. Second, why do you detest Redbird?
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Redbird's software is Microsoft FlightSim with Redbird proprietary stuff. I was flying the full-motion sim last December with the CFII in the right seat. He was trying to learn the iPad controls for the Redbird - I was the paying dummy for him to learn. Not happy about it, either. But I had the qwerty keyboard down by my foot and was overriding everything he was trying to do.
 
The instructor's controls for the Redbird are not always as simple or straight forward as one wants them to be. Anyone who plans to give instruction in one of these devices should go through a thorough checkout BEFORE working with another pilot. This is crucial for being able to smoothly reposition or modify weather.

Also, their simulation of the G1000 is very good but not perfect. Comments from pilots with experience on the actual device have been critical of a few functions that are not implemented in the AATD or slight differences in a few functions. Two of our instructors swear the device does not handle like a C172. I've detected this on a rare occasion but re-syncing the controls cleared it up. We did experience a problem with one of the drive belts that was solved by adjusting or replacing that belt.
 
Profileclimb said:
My vote goes to X plane 11 for procedures traning.
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Biggest problem with XPlane 11 is the need for horsepower. Recommended hardware is
  • Processor: Intel Core i5 6600K at 3.5 ghz or faster.
  • Memory: 16 GB RAM.
  • Graphics: video card from NVIDIA or AMD w/4 GB VRAM.
As much as I'd like to use 11 - mostly for the multiple monitors - I'm not about to drop $700 for a new toy...er...computer, when Xplane 10 does everything other than multiple monitors on my current system. Yes, I know if I were running WinTel I'd have multiple monitors on X10 but my windows system is a tower and not portable. The only reason I want multiple monitors is when I'm doing show & tell at the schools and other organizations.

Plus I'm dropping $$$ for the new avionics for the more expensive toy...er...airplane.
 
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jonvcaples said:
The instructor's controls for the Redbird are not always as simple or straight forward as one wants them to be. Anyone who plans to give instruction in one of these devices should go through a thorough checkout BEFORE working with another pilot. This is crucial for being able to smoothly reposition or modify weather.

Also, their simulation of the G1000 is very good but not perfect. Comments from pilots with experience on the actual device have been critical of a few functions that are not implemented in the AATD or slight differences in a few functions. Two of our instructors swear the device does not handle like a C172. I've detected this on a rare occasion but re-syncing the controls cleared it up. We did experience a problem with one of the drive belts that was solved by adjusting or replacing that belt.
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I didn't care much for the C172 model on the redbird, but I fly a cherokee, so it really didn't matter to me. All I wanted was to practice VOR and ILS approaches. Couple, three sessions when the weather was rotten and didn't have anything else to do & I was outta there and back into the cherokee for real with better weather.

Note: Around here, we don't really have decent IMC for training. It's either great flying weather or it's ice. Today, it's ice. I'm doing taxes and other paperwork inside.
 
Well I'm working on getting X-Plane 11 to work. It sure uses resources. I keep dialing down the frame rate and still it is too much for my hardware. I haven't gotten to the lowest setting yet but I won't be surprised if I get there. With the absence of flight controls I've hooked up a game controller. It recognized the hardware and I'm mapping buttons and switches. I'll keep you posted. Until then thanks for all the suggestions and information.
 
I’ve done a lot of procedural stuff with Prepar3D and X-Plane. I prefer Prepar3D (that’s what Redbird uses) but right now have had X-Plane installed mainly because the fake velocity twin has a Dynon setup with a 650 which matches my G3X fairly close.

I did quite a bit in a full motion Redbird and while entertaining the motion is just gimmicky.
 
I am looking for where people talk about sims here. I have some great pedal rudders for sale...
 
Thank you so much. I am actually registered there as of this morning. They have lifted a posting restriction for me for new users. But I need something like 15 posts before I can post a sale myself.
 
That's easy -- just reply to random posts with meaningless less crap like :yeahthat: or +1. Love the "whatever". In a minute you can have 15 posts. :cornut:
 
Simulators like Microsoft FlightSim are the most optimal option for the newbies, I think.
 
I have the Honey comb yoke. About $250. It is stiffer than a real plane but really encourages you to trim. The yoke moves easily in pitch and roll. Unfortunately, while none of the planes I flew with my former CH Products yoke had a consistent left bank with the controls centered, all of them have bank left with this yoke. Their customer support doesn’t believe me and ignore what I tell them.

It’s apparent that the problem is either in their HW or software. The raw data is symmetrical from the yoke so it has to be in the drivers. At least I have to keep my scan to keep the plane headed in the right direction.

Overall, it’s an improvement over the CH Products yoke, but it also has a lot of room for improvement.
 
Arnold said:
Well I'm working on getting X-Plane 11 to work. It sure uses resources. I keep dialing down the frame rate and still it is too much for my hardware. I haven't gotten to the lowest setting yet but I won't be surprised if I get there. With the absence of flight controls I've hooked up a game controller. It recognized the hardware and I'm mapping buttons and switches. I'll keep you posted. Until then thanks for all the suggestions and information.
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Just my own experiences if it helps. I had some of the same issues. There is an x-plane forum (easy to find by google) that is worth joining. Also can search for procedures online for tuning. Basically it breaks down one side of settings mainly involves the graphics card the other the CPU.
ONE big thing that helped though I had a decent graphics card I wasn’t aware it was being underused because I hadn’t installed and explicitly enabled all its features. Basically it seems there is a default that is not optimal until you download the “real” driver. it helped.
That said, I also started out with just a joystick and it was very awkward and difficult to use with a C172, specially the rudder (by turning the joystick left or right on its axis) which went from too title to too much very quickly. I ended up buying a fairly inexpensive yoke, and also rudder pedals. The yoke came with a control block (some faders) that so hell a lot for flaps, throttle mixture, etc.

It was frustrating, as the scenery eats up lots of FPS rate. If it is set too low, I had a very hard time even seeing the runway/airport until I was right up on it. So I had to add scenery and that in itself was a learning curve, kind of cumbersome. It’s frustrating because you want to get to flying, and end up spending a lot of time tweaking the parameters.

using the tutorials (forgot to mention, check YouTube, the are a number of good tutorials about setup there too) helped and I got it useable.

Seems to me if you want to use it, you will have to either steel yourself to having to tweak and tweak, or else buy a better pc (but think tweaking is unavoidable even then), or get an experienced gamer to help out, etc. but mainly just have to forget about a quick fix and go through a lot of setup and trial and error.
 
Avoid the SAITEK PRO SYSTEMs. I bought the system new and it did not have the power adapter. I was told by Intellect, it does not come with one and they do not carry parts for the systems. I found one on eBay. They do not have interest in a new customer, what happens when it breaks.
 
LongRoadBob said:
Just my own experiences if it helps. I had some of the same issues. There is an x-plane forum (easy to find by google) that is worth joining. Also can search for procedures online for tuning. Basically it breaks down one side of settings mainly involves the graphics card the other the CPU.
ONE big thing that helped though I had a decent graphics card I wasn’t aware it was being underused because I hadn’t installed and explicitly enabled all its features. Basically it seems there is a default that is not optimal until you download the “real” driver. it helped.
That said, I also started out with just a joystick and it was very awkward and difficult to use with a C172, specially the rudder (by turning the joystick left or right on its axis) which went from too title to too much very quickly. I ended up buying a fairly inexpensive yoke, and also rudder pedals. The yoke came with a control block (some faders) that so hell a lot for flaps, throttle mixture, etc.

It was frustrating, as the scenery eats up lots of FPS rate. If it is set too low, I had a very hard time even seeing the runway/airport until I was right up on it. So I had to add scenery and that in itself was a learning curve, kind of cumbersome. It’s frustrating because you want to get to flying, and end up spending a lot of time tweaking the parameters.

using the tutorials (forgot to mention, check YouTube, the are a number of good tutorials about setup there too) helped and I got it useable.

Seems to me if you want to use it, you will have to either steel yourself to having to tweak and tweak, or else buy a better pc (but think tweaking is unavoidable even then), or get an experienced gamer to help out, etc. but mainly just have to forget about a quick fix and go through a lot of setup and trial and error.
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Thank you for taking the time to write the detailed post. I'm sure it will be very helpful.
 
Patrick Murphy said:
Avoid the SAITEK PRO SYSTEMs. I bought the system new and it did not have the power adapter. I was told by Intellect, it does not come with one and they do not carry parts for the systems. I found one on eBay. They do not have interest in a new customer, what happens when it breaks.
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Good to know. Thank you.
 
Arnold said:
Good to know. Thank you.
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Just to mention, I’m very happy with the Saitek. I am not sure about what is meant with power adapter, it is usb based with a hub. The price difference, it is by far least expensive, bought from a reputable store would not be risky. I couldn’t justify more money for yoke, and it is miles ahead of the joystick.
There are some mods online, YouTube, to adjust out a “dead spot”, and other solutions, but honestly it works fine with plane for me.

I wasn’t looking for perfect, as a sim is never going to be that, and I find with the yoke I am not having to adjust all the time for straight and level, but did have to tweak a few parameters in input setup.

Not sure, but it seems like me, you are just wanting to be able to practice some on days you can’t fly, not like you are planning on immersing yourself in sim world, better to actually fly. If so, the saitek again works fine for me but it was definitely worth it to buy the rudder pedals! Was not expensive.

Also, I found the most difficulty also getting my views how I want an being able to look out easily to see the runway, abeam, etc. and just “eyes outside” as sims tend to make one more focused on instruments. But for your goal, instruments that isn’t as big issue.
 
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LongRoadBob said:
Just to mention, I’m very happy with the Saitek. I am not sure about what is meant with power adapter, it is usb based with a hub. The price difference, it is by far least expensive, bought from a reputable store would not be risky. I couldn’t justify more money for yoke, and it is miles ahead of the joystick.
There are some mods online, YouTube, to adjust out a “dead spot”, and other solutions, but honestly it works fine with plane for me.

I wasn’t looking for perfect, as a sim is never going to be that, and I find with the yoke I am not having to adjust all the time for straight and level, but did have to tweak a few parameters in input setup.

Not sure, but it seems like me, you are just wanting to be able to practice some on days you can’t fly, not like you are planning on immersing yourself in sim world, better to actually fly. If so, the saitek again works fine for me but it was definitely worth it to buy the rudder pedals! Was not expensive.

Also, I found the most difficulty also getting my views how I want an being able to look out easily to see the runway, abeam, etc. and just “eyes outside” as sims tend to make one more focused on instruments. But for your goal, instruments that isn’t as big issue.
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Thanks, this too is very helpful. You are correct. It is for me instrument procedures trainer. All I really want to see is the runway environment, a runway headed in the right direction and a reasonable facsimile of an airport for circling. I'd like to have Mooney cockpit since that is the plane I am most likely to fly IMC but frankly it does not matter that much so long as I get the right speeds, flaps and gear.
 
Need referral to a person who obtained FAA BATD LoA? ( Before I spend $700 for the XP Pro / FAA-required version, prepare an OAG. )

CFII w 3 students, 3-years USAF Certified IFT instructor (T-37B). If experienced gaining FAA BATD approval, please consider helping me with same.

Seeking experienced helper who has received FAA BATD LoA approval. My need: with experienced helper, write an OAG that is likely to "fly" thru Mr Bernard's office (AFS-800). XP 11.3 is alive and working in a custom build PC. IFR students are priority. Also big help orienting PPL students.

BATD LoA, minimum hardware add-on (i.e., controls). XP ignored my email questions, and referred me to PFC !. Best 'tuber' is Russ Barlow. He is far advanced, excellent resource. I emailed siminnovations.

Who successfully wrote an OAG, obtained a LoA for a BATD, willing to help save time writing it.
The two FAA documents, both dated 12Sep2018, AC 61-136B and Vol 11 Flight Standards Programs Chapter 10 ATD.
 
Recent Background: Local TN airport of the year, has an old ASA BATD "On Top". ASA stopped selling/supporting. Old PC quit, could not restore in time before LoA expired last month. Reliability and dependent on retailers are big costly issues, downtime risks. Decided to start over with a new custom hardware build, ~ $1,200 later added XP 11.3, temporary Logitech joystick works fine. No issues yet.

I've seen most of the ATD retailers, not impressed. MSoft FS 2004 also acquired, running on a different, lower performance PC. Lot of useless marketeering hype on-going now. Gaming designs using the CPU (multiple cores, hyperthreading) but simmers do not, brute force dependent on the GPU. Sim associations / community helpless, not promulgating standards, driving up costs.
 
Sims tend to build on themselves. Started out with a Commodore 64. Here's a friend at the current incarnation. XPlane, Redbird controls, 4k tv's. the smaller monitor is a touchscreen, on which the GTN keystrokes are identical to the r/w airplane. Homebuilt switch/autopilot panel. ipad running Foreflight. Actually had discussions with Austin Meyer and the FAA about certifying, but it wasn't worth the time to me.
7FAB1D75-12E7-4389-A4C6-8A5F71C6E038.jpeg

Jim
 
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Ok, Jim, thanks for reply. You may know someone who was successful obtaining FAA BATD LoA? Experienced helper sought.
 
Don't have sources who have gotten an LoA approved, but both Austin and the FAA guy I talked to thought it was doable. Just mass quantities of paperwork. I didn't pursue it basically because I've got and airplane and sleep with my CFI every night...don't tell my wife. Oh, wait, it's ok.... :)

If I had pursued it , I would have found an existing LoA to pattern after, and modified to suit. Another issue is gonna be changes to your hardware/software. Once it's locked in, it's locked, from what I understand. No freedom to updrade GPU or other components without....you guessed it.....more paperwork.

I'm no authority on just about anything...ask any of these guys! ;-)

Jim
 
Thanks Jim, for your empathy. I've done the same things. Please stand-down. Seeking helper who has had success, knows the right OAG "template", outline, must-have's, must-nots, etc. I am seeking a person who has experience writing a successful OAG.

Al
 
How did we get this far without mentioning PilotEdge.net ?? This is the BEST resource for flight simulator IFR proficiency.
 
Not True. No irrelevant solicitations please.
 
Seeking SME, successful, experienced BATD OAG
 
WannFly said:
can you log that time without a CFII?
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If you already have the instrument ticket, yes. In a BATD (specifically the Redbird BATDs) you can log Simulated Instrument time and Approaches/Tracking/Holds only. You cannot count it as actual flight time (IOW, no PIC, no ASEL, no Complex, no Flight Time, no Total Time, no Night Time, etc) nor can you log any takeoffs or landings.
 
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