Cirrus ads

[dans2992]

It is an ADVERTISEMENT, not a training manual. It is not marketing to pilots, it is marketing to non-pilots. It is the job of the instructor to ... uhhh, I don't know ... instruct. This is a wing, this is a rudder, this is what you do to go fast, this is how to handle a stall, that is a t-storm, etc.



Agree this would be a very bad attitude for a pilot. But this ADVERTISEMENT isn't INSTRUCTION. If it gets someone through the door, the add has done its job.

Considering these ads are in "Flying" magazine, etc, I'd say the target audience IS pilots.

 

[Henning]

You have it all wrong! You get them in the TT, milk the sub $1M out of them. Then say, well for an even better dispatch rate look at the mustang. Then milk them for $3M. Once they get max tax write off, you get them hooked on the new M2, with the latest g2000 touch screen, milk them for another $4M.

You have to do it incrementally as you gain $7.7M, were as if they went straight to the M2, then they would only spend $4M.

On top of that you get them a PPL, then IFR, multi, and type rating in each!

Think of how much $, he or she just spent on economic recovery! You must think of the children, what type of selfish prick goes straight to the M2?

They don't get the full suck because they allow trade in value that will consist of a small loss of profit so it'll probably only be $7.5MM.

 

[Henning]

Holy cow batman! I agree these ads are horrible and give a bad image to pilots. Nothing against Cirrus or Cessna but the marketing is just plain WRONG and sends a negative message.

How do you figure? Advertising is meant to sell a product, this is the advertising scheme that best markets that product to the market that can afford it. I don't see where the message of "Make more money" and "make a statement" goes counter that.

How would you advertise a new 3/4 of a million dollar airplane? How would you sell it?

 

[Henning]

Hey Jeff,

Lets refrain from personal ad hominem attacks shall we?



Back to topic, these ads encourage dangerous pilot mind set. Nothing against Cirrus or Cessna as they need to sell planes but they could have picked a different marketing message than "get there at all costs" without considering risk.

What marketing message would you choose? This is America, business has but one duty, to maximize profits, nothing else. You have to pander to the ego to sell airplanes otherwise none of these deals would get past their accountant.

 

[trepine]

You have it all wrong! You get them in the TT, milk the sub $1M out of them. Then say, well for an even better dispatch rate look at the mustang. Then milk them for $3M. Once they get max tax write off, you get them hooked on the new M2, with the latest g2000 touch screen, milk them for another $4M.

You have to do it incrementally as you gain $7.7M, were as if they went straight to the M2, then they would only spend $4M.

On top of that you get them a PPL, then IFR, multi, and type rating in each!

Think of how much $, he or she just spent on economic recovery! You must think of the children, what type of selfish prick goes straight to the M2?

But it's not just about closing the deal...Business people have families too, and being able to get your business done in a timely manner ads a tremendous amount of value. I bought a plane for this very reason, so that I could conduct my business and spend more time with my family.

BUT....if the weather is bad, I drive....big whoop, I would have drove anyway, but having the ability to maximize my schedule buys me more time off away from work and less driving around.

I completely get this ad....I see no implication here that you have to fly no matter what...I see that it says you have an option to do things more efficiently so you have time for other things that matter to you as well. It doesn't say he has to do 4 business meetings in a day, to me it says that he CAN...but if a meeting is canceled or a one on one is delayed most people understand that, especially if you build good relationships to begin with.

I don't own a cirrus, don't plan to...but I see no reason to hate on them or Cessna for showing in their ads the possibilities...Airplanes or tools, it's up to the pilot to use them wisely.

 

[JHW]

Hey Jeff,

Lets refrain from personal ad hominem attacks shall we?

hey, the ball's in your court. All you need to do to make me and many others look like a fool is to buy a plane and let someone, anyone, see you with it. That's not too high a bar for someone with the means to be buying a travelling airplane plus a warbird plus an airpark home, all while being an avid sailing and scuba diving enthusiast. Just buy any old plane. Get a tri-pacer, anything will do to get back at those jerks on the beechlist. Show them who's in charge.

 

[FastEddieB]

...I see no implication here that you have to fly no matter what...I see that it says you have an option...

"There isn't an option".

Directly from the ad. Bolded mine.

To paraphrase, "Must make meetings at all costs...if I don't, tomorrow might not happen".

To those who don't see the implication in the ad, well, there you have it.

 

[trepine]

I think your reading way to much into it and making much ado about nothing.

It's an ad.

One of the greatest hazards on earth is success. Kennedy's die on ski slopes and in airplanes because they have the money to afford the privilege of those experiences. The safest place to be is sitting on your couch......not flying, skiing, scuba diving, visiting foreign countries, parachuting, jet skiing, etc, etc. Which life do u choose.

I'd rather accept some risk of death to live an adventurous life than live a life that's dead to begin with.

 

[Henning]

I think your reading way to much into it and making much ado about nothing.

It's an ad.

One of the greatest hazards on earth is success. Kennedy's die on ski slopes and in airplanes because they have the money to afford the privilege of those experiences. The safest place to be is sitting on your couch......not flying, skiing, scuba diving, visiting foreign countries, parachuting, jet skiing, etc, etc. Which life do u choose.

I'd rather accept some risk of death to live an adventurous life than live a life that's dead to begin with.

It's not much ado, and it's not really nothing. If you consider it nothing, well, that exemplifies much of the problem we have in the entire media right now, nobody expects simple truth. It's ok to lie to someone if it's just a little lie and the profit margin is sufficient. It's business as usually to bull**** and oversell your product with untruths.

 

[trepine]

I just think you like to be antagonistic and/or angry...or maybe want others to sterilize the world of risk for you (which isn't even possible). The very act of flying carries risk, are you a real pilot, do you fly a real airplane. There are plenty of people that think you are a fool then, even if you fly commercial.

Advertisements are about showing people the good things about your products, they are not about full disclosure of everything possible. If you focus on all possible downsides of something people will not buy them because we are a culture of fear and you will go out of business, unless you sell something that is addictive such as nicotine (which probably a lot of people who see flying as high risk willfully consume despite well known high risks). If companies cease to exist you cease to have the option to buy their products and you cease to live the life you want.

I'm sure that no matter how they advertised their planes you would be able to find fault with it. I bet you can find fault with nearly everything around you all day long...The nay sayers have existed since the beginning of time

 

[bullwinkle]

Let me quote another thread about a Cirrus with an incapacitated pilot that went down, and you may understand better. These quotes are from people who were raised to believe everyone must live.

Which is hilarious and ironic, considering everybody dies.

We have become an insane death-denying society, instead of one that accepts and manages risk in a reasonable way.

 

[bullwinkle]

The "problem" screamed out at me when I first saw the ad a few years ago and still screams out at me now.

What is the clear implication when he says: "There isn't an option. That's just what I need to do."

I get the negative reaction, but another way of looking at it is: "If I buy this more capable airplane, I won't *have* to wait it out as often", which is how I read it.

It doesn't sound like such a bad message then, more of "use the right equipment for the task."

 

[FastEddieB]

This thread took a weird turn.

I don't recall anyone saying, or even implying, that a risk-free life was a goal.

I don't think so, and my life is filled with risky activities*.

My point in posting that Cessna ad was to point out that it implies a "push on regardless" mindset that we know from history kills a lot of pilots.

This, combined with the general tenet of "truth in advertising", leads me to feel that that ad appeals to "Type A" personalities and sends a poor message.

A better message is that GA is a valuable tool, but without implying "all weather capability".

But the perception is the reality, so if you find the ad benign, then so be it. I don't.


*Riskiest, perhaps, is riding road bikes in N GA, followed by motorcycling - with flying much farther down the list.

 

[trepine]

That's the problem with all printed communication....including ads, email, forums, etc...

The words are just that words, there is no context that we normally get from spoken language, and people read all sorts of things from the same words.

Hence one person sees this ad as promoting risky behavior, and another sees it as differentiating it's capabilities vs another product. We all read something different from the same thing. No matter how the wording is this will be the case.

 

[Henning]

I get the negative reaction, but another way of looking at it is: "If I buy this more capable airplane, I won't *have* to wait it out as often", which is how I read it.

It doesn't sound like such a bad message then, more of "use the right equipment for the task."

But the equipment doesn't the fulfill the "can't wait" promise. They find that out in a year and buy a Mustang or CJ.

 

[Everskyward]

But the equipment doesn't the fulfill the "can't wait" promise. They find that out in a year and buy a Mustang or CJ.

There will still be times when they need to wait. On the other hand, it's just an ad

 

[Dead Stick]

The Cirrus ads are reminiscent of those old Cessna "Land-o-matic" ads and the two-control Aircoupe ads before that - the implication is any idiot can now do it. Dumb then, dumb now. Most of us here recognize the foolishness of that, but those to whom the ads are directed might not. Merely having the bank account to enable such a purchase does not mean that you also have the skill, judgement and experience to use it safely.