Cross Country Solo to Ferry Airplane

gitmo234

gitmo234

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gitmo234
Okay before I get started let me say upfront that as of now I have opted against this option...

for the story, I bought a 1957 C172 up in Indiana. I need it ferried down to 58M, about a 4 hour flight due east. The 172 I flew yesterday had avionics issues so I cant take my checkride. After flying it however, my instructor (on his first flight with me) said "You dont have much to work on, lets get you scheduled for a check ride"

With the avionics issues the option (rather than waiting until the end of september) is to get my airplane delivered or ferry it back, familiarize and checkride in that.

I talked to my instructor and had a crazy idea, I asked if he would be totally against me creating a flight plan and if it was comprehensive enough, signing it off for me to cross country solo the bird back home.

He said he would think about it. Personally, I've kind of already decided I should familiarize first.. new airplane, older model with differences, etc.

I wanted to hear your (probably very polarized) opinions on the issue.

He quoted me roughly $500 + cost of return ticket for a delivery flight
 
I'd take the instructor with me and fly it home. Too simple? Five hundred plus ticket probably fair. Two of mine were brought by airline pilots, 200 dollars each one and they flew free commercial. I paid gas of course.
 
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Jimmy cooper said:
I'd take the instructor with me and fly it home. Too simple? Five hundred plus ticket probably fair. Two of mine were brought by airline pilots, 200 dollars each one and they flew free commercial. I paid gas of course.
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:yeahthat:

Or just pay someone to do it for you.
 
I am not a CFI. That tells you all you need to know.

Create the flight plan. Fly it on a GPS simulator, or other method.

Bring to your CFI and sell it. The way I would sell it as 3 back to back XC trips of 1.3 hours each. Three legs, three stops, show your emergency fields, show your fuel and wind calcs carefully.
 
docmirror said:
I am not a CFI. That tells you all you need to know.

Create the flight plan. Fly it on a GPS simulator, or other method.

Bring to your CFI and sell it. The way I would sell it as 3 back to back XC trips of 1.3 hours each. Three legs, three stops, show your emergency fields, show your fuel and wind calcs carefully.
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He's not familiar with the plane.
During the flight if anything goes wrong with it (which can certainly happen on a first ferry flight after the plane was sitting for a while) he's not experienced enough to properly troubleshoot and deal with the emergency.
 
I think im going to ask my instructor to fly along, I'll pay his costs.

$500 for delivery isnt bad, I have enough frequent flyer miles on a few airlines to get half dozen tickets for free.
 
A friend of mine is an experience pilot, and commercial rated just texted me "lets go pick the damn thing up this friday"
 
docmirror said:
I am not a CFI. That tells you all you need to know.

Create the flight plan. Fly it on a GPS simulator, or other method.

Bring to your CFI and sell it. The way I would sell it as 3 back to back XC trips of 1.3 hours each. Three legs, three stops, show your emergency fields, show your fuel and wind calcs carefully.
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With three legs, that's only two stops.

But it IS three landings in a flight more than 150 miles….hint hint.
 
Jeez. In a matter of a few flight hours he'll be a fully fledged pilot, and can fly a GA plane all the way across the US. If he's ready for a checkride, he should be able to take a 172 on a four hour cruise, a four hour cruise. Not like it's rocket surgery.
 
I'd take the instructor instead. He might sign you off after the mission. But....if I were him I would not advise you to go get it alone before you were capable of handling the trip and I'd signed you off.
 
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MachFly said:
He's not familiar with the plane.
During the flight if anything goes wrong with it (which can certainly happen on a first ferry flight after the plane was sitting for a while) he's not experienced enough to properly troubleshoot and deal with the emergency.
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It's a 172. Sure, it's an old one, but it's a 172.

Maybe sell it with a few hours of familiarization from a local instructor, and an overnight (reviewing the flight plan, of course) prior to departure.

The biggest issue is dealing with MPH ASIs if you're used to knots, plus some navigation issues if the avionics are different (the locale certainly is). You'll figure out Johnson bar flaps in 10 seconds.

It may not be the cheapest way to go, but it will knock off the "long" cross country if planned correctly.
 
Good call

Personally I wouldn't sign my name to that student x-country. Too many factors and I don't like how the NTSB narrative in my head reads if something went sideways during the flight.
 
docmirror said:
Jeez. In a matter of a few flight hours he'll be a fully fledged pilot, and can fly a GA plane all the way across the US. If he's ready for a checkride, he should be able to take a 172 on a four hour cruise, a four hour cruise. Not like it's rocket surgery.
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Not always true. Pilots abilitys vary a lot. Usually something between the ears does them in especially low hour types. Weather, panic attack , overall skill level. For him it could indeed be rocket surgery. I don't understand the mph- knot thing. Pretty easy to figure out.
 
Silly question but you say you bought it. Have you paid yet? Had it checked out by A&P? Might want to take an A&P / pilot with you.
I would add to the group that thinks flying an unknown aircraft as a student cross country is a bad idea.
 
It went through a pretty comprehensive pre-buy inspection, including a borescope of the cylinders and I had the propeller dynamically balanced. It's paid for, awaiting pick up.
 
docmirror said:
Jeez. In a matter of a few flight hours he'll be a fully fledged pilot, and can fly a GA plane all the way across the US. If he's ready for a checkride, he should be able to take a 172 on a four hour cruise, a four hour cruise. Not like it's rocket surgery.
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You really think the day you get your PPL your safe enough to fly across the country? PPL is a license to learn. Just because your allowed to do something, doesn't mean it's smart.
 
MAKG1 said:
It's a 172. Sure, it's an old one, but it's a 172.

Maybe sell it with a few hours of familiarization from a local instructor, and an overnight (reviewing the flight plan, of course) prior to departure.

The biggest issue is dealing with MPH ASIs if you're used to knots, plus some navigation issues if the avionics are different (the locale certainly is). You'll figure out Johnson bar flaps in 10 seconds.

It may not be the cheapest way to go, but it will knock off the "long" cross country if planned correctly.
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You never know what problems may come up from an unknown aircraft.
 
MachFly said:
You really think the day you get your PPL your safe enough to fly across the country? PPL is a license to learn. Just because your allowed to do something, doesn't mean it's smart.
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If he can't fly a 4 hour cross country the day after he gets his PPL, then both the CFI and the examiner should loose their certificates. It just isn't that big a deal.
 
All things considered (schedule and money) it looks like the delivery option just cant be beat. Picking up would include redemption fees for miles x2, plus rental car, and other costs. Delivery is about $500 + redemption fee for miles and driving someone to an airport and they can have it here by Sunday (most likely) which is pretty quick.
 
Take the instructor. By the time you get it home, you'll be comfortable in it.

Transitioning to a new aircraft is more difficult the first couple times you do it.

I would not pay a ferry pilot. As long as you're paying someone you might as well pay your instructor _and_ get good experience. He might also be able to give you pointers on the avionics or differences you may not have noticed.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
If he can't fly a 4 hour cross country the day after he gets his PPL, then both the CFI and the examiner should loose their certificates. It just isn't that big a deal.
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For one your talking about the week before his checkride, not the day after. Then it's a new aircraft to him, which may also have problems that he is unfamiliar with.
 
dans2992 said:
Take the instructor. By the time you get it home, you'll be comfortable in it.

Transitioning to a new aircraft is more difficult the first couple times you do it.

I would not pay a ferry pilot. As long as you're paying someone you might as well pay your instructor _and_ get good experience. He might also be able to give you pointers on the avionics or differences you may not have noticed.
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This way makes sense. I'll report back with what he says
 
dans2992 said:
Take the instructor. By the time you get it home, you'll be comfortable in it.

Transitioning to a new aircraft is more difficult the first couple times you do it.

I would not pay a ferry pilot. As long as you're paying someone you might as well pay your instructor _and_ get good experience. He might also be able to give you pointers on the avionics or differences you may not have noticed.
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Agreed
 
Greg Bockelman said:
If he can't fly a 4 hour cross country the day after he gets his PPL, then both the CFI and the examiner should loose their certificates. It just isn't that big a deal.
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That's bs. He's very low time and a real beginner. Neither should advise him to do it alone. I sure would not. In addition how has he insured the airplane, hull, liability? Maybe not insured at all! Not good. Do it right and take the instructor along, and be sure it's insured.
 
MachFly said:
For one your talking about the week before his checkride, not the day after. Then it's a new aircraft to him, which may also have problems that he is unfamiliar with.
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Yeah, but YOU said

MachFly said:
You really think the day you get your PPL your safe enough to fly across the country? PPL is a license to learn. Just because your allowed to do something, doesn't mean it's smart.
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THAT is the quote I was responding to and I stand by my statement.

There is no question he should not do it solo before he gets his certificate, but there is no reason he cannot do that trip after he does get it. And I would advocate a checkout in the plane first.
 
Fine, stay in bed. Can't have a crash sleeping.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
Yeah, but YOU said



THAT is the quote I was responding to and I stand by my statement.

There is no question he should not do it solo before he gets his certificate, but there is no reason he cannot do that trip after he does get it. And I would advocate a checkout in the plane first.
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I was responding to ramdom's post where he implied that the day you get your PPL you're skilled enough to fly across the country solo.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
That's bs. He's very low time and a real beginner. Neither should advise him to do it alone. I sure would not.
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Oh puleeze. THAT is BS. A 4 hour cross country the day after a guy gets his certificate should be an absolute no brainer. The caveat is that he gets checked out in THAT airplane first.

In addition how has he insured the airplane, hull, liability? Maybe not insured at all! Not good. Do it right and take the instructor along, and be sure it's insured.
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That is a whole separate issue that has nothing do do with his competence to do the cross country.
 
If this were a 172S that I have 40 hours flying, a mix of dual and solo, I'd have no issues with it. Yesterday, however, I flew the 172M and the differences were enough to make me decide against this... 40 degree flaps for the first time.... carb heat.... some different speeds...checklist differences, etc.

It also felt like changing from a car with power steering to one without (but I actually liked it more)

EDIT: I have hull insurance. I was surprised it was cheaper than full coverage on my car
 
gitmo234 said:
If this were a 172S that I have 40 hours flying, a mix of dual and solo, I'd have no issues with it. Yesterday, however, I flew the 172M and the differences were enough to make me decide against this... 40 degree flaps for the first time.... carb heat.... some different speeds...checklist differences, etc.

It also felt like changing from a car with power steering to one without (but I actually liked it more)

EDIT: I have hull insurance. I was surprised it was cheaper than full coverage on my car
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Those are VERY different aircraft, don't do it solo.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
Oh puleeze. THAT is BS. A 4 hour cross country the day after a guy gets his certificate should be an absolute no brainer. The caveat is that he gets checked out in THAT airplane first.
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It's a few weeks before the certificate the way I understand. And on a completely different plane that he has little or no experience in.
 
MachFly said:
It's a few weeks before the certificate the way I understand. And on a completely different plane that he has little or no experience in.
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AGAIN this is the post I was responding to:

MachFly said:
You really think the day you get your PPL your safe enough to fly across the country? PPL is a license to learn. Just because your allowed to do something, doesn't mean it's smart.
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YOU make it sound that the day he gets his PPL he is not competent to do that cross country. I take exception to that. I do NOT dispute that he should not attempt it PRIOR to his certificate.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
AGAIN this is the post I was responding to:



YOU make it sound that the day he gets his PPL he is not competent to do that cross country. I take exception to that. I do NOT dispute that he should not attempt it PRIOR to his certificate.
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Okay we're beating a dead horse here.

Next thread...
 
I remember when I was a student (wayyy back when.. about a year ago) and thought a 1/2 hour leg was a long flight. I also remember how much I did not know. If you can get your CFI to ride along, it would benefit you in the future and take some of the worries away for your first long flight. I do think you will find the longer flights to be much easier than some of the flights you are doing in your training. I flew across the USA with only 90 hours total and I survived. I did have my PPL though.. good luck!!
 
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