Cessna 210 gear door problems

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Alaskapilot95

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Alaskapilot95
Hey guys so we have a T210F and we have some problems with our gear doors. On the ground the doors are up and in the stowed position and only about once or twice we have had them stay down on the ground. Handle will return to neutral when gear is put in down position. Now our problem the doors do not close while flying. Someone alerted us to this when we flew by one time. We have it in the shop now and have it on stands and pumping the gear up we get the light for up but the doors never come up and the handle does not return to neutral. The hand pump is also quite hard. Does anyone have any ideas? Thanks in advance
 
wow...I have only seen one C-210 with the rear gear doors still installed. Have you tried www.cessnaowner.org .??

The landing gear is an engine driven hydraulic system with a lot of limit switches for sequencing the doors and gear swing. The limit switches operate solenoids in the hydraulic pack, the sequence is doors open, gear down or up, doors close, selector handle returns to neutral. This requires limit switches on the three sets of doors for both open and close as well as up lock and down lock for the gear. in 1979 (I think) Cessna removed the doors and eliminated the solenoids, and also I think there is an STC to remove the doors.

Because some shops and most pilots really don't understand the system, owners have paid for needless repairs, power pack overhauls, and door-removal modifications. Actually, there is an electrical circuit involving the up-lock and down lock microswitches along with the handle switch that energizes the door solenoid valve to the door-close position. If your doors won't close on either the gear-up or gear-down cycle, then the problem could be in this circuit. A simple cleaning of the microswitches may fix the problem, or maybe a broken wire that the broken area re-connects when the weight of the plane is on the gear.

I am not a mechanic, but I used to fly C-210s carrying canceled checks. These are a couple of things I learned from experience and the night mechanic. Hopefully soon someone with more knowledge on Cessna landing gear will see this and give us more information.

And welcome to the site.!!
 
If your shop is having difficulty figuring it out, I'd recommend having them consult with Paul New at Tennessee Aircraft Services.
 
Zeldman said:
wow...I have only seen one C-210 with the rear gear doors still installed. Have you tried www.cessnaowner.org .??

The landing gear is an engine driven hydraulic system with a lot of limit switches for sequencing the doors and gear swing. The limit switches operate solenoids in the hydraulic pack, the sequence is doors open, gear down or up, doors close, selector handle returns to neutral. This requires limit switches on the three sets of doors for both open and close as well as up lock and down lock for the gear. in 1979 (I think) Cessna removed the doors and eliminated the solenoids, and also I think there is an STC to remove the doors.

Because some shops and most pilots really don't understand the system, owners have paid for needless repairs, power pack overhauls, and door-removal modifications. Actually, there is an electrical circuit involving the up-lock and down lock microswitches along with the handle switch that energizes the door solenoid valve to the door-close position. If your doors won't close on either the gear-up or gear-down cycle, then the problem could be in this circuit. A simple cleaning of the microswitches may fix the problem, or maybe a broken wire that the broken area re-connects when the weight of the plane is on the gear.

I am not a mechanic, but I used to fly C-210s carrying canceled checks. These are a couple of things I learned from experience and the night mechanic. Hopefully soon someone with more knowledge on Cessna landing gear will see this and give us more information.

And welcome to the site.!!
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A long time ago (mid 1980s), I flew a T210G with the same problem. As you say, I think they traced it to the one of these switches not allowing the doors to sequence properly. Thus they remained open. However, I am also not a mechanic, and that was a long time ago.
 
If you are getting the up light, then it sounds like the door solenoid and/or the wiring to it that is keeping the doors from closing. Once the light is made (which requires all the up limit switches to be made), it should electrify the solenoid, move the valve and allow the doors to close, and then the handle will return to the neutral position.

Screen Shot 2019-03-14 at 2.36.15 PM.png
 
As everyone has said, something is preventing the gear door control solenoid valve from energizing (or in some cases, the solenoid valve might be sticking). The default (deenergized) state for that solenoid is to open the doors, it's a cool feature, as with minor manipulation you can open/close the gear doors for inspection while the plane is on the ground and not on jacks ;-)
 
As @Zeldman has mentioned, removing the doors is a one-time fix (and gives you more useful load, perhaps enough for a vente latte) and it appears that most have had that done.
 
Are they staying wide open or just partially closing? With airspeed, sometimes the linkage binds, but on the ground everything works fine providing all switches are functional. Common cowel flap problem on aircraft as well. No margin for kinking linkage.
 
Get rid of the doors. Will cut back on maintenance cost.
 
FWIW, the guys at Tennessee Aero advertise the door removal as an un-solution... IMHO, it definitely ruins the looks of the classic Centurion.
 
Do the doors perform a needed function in AK operations?

With the snow, rain, and mud that's common there, I would think the doors would keep the crud out of the gear wells.
 
I wouldn't buy a 210 without the landing gear doors, but an occasional door cylinder leak or worn piano hinge don't bother me.
 
Ok here we go again. I got the gear saddles all completed and other minor things and thought I would ready for a summer of fun travel. Well Took off on a weekend trip and the gear doors would not close. Gear came down and locked green light and so on. Landed no trouble. Got out checked, not leaks and not a thing I could find on a visual inspection of the gear. Finished the trip no trouble. Yesterday we swung the gear, gear comes up but doors wont close. After reading other posts I thing a switch may be the trouble. Just looking for thoughts.
 
Aaron D. said:
Ok here we go again. I got the gear saddles all completed and other minor things and thought I would ready for a summer of fun travel. Well Took off on a weekend trip and the gear doors would not close. Gear came down and locked green light and so on. Landed no trouble. Got out checked, not leaks and not a thing I could find on a visual inspection of the gear. Finished the trip no trouble. Yesterday we swung the gear, gear comes up but doors wont close. After reading other posts I thing a switch may be the trouble. Just looking for thoughts.
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What model 210 is yours?
 
Aaron D. said:
Ok here we go again. I got the gear saddles all completed and other minor things and thought I would ready for a summer of fun travel. Well Took off on a weekend trip and the gear doors would not close. Gear came down and locked green light and so on. Landed no trouble. Got out checked, not leaks and not a thing I could find on a visual inspection of the gear. Finished the trip no trouble. Yesterday we swung the gear, gear comes up but doors wont close. After reading other posts I thing a switch may be the trouble. Just looking for thoughts.
Click to expand...

Hey at least you didn't cancel the trip. That's the part that would sour me about owning extra complex gear systems: the dispatch rate. To be fair, the only time I've had to divert back and kill a trip was due to the alternator crapping out (six years into ownership). That could have happened to any airplane, twins included (unless you knowingly plan to return with just one alternator, which the NTSB/FAA might take exception to if you bend something).
 
I have a 210J (1969) in my shop now and the owner has squawked the gear doors not closing, after 3-10 cycles they usually close up. I was unable to get the doors to close on gear up while on the jacks so I go to the nose and jumper that switch bypassing it and then everything closes locks and closes nicely. I change the switch and... the problem still persists only to go away when I bypass it completely. I can't find a solid wiring diagram for the 210J anywhere and am at a loss with an upset customer. any help is appreciated; please don't suggest removing the doors that is not solving the issue it's bypassing it and not an option the owner will okay.
 
green-scar said:
any help is appreciated
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Check with Cessna tech support on diagram. But best to find someone who has gone through the learning curve on single Cessna retracts and inquire. Never cared to mess with them myself and turned them over to a local shop to fix. Unfortunately that shop is no longer open. Perhaps someone here will provide a name or possibly get on a type forum and inquire. Good luck.
 
green-scar said:
I have a 210J (1969) in my shop now and the owner has squawked the gear doors not closing, after 3-10 cycles they usually close up. I was unable to get the doors to close on gear up while on the jacks so I go to the nose and jumper that switch bypassing it and then everything closes locks and closes nicely. I change the switch and... the problem still persists only to go away when I bypass it completely. I can't find a solid wiring diagram for the 210J anywhere and am at a loss with an upset customer. any help is appreciated; please don't suggest removing the doors that is not solving the issue it's bypassing it and not an option the owner will okay.
Click to expand...
The 69 system was 14 volts and an engine driven pump. In 73 they went to 28 volts and an electrical hydraulic pump. If you have low voltage at the end of the cycle the gear doors may not close ( see article below). Pinched or partially broken wire or connection? Measure the voltage at each solenoid?

https://www.cessnaflyer.org/mainten...d-a-hydraulic-fluid-leak-in-an-early-210.html

One side benefit to having the doors is if you have an internal or seeping leak the gear doors will likely droop while the airplane is parked. You know to check the system out. Also I think they are prettier with the doors and 1 or 2 knots faster, but that is a personal taste thing.
 
Press the plungers on all the switches and listen for the audible "click" --no click can indicate a bad switch. Where are you installing the jumper to bypass the switch? The wiring in the NLG wheel well is a known weakness in the Cessna SE retracts that I've worked on. I recently replaced all of the terminal lugs and some of the wiring in our C210 because on inspection it was less than reliable looking. Additionally, check any wiring for chafing or improper splices as well. As I mentioned before, the doors are controlled by the solenoid valve and it has to energize to close the doors... In order to energize, it should be going through 4 switches (one in the gear handle, one on the NLG actuator (down lock), and one at the inboard end of each MLG leg (on the down lock pawl)) and several yards of 18gauge wire...

FWIW, the Valley gear door removal STC saves you less than 10 lbs of useful load, and it pretty much only removes the doors & actuators. The switches and wiring all remain intact (at least it did on our C-210B). It just gets rid of 4 actuators and the MLG doors (4ea total).

Cheers!
-Dana
 
GREENSCAR said:

I have a 210J (1969) in my shop now and the owner has squawked the gear doors not closing, after 3-10 cycles they usually close up. I was unable to get the doors to close on gear up while on the jacks so I go to the nose and jumper that switch bypassing it and then everything closes locks and closes nicely. I change the switch and... the problem still persists only to go away when I bypass it completely. I can't find a solid wiring diagram for the 210J anywhere and am at a loss with an upset customer. any help is appreciated; please don't suggest removing the doors that is not solving the issue it's bypassing it and not an option the owner will okay
I have a 210J (1969) in my shop now and the owner has squawked the gear doors not closing, after 3-10 cycles they usually close up. I was unable to get the doors to close on gear up while on the jacks so I go to the nose and jumper that switch bypassing it and then everything closes locks and closes nicely. I change the switch and... the problem still persists only to go away when I bypass it completely. I can't find a solid wiring diagram for the 210J anywhere and am at a loss with an upset customer. any help is appreciated; please don't suggest removing the doors that is not solving the issue it's bypassing it and not an option the owner will okay


I don't know nothin about Cessna gear doors, but I am an expert on micro switches.

I believe from your trouble shooting, the micro switch you replaced is just fine, but needs a very small adjustment of the travel. If there is an adjustment screw, use that. If no adjustment, loosen the mount screws and press the switch closer to the linkage and re-tighten, or add some type of shim on the actuating surface. Wear of the linkage can produce this kind of problem. Try to move it or adjust it 1/4 of the full travel. I have been involved in quite a lot of fixed gear Cessna strut maintenance, and there is always more slop than we would like, unless ALL the components were brand new.

This is a common problem on equipment that has had a lot of cycles.

If my suggestion produces proper operation, please post back here immediately, as the original poster has the exact same problem, and your fix is what he needs to know. In any event, advise him now which switch you found could be jumpered to get proper operation. There are apparently 3 switches in the circuit, and his may be one of the others, of course, but that is a starting point.

Good luck, getting just the right travel on those switches is not easy.
 
PS The "total travel" referred to, is the distance the plunger/lever travels AFTER the contact clicks, not the travel from all the way out to all the way in. That 1/4 of the travel is to assure that the operates every time, but also, the switch will not be damaged by occasional events that go further than the setup on jacks.
 
Hello, Im new here. Found this thread trying to troubleshoot the same problem. T210G, engine driven hyd pump. On first flight of the day, when gear goes up, doors stay open. Cycle the gear and the doors close. Its been the same problem for a couple of years. Changed the power pack last year (for a different reason) but the gear door problem stayed. Its tough to diagnose because it always works in the shop on the jacks. I suppose a guy can start changing those micro switches. Just wondering if theres one in particular that is usually the issue. Thanks
 
My C210D, on a landing roll-out allowed all 3 gear to unlock, allowing the plane to "settle" on the runway. Trouble-shooting has narowed the problem to the gear-handle micro-switch non-aligned positions. Getting to them is a pain. Any help is appraciated. Thanks in advance. Mike
 
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