Death grip on the yoke

[drotto]

I even take this one step farther and see if I can loss altitude by reducing power then climb by increasing power all while not touching the stick. Its a lot of fun and if you ever need this skill you have it.

Tony

I am actually being taught that using power is the prefered method of changing altitude, and pitch is used more for controlling speed. My CFI has also had me do the only use rudder control and take you hand off the yolk for landing thing. One or two runs like that gives you a much better feel for the plane.

What also helped me was doing refresher on more basic things like slow flight stalls, etc. I was having some issue stabilizing for landing, my at that time new CFI had me do a refresher day, and it did alot for making thing click. Might help with the death grip doing things that do not seem as scary and have wider margins for error.

 

[MAKG1]

I like the idea of having a drink beforehand. I didn't know that was allowed but I suppose if I'm not PIC I can. I never really thought of that.

That was a joke. You will not perform your best with even a small amount of alcohol.

And it IS illegal. The prohibition against alcohol in 14 CFR 91.17 is not for the PIC, but for all crew members. You ARE a crew member in a flight where you are receiving instruction, even if you aren't PIC. It isn't even necessary for you to actually fly. Just asking for the airplane keys is illegal. As is showing up for work as a flight attendant.

The rule is 8 hours bottle to throttle. See 14 CFR 91.17(a)(1).

And before thinking about sedatives, see 14 CFR 91.17(a)(3).

 

[MAKG1]

I am actually being taught that using power is the prefered method of changing altitude, and pitch is used more for controlling speed.

That's for approach. While in cruise, it's different. You'll generally want the airplane as fast as is safe all the time, with a few operational exceptions. That means you don't have much throttle to play with.

 

[Hocky]

That was a joke. You will not perform your best with even a small amount of alcohol.

And it IS illegal. The prohibition against alcohol in 14 CFR 91.17 is not for the PIC, but for all crew members. You ARE a crew member in a flight where you are receiving instruction, even if you aren't PIC. It isn't even necessary for you to actually fly. Just asking for the airplane keys is illegal. As is showing up for work as a flight attendant.

The rule is 8 hours bottle to throttle. See 14 CFR 91.17(a)(1).

And before thinking about sedatives, see 14 CFR 91.17(a)(3).

Thank you I went and reviewed that but didn't see a definition for a crew member. Can somebody without a pilot certificate be a crew member?

 

[MAKG1]

Thank you I went and reviewed that but didn't see a definition for a crew member. Can somebody without a pilot certificate be a crew member?

14 CFR 1.1 defines crewmember:

Crewmember means a person assigned to perform duty in an aircraft during flight time.

That includes a lot of people without pilot certificates. Like flight attendants.

 

[Hocky]

14 CFR 1.1 defines crewmember:



That includes a lot of people without pilot certificates. Like flight attendants.

Ok gotcha. I didn't realize it was a joke.

 

[DrewC]

Is there a school around you that has a Cub? No Yoke, Problem solved.

But seriously if you are anxious and that's causing the death grip, and if the back to basics and knowing the limits eased your mind. Find someone doing demo flights in something unusual, go up with a friend in something different from what you're learning in. There's a guy on the local Airshow circuit around here that sells rides in an open cockpit biplane and does some acro. Even if you're just a passenger, if the exposure makes you more comfortable flying in GA aircraft you'll be that much closer to lighter touches and inputs.

Never had the death grip issue myself (plane or car), but expanding my horizons (under experienced and capable hands/supervision) helped put me more at ease in both.

There's always a certain degree of apprehension to be expected when taking on something new, and it almost sounds more like this was a habit that formed during that phase and is now something that needs to be broken so it doesn't hold you back (and breaking the habit sooner is going to be easier).

Also I try to listen to the controls through my finger tips and feet, and you can't receive that feedback from your sense of touch if your grip is forcing the matter. I know it sounds cheesy, but if thinking about it that way helps you then it might be worth it.

 

[Concorde]

I even take this one step farther and see if I can loss altitude by reducing power then climb by increasing power all while not touching the stick. Its a lot of fun and if you ever need this skill you have it.

Tony

Power for altitude - pitch for speed .

 

[DesertNomad]

I had a death grip in early training. I'd come home with a sore arm and sore hand. My future DPE took me out in a 172 and did a lap around the pattern using only the throttle and rudders… no trim, no yoke. He did need a slight pull on the yoke to flare tho.

Then we went up to about 4000' AGL and he had me fly around without touching the yoke. After that, he threw a towel over the entire panel and had me fly it with just the rudder pedals and trim. I'd suggest trying the "don't touch the yoke" method with your CFI.

 

[1600vw]

Power for altitude - pitch for speed .

If a control breaks say your elevator you will use power to manage both altitude and pitch. This is what this fun practice is for.

Tony

 

[Rex Kramer]

Ok gotcha. I didn't realize it was a joke.

Yes it was most decidedly a joke.


I'd give more advice but it would just echo what already has been said. Relax... The plane's a lady, treat her gently.

 

[Jim Logajan]

Relax... The plane's a lady, treat her gently.

I'm trying to imagine what a woman pilot would do with this advice....

 

[MAKG1]

I'm trying to imagine what a woman pilot would do with this advice....

Depends which team she bats for. Same as a male pilot.

 

[bobmrg]

The pencil thing didn't work. I gripped so hard it hurt and eventually dropped it and resumed the death grip. It's psychological. I feel like I'm going to die at any time so I'm grasping at the branch trying not to fall out of the tree just like our ape ancestors probably.

I like the idea of having a drink beforehand. I didn't know that was allowed but I suppose if I'm not PIC I can. I never really thought of that.

This is my only issue. I've flown with four different CFI's and they have complimented me on everything else except for that last guy who felt the need to slap me which was extremely uncool to say the least. But he admitted to being rattled by my death grip and I've seen this other thread about the heavy guy who also had another CFI worry about having the controls locked up so maybe this is a fear that some CFI's have.

It was the same when I learned to drive I death gripped the steering wheel and I did get over that so will try the suggestions. I can try keep my hands off but at my school they drum into me left hand on yoke right hand on throttle at all times so don't know how that will fly but I will certainly give it a shot.

It's been said by others, but I can't pass up the chance to put in my .02: Trim the airplane for level flight, take your hands off of the yoke, and keep the wings level with rudder. Repeat until the lesson sinks in.

Bob Gardner

 

[Bob Noel]

Yes it was most decidedly a joke.

To beat the dead horse, the drinking suggestion wasn't so much a joke, but a really dumb attempt at a joke.

 

[Jeanie]

To the OP - Where are you?

 

[Hocky]

To beat the dead horse, the drinking suggestion wasn't so much a joke, but a really dumb attempt at a joke.

Yes, I can't say I appreciated that joke. I'm trying to get advice and if I had not seen the follow up comments and had gone and had a couple of shots before my next flight that would not have been good. Aren't you suppsoed to use emoticons if you're making a joke? It wasnt very funny.

 

[loch1957]

I flew for 1.8 hours yesterday, once to altitude I sat back and just used rudder to keep wings level. I know others are saying the same thing, I'm a student as well, everyone here has had to deal with something in their flight career thet was some what of an obstacle. Point I'm trying to make is, this is up to you, try some of the advice, it can't hurt. I play with using body weight to effect the plane, leaning forward or back you can do a lot. Remember the plane wants to fly, all you have to do is let it. Don't beat yourself up, it took me 34 hours before my CFI would let me solo, I couldn't get the flare down. but now I rarely have a problem. Bu t I actually listened to these guys and gals, theres a wealth of info here.

 

[Blackhawk]

My personal opinion is that a failure to trim, fly with a light control force and "feel what the airplane is telling you" is probably what leads to most stall/spin accidents.

 

[Hocky]

My personal opinion is that a failure to trim, fly with a light control force and "feel what the airplane is telling you" is probably what leads to most stall/spin accidents.

What does that have to do with my situation? Did I say the plane was not trimmed? No I did not.

 

[MAKG1]

What does that have to do with my situation? Did I say the plane was not trimmed? No I did not.

Actually, you did. But you haven't figured that out yet.

It's not possible to trim adequately with a death grip, and you cannot feel the thermals or the onset of stall.

With a light touch, you can feel exactly what the wind is doing to your plane.

 

[Jim Logajan]

Actually, you did.

He did?

But you haven't figured that out yet.

Quickest way to make all the advice offered go for naught is to make an OP defensive over things not explicitly stated.

 

[Blackhawk]

Actually, you did. But you haven't figured that out yet.

It's not possible to trim adequately with a death grip, and you cannot feel the thermals or the onset of stall.

With a light touch, you can feel exactly what the wind is doing to your plane.

What he said.

 

[Blackhawk]

He did?



Quickest way to make all the advice offered go for naught is to make an OP defensive over things not explicitly stated.

OP said he is flying with a death grip on the yoke. He wrote that, I did not.

Flying with a death grip on the yoke makes it very difficult to feel the control forces and their affects on trim. For example, if you are properly trimmed for your speed and, while turning base to final and find yourself pulling the nose of the airplane up the airplane will "speak to you", it will try to let you know that you are over riding the properly trimmed speed and getting slow. With a death grip you will not feel this. In this situation I will normally tell the student "Let go of the yoke." When they do so the airplane pitches down.

My intent was not to slam the OP. I was pointing out how prevalent a problem this is and how important it is to correct it early in training, something the OP is obviously trying to do. I have had instrument students come to me with this problem and we spend quite a bit of time breaking them of this habit.

 

[Dr. O]

Let me cast another vote for having him fly without touching the yoke - for as long as it takes. Slow flight, 360's, the pattern. After a bit the squirrel inside the head that is screaming, "were gonna die, pull up, pull up" gets bored and falls asleep.

 

[EdFred]

Hocky -

Do you golf, fish, play baseball, shoot, any hobby that has you holding something in your hand?

 

[mtuomi]

The plane's a lady, treat her gently.

Very true!

Just like a lady, it needs 100% attention all the time, goes wrong way too often even when you think you've done all the right things, and even the slightest problem will cost thousands of dollars to put right!

 

[gismo]

Like Drew's one and only post (so far) I think most of the advice here is aimed squarely at the wrong issue. It sounds to me like there's an underlying fear of some sort that's manifesting itself in a death grip given the various failed attempts to eliminate the tight grip. And until that fear is identified and dealt with the grip is likely to resurface any time there's stress (e.g. on the checkride) even if Hocky learns a coping mechanism.

My recommendation would be for Hocky to ask the CFI he likes/trusts most to help him discover what's causing this need to crush the wheel and then work out a way to get past it. Only then will the otherwise many helpful suggestions in this thread by useful.

 

[Jimmy cooper]

It will pass. He has very little time at this point. If the CFI does some stall spins with him plus more time in the air it should pass.

 

[asgcpa]

What does that have to do with my situation? Did I say the plane was not trimmed? No I did not.

If the plane is trimmed properly, it sounds to me that this is a case of being nervous. That may take experience. If you have access to a simulator (not one with really bad controls) practice trimming and letting go. Learn to train your mind to let go. My IR instructor has taught me to basically touch the yoke with two fingers at the bottom to make my adjustments. Also, what really worked for me is learning the profile setting for power settings/speed etc. which keeps my hands off the yoke as much as possible. Also, as was stated learn to use the rudders a little more.

Bottom line, we all gain experience at different rates. If you you are conscience of it, relaxing the death grip will come in time. Good luck!

 

[skynewbie]

Relax that helps. A gentle touch on yoke helps.

 

[Rex Kramer]

To beat the dead horse, the drinking suggestion wasn't so much a joke, but a really dumb attempt at a joke.

Yes, I can't say I appreciated that joke. I'm trying to get advice and if I had not seen the follow up comments and had gone and had a couple of shots before my next flight that would not have been good. Aren't you suppsoed to use emoticons if you're making a joke? It wasnt very funny.

Well I'm not sure what to say other than who the hell would take such a comment about drinking and flying seriously?

Wait, unless you forgot the emoticon. Surely your reply is in humor.

 

[Hocky]

Well I'm not sure what to say other than who the hell would take such a comment about drinking and flying seriously?

Wait, unless you forgot the emoticon. Surely your reply is in humor.

Who the hell would take such a comment seriously? How about a STUDENT who is (correction WAS) gullible and believes that various grumpy old timers on this TRAINING section would not be telling gross untruths here disguised as advice?

Many replies were very useful but lots including yours are borderline useless and just plain argumentative.

Here's an emoticon for ya

 

[ADIDAF]

I may be a bit late in this thread to be of much assistance, if any, but when I was earning my PPL I had the same death grip you spoke of. My instructor had me take the yoke in hand with the very tip of my index finger and thumb. The death grip is there for a bit, but your fingers tire out much quicker that way and want to relax naturally. Another method that may work is to fly with just one finger operating the controls, after you're at altitude that is and set up for cruise. Planes like to fly straight and level for the most part, especially initial training aircraft. Trim and light rudder work goes a long way.

 

[Clark1961]

Planes like to fly straight and level for the most part,

Why doesn't any aircraft I've flown like to fly straight and level???









(it's a joke son, I say it's a joke)

 

[Rex Kramer]

Who the hell would take such a comment seriously? How about a STUDENT who is (correction WAS) gullible and believes that various grumpy old timers on this TRAINING section would not be telling gross untruths here disguised as advice?

Many replies were very useful but lots including yours are borderline useless and just plain argumentative.

Here's an emoticon for ya

My response wasn't disguised as advice at all. It was obviously a joke. Name one thing that involves operating machinery of any kind where the advice is to have a few drinks before doing it. GMAFB.


My ADVICE was posted. And it was "relax". Plane flies better trimmed up and with light control pressures. It's not going anywhere so there's no need to white-knuckle it.

That applies from a 152 to a 777.

 

[MAKG1]

Name one thing in this country that involves operating machinery of any kind where the advice is to have a few drinks before doing it. GMAFB.

Certain, ahem, non-family-friendly toys.

 

[Hocky]

My response wasn't disguised as advice at all. It was obviously a joke. Name one thing that involves operating machinery of any kind where the advice is to have a few drinks before doing it. GMAFB.


My ADVICE was posted. And it was "relax". Plane flies better trimmed up and with light control pressures. It's not going anywhere so there's no need to white-knuckle it.

That applies from a 152 to a 777.

Drinking and shooting semi-automatic weapons go together really well.

Yes, of course I know I need to relax. That is what it means to stop gripping the yoke. You relax your grip. What kind of useless "advice" is that?

Me: I'm gripping the yoke too hard. What can I do to stop doing this?
You: Stop gripping the yoke so hard.

So, no, I know you think you're pretty awesome and an amazing pilot with many thousands of hours of experience, but your advice is simply a turd. Then add some sarcasm and belittlement for good measure.

So you fly a 777 then? Then I don't need your advice ever since you don't actually fly do you? You just sit and push buttons and maybe if you lucky get to land the plane occasionally but even that gets done by the computer. You really just get to drink coffee, fart, and maybe taxi the plane right?

 

[Timmer]

Have people really forgotten how to have civil conversations?

 

[MAKG1]

I think he's meaning relax your attitude, and the grip will follow.

Quite a lot of flying is head games and perception.

And flinging insults isn't the best way to get help.

You also never answered the question about where you were. You MAY get some in-person help from someone. But probably not if you keep up the insults.

A whole bunch of people (including me) have suggested flying hands off. Did you try that?

I think every new pilot tries to strangle the yoke. Just like they try to taxi with it. Flying is not familiar, at first. It's not at all like driving (it's closer to riding a bike, but those don't flare unless you have E.T. in the front).