Collonite 840 cleaner....oh my!

rwellner98 said:
According to Shell's MSDS: "It consists of hydrocarbons having carbon numbers
predominantly in the range of C9 through C16"

Source: http://www.shell.com/business-custo...-hydrotreated-light-cas-64742-47-8-str-en.pdf

According to IEA-AMF: The hydrocarbons of gasoline contain typically 4-12 carbon atoms [...] whereas diesel fuel contains hydrocarbons with approximately 12–20 carbon atoms

Source:
http://www.iea-amf.org/content/fuel_information/diesel_gasoline
Ron pointed out that CAS 64742-47-8 is also listed as a deodorized kerosene. Kerosene has a carbon range of 12-15 that overlaps with diesel.

Source: http://www.asminternational.org/documents/10192/1942086/gas.pdf/90b64865-ad5d-45be-893f-20aacc7b90d5
So, in order:
Gasoline is C4-C12
CAS 64742-47-8 is C9-C16 according to the MSDS
Kerosene is C12-C15 (which CAS 64742-47-8 might be, with the MSDS just giving a broader range for unknown reasons)
Diesel is C12-C20

Readers can decide for themselves whether that makes CAS 64742-47-8 more like gas, kerosene, diesel or something else.
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Once again I will suggest you look at the specific gravity of the product and compare it to diesel. You've obviously confused yourself with the information you present above. There is much more to organic chemistry than counting the number of carbon atoms.
 
I accidentally released a lot of CH4 when I polished my plane today. Should I worry? I think some got on the plane.
 
Clark1961 said:
Once again I will suggest you look at the specific gravity of the product and compare it to diesel. You've obviously confused yourself with the information you present above. There is much more to organic chemistry than counting the number of carbon atoms.
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Please share your data. The specific gravity wasn't listed on the CAS 64742-47-8 MSDS, so I shared a reasonable comparison of data that was available.

Even in the absence of that, I would also be happy to hear why comparing carbon counts on hydrocarbons is not a reasonable proxy for a discussion comparing gasoline, CAS 64742-47-8, kerosene and diesel. The literature I was able to dig up to document these comparisons was all carbon number based rather than specific gravity based.
 
rwellner98 said:
Please share your data. The specific gravity wasn't listed on the CAS 64742-47-8 MSDS, so I shared a reasonable comparison of data that was available.

Even in the absence of that, I would also be happy to hear why comparing carbon counts on hydrocarbons is not a reasonable proxy for a discussion comparing gasoline, CAS 64742-47-8, kerosene and diesel. The literature I was able to dig up to document these comparisons was all carbon number based rather than specific gravity based.
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I'm going to bet that Clark can actually answer that question, since he's a Petroleum Engineer for a living.

But I'm also thinking he may need to catch you up on a number of years of school for his degree and another couple of decades of field experience to do it.

It'd be interesting to see if he can condense it to something you'd accept.
 
denverpilot said:
I'm going to bet that Clark can actually answer that question, since he's a Petroleum Engineer for a living.

But I'm also thinking he may need to catch you up on a number of years of school for his degree and another couple of decades of field experience to do it.

It'd be interesting to see if he can condense it to something you'd accept.
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Pretty close Nate. Study organic chemistry and then spend a few years looking at real data. I'm an upstream guy so don't get into the refined product much more than marketing product to the refiners. Traditionally the cuts are on boiling points so basically you get a mess of various geometry hydrocarbons for each cut. At the end of the day you're getting various density hydrocarbon liquids for the various cuts. Among other things, in general the denser the hydrocarbon the more energy it contains. Now for a cleaning product there are things one really doesn't want in the product and processes have to be implemented to eliminate them. We're talking carcinogens here.

In this case the specific gravity of the fluid is listed on the Collonite MSDS. That is the number of interest. The person posing as an expert missed that detail and instead offered parroted material with no demonstrated understanding of the actual chemistry.
 
Clark1961 said:
Pretty close Nate. Study organic chemistry and then spend a few years looking at real data. I'm an upstream guy so don't get into the refined product much more than marketing product to the refiners. Traditionally the cuts are on boiling points so basically you get a mess of various geometry hydrocarbons for each cut. At the end of the day you're getting various density hydrocarbon liquids for the various cuts. Among other things, in general the denser the hydrocarbon the more energy it contains. Now for a cleaning product there are things one really doesn't want in the product and processes have to be implemented to eliminate them. We're talking carcinogens here.

In this case the specific gravity of the fluid is listed on the Collonite MSDS. That is the number of interest. The person posing as an expert missed that detail and instead offered parroted material with no demonstrated understanding of the actual chemistry.
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Bah. I forgot you play with the stuff before it hits the refinery! LOL.

I never played with it at all. I worked in the office building with the traffic cops that made it all go places via those funny metal underground tubes, tanker trucks, and big boats. I was between your workplace and the refinery, and then sometimes involved in bulk movement after the refinery.

But they sent us out to where your side had already dug the holes and showed us what our field guys and gals had to do, and it was kinda like staying at a holiday inn express, before those existed...

So I just lump everything in the field into "crazy dudes driving too fast in pickup trucks and tanker trucks in the middle of nowhere on really bad dirt roads"...

Probably due to the trauma of those truck rides. :-)

But that was a long long time ago when Texaco still existed, and we still had an entire department called "keypunch" that mastered the art of reading handwritten tickets from gaugers and pumping stations and truck drivers, and they entered all of those at lightning speed into the mainframe...

LOL. Damn that was a long time ago! :-)

So ... you're just another of those crazy field dudes. Hahaha.

(Extra crazy in winter, BTW. Holy crap... Tanker trucks aren't supposed to drift through corners, are they?? That truck driver I did the ride along with in Utah was CRAZY... But he knew his truck and that road real well...)
 
Collinite is wax in a light petroleum carrier. It's not harmful to the plane or the applier though some people might have skin sensitivity to the carrier.
 
flyingron said:
Collinite is wax in a light petroleum carrier. It's not harmful to the plane or the applier though some people might have skin sensitivity to the carrier.
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Great to know...:yesnod: I feel better about giving it a try...:goofy:
 
Just to go off an an already-tagentally-challenged discussion.... Has anyone got the MSDS for Collonite cleaner in hand? The MSDS for the wax was posted above, but not the cleaner. I went to the Collonite site and you have to send a request to them specifically asking for it.

I have the MSDS for Gojo hand cleaner (off their web site) and I thought it might be interesting to compare them. :)

Jim

PS- I also note that the MSDS's are not on the site of the other products mentioned in the thread.
 
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I know it has a petroleum smell and evaporates quickly. White gas maybe or high quality kerosene?
 
based on the thread title, I expected this to be a medical discussion
 
Collinite is great stuff and is regarded as one of the longest lasting products in the auto detailing world. I have used it on multiple details myself. If you don't have one, buy a Griot's Garage Dual Action Polisher and get yourself the 4" backing plate. It is absolutely incredible what you can do with a good dual action polisher...so much easier than doing it by hand, much quicker, and the results are ridiculous!

I will admit that I know very little about airplane paint and whether or not it is much different than auto paint...I thought about starting a thread asking about this as I would love to wax my own plane if I owned one...wouldn't want to use product that could damage the paint.
 
Where did you get the 4" backing plate? I only saw a 5" and a 3". But I only looked on Amazon.
 
ktup-flyer said:
Most carnauba waxes last 6 months, not 6 weeks. The cheap OTC crap doesn't last, but if you buy a quality product it will.
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Baloney. Carnauba wax may last 6 months on a car, especially if you keep it in a garage. On an airplane I wouldn't expect to last 6 weeks. I stopped using the stuff long ago. Polymer waxes have the perdurance I expect.
 
Timbeck2 said:
Where did you get the 4" backing plate? I only saw a 5" and a 3". But I only looked on Amazon.
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Oh your right sorry I have 5" and 3" with quite the assortment of pads for both (blue, white, orange, yellow).
 
steingar said:
Baloney. Carnauba wax may last 6 months on a car, especially if you keep it in a garage. On an airplane I wouldn't expect to last 6 weeks. I stopped using the stuff long ago. Polymer waxes have the perdurance I expect.
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Agreed - you would be hard pressed to find any environment that will allow carnauba to last 6 months unless it was a show car sitting in the garage all day. Carnauba waxes are awesome, but you'll be stuck applying them every 6 weeks.

I don't know if this stuff is appropriate for airplane paint (again I don't know what or if there are differences between airplane paint and auto paint) but 3D Detailing makes an awesome all in one (AIO) product called HD Speed that has been the bees knees over on the AutoGeek forums. I have Pinnacle Products, Wolfgang, DP,Collinite - just to name a few and have to admit that the HD Speed stuff is awesome and very affordable. Frankly, they all work very well though.

I am going to have to get on Autogeek and see if any of those guys do any airplane detailing...all I need is a plane to detail ;p
 
Interesting products...everything seems reasonably priced for the most part aside froma few of the products...$50 for a 16oz bottle seems a bit steep though
 
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CC268 said:
Interesting products...everything seems reasonably priced for the most part aside froma few of the products...$50 for a 16oz bottle seems a bit steep though
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Compared to automotive/boat/RV products of similar capabilities and quality, it's in line with others. And our margins aren't even very good on it, because the component costs on long lasting formulas are high. But, yeah, we do intend to create another formula that's more competitive in the mid-price/mid-quality area. Not everyone wants to pay for something that lasts a year, as witnessed by the number of people who have chimed in above with their support for carnauba based formulas.

We chose to initially go after the "discerning pilot" population, so we don't have a wax at the moment. Just a high-end sealant. But we do have a wash and wax with carnauba and it is, as you would expect, much less expensive.

http://planeperfect.us/collections/all/products/ecb
 
timwinters said:
But it's for airplanes!!!!

You're dumb enough to pay that much, right?
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Jeez Tim I've never met you before but I figured you'd have a little more respect than to say something like that to someone you've never met...

I don't consider myself to be dumb?
 
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rwellner98 said:
Compared to automotive/boat/RV products of similar capabilities and quality, it's in line with others. And our margins aren't even very good on it, because the component costs on long lasting formulas are high. But, yeah, we do intend to create another formula that's more competitive in the mid-price/mid-quality area. Not everyone wants to pay for something that lasts a year, as witnessed by the number of people who have chimed in above with their support for carnauba based formulas.

We chose to initially go after the "discerning pilot" population, so we don't have a wax at the moment. Just a high-end sealant. But we do have a wash and wax with carnauba and it is, as you would expect, much less expensive.

http://planeperfect.us/collections/all/products/ecb
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Ahh I see that it is a sealant and not a wax...I've never actually looked at just a sealant so not even sure what the price point for that is...but from what I can see your price point on the other products is very reasonable...then again I buy all my auto detailing product from auto geek and don't buy the cheap consumer stuff that you would find at the auto store.

If I ever have an airplane of my own maybe I will try some of your products.
 
CC268 said:
Jeez Tim I've never met you before but I figured you'd have a little more respect than to say something like that to someone you've never met...

I don't consider myself to be dumb?
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That wasn't aimed at you. It was aimed at mr. plane perfect who runs around this site hawking his products any time he's given an opening to do so. He also disparages other products, much of the time using dubious "facts", any time he's given an opening to do so.

So I return the favor by slamming overpriced "specially made for airplane" products any time I'm given an opening to do so.

Paint is paint and the very resaonably priced automotive products perform quite well.

And they leave a lot more money in my pocket for fuel.

But then again I have never bought a metal landing calculator either!
 
Well alright...carry on gents
 
timwinters said:
That wasn't aimed at you. It was aimed at mr. plane perfect who runs around this site hawking his products any time he's given an opening to do so. He also disparages other products, much of the time using dubious "facts", any time he's given an opening to do so.

So I return the favor by slamming overpriced "specially made for airplane" products any time I'm given an opening to do so.

Paint is paint and the very resaonably priced automotive products perform quite well.

And they leave a lot more money in my pocket for fuel.

But then again I have never bought a metal landing calculator either!
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Yeah I've noticed that too.

Same type of behavior a while back on that gojo thread, "well my products are SAFE on airplanes".
Almost like he was trying to scare folks off the gojo half implying gojo wasn't safe

FYI, non pumice gojo, collonite and lemon pledge are 100% safe, they just don't say "airplane" on them or have airplane price tags.


FYI Amazon has the 10oz 840 cleaner for $9.95

https://www.amazon.com/Collinite-Sapphire-Color-up-Cleaner-840/dp/B001LFDUQO#nav-search-keywords

Or the 840 cleaner, 845 insulating wax, applicator sponge and towl for $24.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00DRG2NA4/ref=pd_aw_sbs_263_2/192-9301127-8291041?ie=UTF8&dpID=41IDaHAQcBL&dpSrc=sims&preST=_AC_UL200_SR200,148_&psc=1&refRID=1ENMPVR0VC4ZM8SAXRC5



*Edit

I was just thinking I should order some myself today, found the link I posted here, and noticed this in the picture of the 840/845

image.jpg



image.jpg
 
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Subsea said:
I accidentally released a lot of CH4 when I polished my plane today. Should I worry? I think some got on the plane.
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Are you sure it was an accidental release? Or was it a conscious venting to atmosphere to equalize pressure?
 
That is the kit I bought. Worked great.

James331 said:
Yeah I've noticed that too.

Same type of behavior a while back on that gojo thread, "well my products are SAFE on airplanes".
Almost like he was trying to scare folks off the gojo half implying gojo wasn't safe

FYI, non pumice gojo, collonite and lemon pledge are 100% safe, they just don't say "airplane" on them or have airplane price tags.


FYI Amazon has the 10oz 840 cleaner for $9.95

https://www.amazon.com/Collinite-Sapphire-Color-up-Cleaner-840/dp/B001LFDUQO#nav-search-keywords

Or the 840 cleaner, 845 insulating wax, applicator sponge and towl for $24.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00DRG2NA4/ref=pd_aw_sbs_263_2/192-9301127-8291041?ie=UTF8&dpID=41IDaHAQcBL&dpSrc=sims&preST=_AC_UL200_SR200,148_&psc=1&refRID=1ENMPVR0VC4ZM8SAXRC5



*Edit

I was just thinking I should order some myself today, found the link I posted here, and noticed this in the picture of the 840/845

image.jpg



image.jpg
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I use Blackfire Wet Diamond on my car. I can see it working well on a plane. Based on the fact that my car is painted. My airplane is also painted. And since sealants protect paint, and both are painted surfaces.... I stick with T Dub's assessment that just 'cause it says "airplane!" on the bottle doesn't necessarily make it superior.

BUT I miss out on the dielectric coefficient something something by not using Collonite. So there's that. Honestly I liked Collonite better before someone pointed out it has aeronautical on the bottle. I wanted to use it and feel like a rebel.
 
Yeah, I'm about ready to take the Lemon Pledge plunge because my hangar neighbor keeps borrowing my Plexus. Wonder where I can get a Consuela sticker.
 
Sam's Club has Pledge by the case and micro-fiber towels dirt cheap, Tim....just sayin' :)

Jim
 
Collinite 845 is awesome - I think you'd have a hard time finding anything else that will last as long.
 
The 845 tech sheet says not to use it on non-painted plastic (i.e., plexiglas). What say ye?
 
You guys crack me up with the back-n-forth.
And so does the title. Every time I see it pop up again, I think of an enema. *shudder* It hurts.
 
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