Cockpit visits?

Eagle I

Eagle I

Pre-takeoff checklist
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Kat
I hope I'm posting in the right section, but I have a question about the possibility of poking my head into the cockpit of an airliner, once it's on the ground, of course. I often look at the photos on airliners.net, and there seem to be quite a few cockpit shots, but I'm never sure whether they were taken by crew or not. The reason I'm asking is that I'll be flying to Germany next month on a Lufthansa 747 and would love to see the cockpit. In this post-9/11 world, I'm not sure what the chances of that are. I know I have virtually no chance of getting to see it based on my looks or charm:D, but I do have two things in my favor: I speak relatively good German, at least by American tourist standards, and I'm a student pilot training on a German-designed plane (the Flight Design CTLS). Does anybody have any ideas or advice, or can you share any experiences trying to do the same thing?
 
I flew commercial A LOT in the the pre 9/11 world. Once I happened to sit in the cabin next to a Southwest pilot and we talked flying all the way to our destination. He told me if I ever see him, to say hello and he would give me the grand tour. I actually did see him a few months later and he fulfilled his promise. That was probably circa 1996.

Post 9/11 more of my commercial travel has been to Europe than not, and most of those trips were Delta to Stuttgart or American to Rhein Main. Only about half that time I was in First Class where I could even see the cockpit door, but when I was, it was pretty much secured. I personally would not have felt comfortable asking them for the tour.

As far as speaking German to the crew, I am quite certain that you will find their English to be absolutely fluent and probably better than mine. I did lots of business all over Europe from 2000 to 2003 and it was extremely rare to deal with professional people who didn't speak English as good or better than myself.

I lived in Germany 1969 to 1971 and at that time most all children were fluent or very close in English. Those children are now grown up. In Germany it will be a rare situation where you need any language other than English.

My German is weak, but I always enjoyed doping my way through a German newspaper which was always readily available in First Class.

Where are you going in Germany?
 
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Well, I got a cockpit tour in an Air New Zealand 747 in 2005 after we landed in New Zealand. So, at least there, it isn't against the rules. As for sweet talking your way in, I was with a group of 99's (Int'l Org. of Women Pilots), and one of the flight officers was also a 99, so that helped.
 
Eagle I said:
I hope I'm posting in the right section, but I have a question about the possibility of poking my head into the cockpit of an airliner, once it's on the ground, of course. I often look at the photos on airliners.net, and there seem to be quite a few cockpit shots, but I'm never sure whether they were taken by crew or not. The reason I'm asking is that I'll be flying to Germany next month on a Lufthansa 747 and would love to see the cockpit. In this post-9/11 world, I'm not sure what the chances of that are. I know I have virtually no chance of getting to see it based on my looks or charm:D, but I do have two things in my favor: I speak relatively good German, at least by American tourist standards, and I'm a student pilot training on a German-designed plane (the Flight Design CTLS). Does anybody have any ideas or advice, or can you share any experiences trying to do the same thing?
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You will have no problem (at least I didn't). I saw both flight decks on my way (two planes and two different airlines) from San Francisco, CA to Grand Rapids, MI. I had earned my cert only days earlier and was excited to see the cockpit.

Here is what you do: Note that they have more time after you land. Plan to stay after everyone de-planes and do it then. Tell a flight attendant that you are a student pilot (after you are seated, before takeoff) and ask the flight attendant to find out from the Captain if you can see the flight deck upon landing. Advanced notice is polite and lets them plan. Don't bother telling the flight attendants / workers outside the gate or anyone not on the airplane itself since they will have no influence.

I got lucky and was there early enough to personally see the Captain board the plane and ask her (yes a woman 747 captain) if I could visit. She is the one who told me they like to do that after they land.
 
PS - No sweet talking needed but it was cool when the flight attendant came to my seat and found me and said "are you the pilot" or something and the two men in my row just looked at me with wide eyes. Talked to one the whole flight about my sectional, flying, etc. Great times.
 
Eagle I said:
Does anybody have any ideas or advice, or can you share any experiences trying to do the same thing?
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Not sure about Lufthansa but on Delta I often see the pilot or co-pilot outside the open cockpit thanking passengers on the way out. That's probably a better time to ask since they are not busy with pre-flight prep.

I remember my dad letting me skip school and run free at Boston Logan in the 70s while he did a quick trip to Bermuda and back. I was probably 13 or 14. There was a Delta 727 parked at an empty gate (Terminal C back then). I simply walked down the jetway and into the cockpit. Knowing I should not be there though, I did not stay long :)

It was a different America back then for sure.
 
I watched my window get green lasered on the final approach into Oakland. After landing I let most people clear out then I told the flight attendant that I was a pilot and would like to talk to the flight crew. She lead me to them. Not a problem.

I talked to them for a few minutes and they saw it as well and wanted to know if I could pinpoint the location for their report. I really couldn't -- can't see **** out of the window.
 
Yeah just go up to a flight attendant and ask. You can usually do it before or after a flight (I have never heard anyone being told no). After the flight the pilots will have more time, but depending on where they are going afterwards, they might not stick around too long. If you are one of the first to board, mention it to a FA that you'd like to see the cockpit and they might take you up right away. Don't have to bother telling them you're a pilot as it won't make a difference as their decision on letting you up there. If they can't fit it in due to workload issues before the flight, they'll have more time after the flight. The only downside to that is usually all the avionics are shut down shortly after getting to the gate. Also, before the flight you can ask them more about the flight planning and whatnot if that floats your boat.

I can't tell you how many passengers I've had come up front. Anywhere from 9months old to 90 years old. Toss them down in the seat for a picture with the one caveat "if it's red please don't touch it" :D
 
Eagle I said:
I'm visiting a friend in Nuremberg. And thanks for the comments everyone. I'm encouraged!
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There are some GREAT sites to see in Nurmburg. Enjoy the trip, but we expect a full report upon your return. About the cockpit AND Nurmburg.

I tentatively have an Army reunion this Summer, but the people organizing it are dragging their feet. My wife and her twin sister are asking me about every day for a date.

I know my way around Germany, at least what used to be called WEST Germany pretty well and always enjoy my time there. The second most fun I can have behind flying is the left lane of the Autobahn. I learned my freeway type driving there and it's about as much fun as you can have with your clothes on.
 
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kimberlyanne546 said:
You will have no problem (at least I didn't). I saw both flight decks on my way (two planes and two different airlines) from San Francisco, CA to Grand Rapids, MI. I had earned my cert only days earlier and was excited to see the cockpit.

Here is what you do: Note that they have more time after you land. Plan to stay after everyone de-planes and do it then. Tell a flight attendant that you are a student pilot (after you are seated, before takeoff) and ask the flight attendant to find out from the Captain if you can see the flight deck upon landing. Advanced notice is polite and lets them plan. Don't bother telling the flight attendants / workers outside the gate or anyone not on the airplane itself since they will have no influence.

I got lucky and was there early enough to personally see the Captain board the plane and ask her (yes a woman 747 captain) if I could visit. She is the one who told me they like to do that after they land.
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Kim,

Something tells me that as a 63 year old man I would not be able to "sweet talk" my way into the cockpit as easy as an attractive young lady.:D
 
MBDiagMan said:
I know my way around Germany, at least what used to be called WEST Germany pretty well and always enjoy my time there. The second most fun I can have behind flying is the left lane of the Autobahn. I learned my freeway type driving there and it's about as much fun as you can have with your clothes on.
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I never drive in the left lane on the autobahn. I'm never going fast enough. It is amazing how fast those headlights 2 or 3 miles back become the grill of a very angry Mercedes driver. :D
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
the flight attendant came to my seat and found me and said "are you the pilot" or something and the two men in my row just looked at me with wide eyes.
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They were probably afraid of what the next line from the F/A was going to be.

"Uh, the cockpit is in the FRONT of the plane."

or

"The pilots are unconscious, can you fly the plane?"

:rofl:
 
dmspilot said:
They were probably afraid of what the next line from the F/A was going to be.

"Uh, the cockpit is in the FRONT of the plane."

or

"The pilots are unconscious, can you fly the plane?"

:rofl:
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or did you eat the fish?
 
Last tube trip I took got stalled due to T-storms at the destination. I spent the delay BSing with the flight crew in the cockpit. They didn't seem to have anything better to do. My goodness they were young!
 
jesse said:
I watched my window get green lasered on the final approach into Oakland. After landing I let most people clear out then I told the flight attendant that I was a pilot and would like to talk to the flight crew. She lead me to them. Not a problem.

I talked to them for a few minutes and they saw it as well and wanted to know if I could pinpoint the location for their report. I really couldn't -- can't see **** out of the window.
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Oakland as in my neck of the woods? When?
 
MBDiagMan said:
Kim,

Something tells me that as a 63 year old man I would not be able to "sweet talk" my way into the cockpit as easy as an attractive young lady.:D
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Doc, my captain was a WOMAN and the flight attendants are WOMEN. Those are the people I "asked". No men!
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
You will have no problem (at least I didn't). I saw both flight decks on my way (two planes and two different airlines) from San Francisco, CA to Grand Rapids, MI. I had earned my cert only days earlier and was excited to see the cockpit.

Here is what you do: Note that they have more time after you land. Plan to stay after everyone de-planes and do it then. Tell a flight attendant that you are a student pilot (after you are seated, before takeoff) and ask the flight attendant to find out from the Captain if you can see the flight deck upon landing. Advanced notice is polite and lets them plan. Don't bother telling the flight attendants / workers outside the gate or anyone not on the airplane itself since they will have no influence.

I got lucky and was there early enough to personally see the Captain board the plane and ask her (yes a woman 747 captain) if I could visit. She is the one who told me they like to do that after they land.
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Kim, this is exactly what I did when the wife and I went to Aruba a few years ago. We flew on an AAL 757-200 and I was lucky enough to get invited into the cockpit after we landed. I asked a stewardess as we taxied to the gate and she said she'd try to arrange it. The Capt. was greeting everyone as they left the cabin so I waited to be last. He shook my hand and said...step in! When I got inside, the first officer was sitting having a sandwich and he told me to come in and have a seat. Very nice crew! We started talking and I told him I was a private pilot and where I learned to fly, etc. He told me that he was a CFI out on Long Island where I fly out of now. I asked if I could take a few pictures and he said of course. He even gave me the printout of their flight plan which was cool. When I got back home, I couldn't wait to fire up Flightsim and fly the same route using all the same waypoints! I was having a ball up there talking to him. I could have stayed for an hour or more but I couldn't keep my wife waiting at the door much longer.:rofl:

I also got lucky enough to sit in the cockpit and chat with the crew of a C-141 when I worked at Newark Airport. President Clinton came to the city and they brought his limos in on a C-141. My co-worker and I had to setup portable generators and lights around the aircraft before sunset. After we were done, I asked the crew if I could go on board and they said sure. I wasn't a pilot yet but they could see how excited I was to be there. Had a nice time as they explained the cockpit systems to me and then one took pictures of me at the co-pilot controls! I will never forget those moments.
 
redtail said:
Kim, this is exactly what I did when the wife and I went to Aruba a few years ago. We flew on an AAL 757-200 and I was lucky enough to get invited into the cockpit after we landed. I asked a stewardess as we taxied to the gate and she said she'd try to arrange it. The Capt. was greeting everyone as they left the cabin so I waited to be last. He shook my hand and said...step in! When I got inside, the first officer was sitting having a sandwich and he told me to come in and have a seat. Very nice crew! We started talking and I told him I was a private pilot and where I learned to fly, etc. He told me that he was a CFI out on Long Island where I fly out of now. I asked if I could take a few pictures and he said of course. He even gave me the printout of their flight plan which was cool. When I got back home, I couldn't wait to fire up Flightsim and fly the same route using all the same waypoints! I was having a ball up there talking to him. I could have stayed for an hour or more but I couldn't keep my wife waiting at the door much longer.:rofl:

I also got lucky enough to sit in the cockpit and chat with the crew of a C-141 when I worked at Newark Airport. President Clinton came to the city and they brought his limos in on a C-141. My co-worker and I had to setup portable generators and lights around the aircraft before sunset. After we were done, I asked the crew if I could go on board and they said sure. I wasn't a pilot yet but they could see how excited I was to be there. Had a nice time as they explained the cockpit systems to me and then one took pictures of me at the co-pilot controls! I will never forget those moments.
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I was too shy to ask to sit or take photos. I just got the "old / bold" lecture from the woman when she found out I was XC'ing to POA's annual 6Y9 fly-in over Lake Michigan, in a single . . . when she asked questions I answered that I was not sure if we'd have a life jacket or raft or be within gliding distance, she was worried.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
I was too shy to ask to sit or take photos. I just got the "old / bold" lecture from the woman when she found out I was XC'ing to POA's annual 6Y9 fly-in over Lake Michigan, in a single . . . when she asked questions I answered that I was not sure if we'd have a life jacket or raft or be within gliding distance, she was worried.
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Well next time don't be too shy. That was actually my second time in the cockpit of an airliner after landing and they were more than generous, they were also patient with me.

Speaking of the life vest, I was just thinking today about getting a few for myself and a couple of passengers that will be flying with me soon over water. Not as wide as lake Michigan but unfortunately, I can't swim:rolleyes2:
 
redtail said:
Well next time don't be too shy. That was actually my second time in the cockpit of an airliner after landing and they were more than generous, they were also patient with me.

Speaking of the life vest, I was just thinking today about getting a few for myself and a couple of passengers that will be flying with me soon over water. Not as wide as lake Michigan but unfortunately, I can't swim:rolleyes2:
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Don't talk crazy. I'm pretty damned sure if your life depended on it you could at least doggy paddle. Besides, grab anything floating and you no longer need to swim.
 
So far I was in captain's seat of MD-82 (American), Boeing 767 (American), Airbus A320 (Delta). Been in a cockpit of other planes numerous times. Twice got shot down asking to see the cockpit, but mostly, no problem.

There are few tips that will help you
- Take the window seat
- Do not get up the moment you hear the bell. I don't even get this one. Bell rings, everyone stands, and remain standing for like 5-10 minutes. Sit down, this won't make you leave earlier...
- Be last one off the plane
- Show genuine interest in flying/planes/aviation

Sweettalking a flight crew into letting you into a cockpit is not very hard. Do not even dare doing this before takeoff. Telling F/A that you are a student pilot will typically result in blank stares. Or "Oh wow, me too!" Simply wait until you land.

When you are on the way out of the plane, introduce yourself to captain, thank him/her for the flight, and let them know that you are a student pilot/regular pilot/wannabe pilot, and very interested in aviation. And if it possible, and does not break airline rules, would it be possible to see the cockpit.

I found that if you are genuinely interested in aviation, captains will love it.

I recall this one story. I was flying out of Memphis to New York, with a small layover in Atlanta. 30 minutes before departure to Atlanta, we were told that captain called in sick and a relief pilot will take us there. So, we took off, landed in Atlanta, and I wanted to ask captain few things. He walked out of the jetway (I got off the plane and was waiting by the gate), and asked him if he had few minutes to answer few questions. He seemed to be genuinely excited to talk to me about flying, etc. We spent about 15 minutes chatting.

So, airliners' cockpits are not top secret, no trespassing, shoot on sight places (well, in flight they are). Treat captain with respect, and you can get a lot in return.
 
steingar said:
Last tube trip I took got stalled due to T-storms at the destination. I spent the delay BSing with the flight crew in the cockpit. They didn't seem to have anything better to do. My goodness they were young!
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My Embraer crew for the one Frontier flight I've taken commercially, the only one in many years now, looked like they were about ready to start shaving soon. Maybe just the Captain... FO looked like he was ready to go play X-Box. ;)
 
redtail said:
He even gave me the printout of their flight plan which was cool. When I got back home, I couldn't wait to fire up Flightsim and fly the same route using all the same waypoints!
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Heh heh... reading this (and having had similar experiences with nice commercial flight crews), all I could think of was...

"One man's trash... is another man's treasure..." :) :) :)
 
denverpilot said:
Heh heh... reading this (and having had similar experiences with nice commercial flight crews), all I could think of was...

"One man's trash... is another man's treasure..." :) :) :)
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Nate you wouldn't believe how true this statement turned out to be that day! He actually reached into his trash bag and pulled it out:lol:
Luckily, it was still clean. No food or gum on it:)
 
Ghery said:
I never drive in the left lane on the autobahn. I'm never going fast enough. It is amazing how fast those headlights 2 or 3 miles back become the grill of a very angry Mercedes driver. :D
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Yes, early on in my Autobahn driving in 1969, I was doing about 100MPH in the left lane watching the rear view mirror often. I saw some lights flashing way, Way, WAYYYYY back. I looked at the traffic and thought I would pass the third Volkswagen in the right lane and then pull over. I glanced in the mirror again and pulled over in front of the FIRST Volkswagen I passed. Just as I did a Porsche FLEW by. He was probably doing 150MPH or so.

If you don't know the rules of the road and pay close attention, you are very well served by staying out of the left lane.

In the early 2000's a good bit of my Autobahn driving was in an Audi A4 Turbo that belonged to the company. It was good for about 210KPH, maybe 220 at times. Much of the time, a guy I worked with, who lived in Scotland and drove the German Autobahn alot, sat in the right seat.

It's a big help to have an interested person in the right seat. He helps you with traffic awareness and watches the road signs. Occasionally he would have to point out when I missed the white circle with three slashes:D, this is basically the "no speed limit" sign you see after passing through an urban area.:D

Most Americans don't realize that a German spends more hours earning a drivers license than an American does earning a pilots license. The rules of the road are much different. This is why even with no speed limit and those fast cars in the left lane, they statistically have the safest freeway system in the world.

I have seen very few accidents on the Autobahn, but the ones I DID see were Deusies.

I hope my German vacation materializes this year. I not only love visiting Germany, I love DRIVING in Germany.
 
Most Americans don't realize that a German spends more hours earning a drivers license than an American does earning a pilots license. The rules of the road are much different. This is why even with no speed limit and those fast cars in the left lane, they statistically have the safest freeway system in the world.

I have seen very few accidents on the Autobahn, but the ones I DID see were Deusies.

I hope my German vacation materializes this year. I not only love visiting Germany, I love DRIVING in Germany.
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This will actually be my fifth trip to Germany, although my first to Nuremberg. I, too, love visiting the country. I've always found the people friendly and polite, the scenery beautiful, the historical sights interesting, and the food great.

And you're right about the Autobahn being statistically safer. On two of my vacations I've rented a car and driven, and although the speeds were much higher than here, I felt safer, because people actually followed the rules (imagine my surprise, for instance, when everyone suddenly slowed down, all at once, at the first sign warning of a construction zone ahead!). They don't constantly change lanes in all directions, they don't talk on the cell phone while driving, and they don't seem to have as much of a problem with drunk driving as the U.S. does. I was, however, scared as a passenger two years ago. I wasn't able to leave as scheduled as a result of the volcanic ash cloud fiasco, and while taking a cab from the airport to a hotel in Munich, my cab driver hit 196 kph. I swear I felt the car, which was a nice Mercedes, about to achieve lift!

Anyway, I hope you get to visit this year, and I'll report back on my trip later, hopefully with a cockpit picture.:wink2:

Thanks again, PoAers, for all your great tips!
 
The best tour of a cockpit I ever got was a UPS 767. I met the pilot through an aviation forum and took him and his copilot to dinner during their layover in PHL and then we got to play around in the cockpit while the plane was reloaded. I've got a photo of the cockpit while it's in "lamp test mode" complete with the pilot holding down the fire test buttons so those lit up too.
 
Oh I forgot my time in the C-5 at the AFB but that was "planned" out by the 99s. So it doesn't count. Plus it was mosly inop and sitting in a hangar.
 
And of course, met the captain and FO of this fancy plane and even drove them both to dinner (I introduced them to Vietnamese food Bay Area style) near SFO before their takeoff near midnight one day:

6242944208_d754e9a060.jpg
 
It's pretty gigantic. To get to a cockpit, you have to climb a small metal stair. And the entire cockpit is huge and roomy. Still uses old russian layouts, with stations for radio guy and navigator. There's a ton of space. I've been in a cockpit of 747-200, and AN225 cockpit feels like football field, compared to 747.

And you get your typical russian airliner/cargo plane amenities. Light green color (supposed to calm you), an electric fan without blade guards, and a periscope-type radar.

I've been in a plenty of Russian cockpits. Lived in Kiev, Ukraine until I was 12 and moved to USA. We had an annual airshow, about 30 minute bus ride from my house, and even during soviet times, they let us go in cockpits, touch stuff, etc. I've been in IL-62, TU-154, AN12, AN124, AN24, AN2. But AN225 is my more prized memory, since the aircraft is unique, and only 1 in service.
 
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I had to climb stairs, ladders, and more ladders straight up to get to the C-5 cockpit. It took forever and I didn't know there would be metal ladders so I stupidly wore high heels that day.
 
I believe it's like that in most cargo configurations. The 747-200 I worked with, had to climb stairs to the cockpit area. One side had a small bedroom, other side was the cockpit.

I would love to see the C5 cockpit. There are plenty of them here where I train, I see them in the air once in a while. Ugly, and beautiful at the same time machines.
 
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