Can a Piston airplane go from Los Angeles to Hawaii?

FloridaPilot

FloridaPilot

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Can any single or a dual engine piston go from Los Angeles to Hawaii? (Nautical Miles is 2562 nm)
 
Let's see...2562 NM...lets take my 182...@130kts=19.90 hours @ 13GPH=256 gallons @ 6lbs/gal=1537lbs-1061lbs usefull load=676lbs overweight with fuel and me as pilot alone (plus 2 lbs for board shorts and tee shirt)=hello Hawaiian Airlines!

That is what we call good ADM!
 
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FloridaPilot said:
Can any single or a dual engine piston go from Los Angeles to Hawaii? (Nautical Miles is 2562 nm)
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Yes, most planes can ferry anywhere in the world with the correct outfitting to ferry. I believe the shortest crossing from the mainland in CA to Hawaii is 2150nm, but you would definitely want 2500nm worth of fuel.
 
Shawn said:
Let's see...2562 NM...lets take my 182...@130kts=19.90 hours @ 13GPH=256 gallons @ 6lbs/gal=1537lbs-1061lbs usefull load=676lbs overweight with fuel and me as pilot alone (plus 2 lbs for board shorts and tee shirt)=hello Hawaiian Airlines!

That is what we call good ADM!
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No worries, you get a Special Flight Permit, a.k.a. Ferry Permit, from the FSDO for the overweight takeoff. Also you take out your seats and such and ship them UPS or on Matson with the rest of your stuff.
 
FloridaPilot said:
Can any single or a dual engine piston go from Los Angeles to Hawaii? (Nautical Miles is 2562 nm)
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Yup.... And ALOT further too.....

Read it and weep.....


From EAA:
“It’s been quite a long week for Bill Harrelson, EAA 257277, of Fredericksburg, Virginia. Long-distance, that is. On February 24, he flew nonstop in his modified Lancair IV (N-6ZQ) from Grissom Air Reserve Base, Indiana, to Honolulu, Hawaii, a 22.5-hour flight of about 4,000 nautical miles. On February 26, he flew from Honolulu to Guam – 17.6 hours, 3,000 nm. Then on March 1 (February 28 on this side of the international date line) he set an unofficial record for a nonstop flight – from Guam to Jacksonville, Florida – totaling 38 hours, 29 minutes aloft over a distance of 7,051 nm!”

 
Shawn said:
Let's see...2562 NM...lets take my 182...@130kts=19.90 hours @ 13GPH=256 gallons @ 6lbs/gal=1537lbs-1061lbs usefull load=676lbs overweight with fuel and me as pilot alone (plus 2 lbs for board shorts and tee shirt)=hello Hawaiian Airlines!

That is what we call good ADM!
Click to expand...

I thought people like to fly on this site...shhheeeesh!! :D
 
Henning said:
Yes, most planes can ferry anywhere in the world with the correct outfitting to ferry. I believe the shortest crossing from the mainland in CA to Hawaii is 2150nm, but you would definitely want 2500nm worth of fuel.
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When you are in the middle of the Pacific ocean and you hit a big headwind how could you prepare for that?
 
N801BH said:
Yup.... And ALOT further too.....

Read it and weep.....


From EAA:
“It’s been quite a long week for Bill Harrelson, EAA 257277, of Fredericksburg, Virginia. Long-distance, that is. On February 24, he flew nonstop in his modified Lancair IV (N-6ZQ) from Grissom Air Reserve Base, Indiana, to Honolulu, Hawaii, a 22.5-hour flight of about 4,000 nautical miles. On February 26, he flew from Honolulu to Guam – 17.6 hours, 3,000 nm. Then on March 1 (February 28 on this side of the international date line) he set an unofficial record for a nonstop flight – from Guam to Jacksonville, Florida – totaling 38 hours, 29 minutes aloft over a distance of 7,051 nm!”
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That is amazing!! I would love to do something like that!
 
FloridaPilot said:
When you are in the middle of the Pacific ocean and you hit a big headwind how could you prepare for that?
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You can't, however wind predictions for the near term/18hr context are fairly accurate. You wait for your weather window.
 
FloridaPilot said:
When you are in the middle of the Pacific ocean and you hit a big headwind how could you prepare for that?
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By carrying sufficient fuel reserves, plus the wind will be fairly accurate (plus/minus) if you check it in the last moment.
There are ferry pilots who crossed Pacific Oceans dozens of times in small airplanes, it's matter of proper preparation plus carrying survival gear.
 
FloridaPilot said:
Sorry I wasn't very clear:

I meant to say how would you accurately know how much fuel to carry?
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You tanker as much fuel as possible and leave a BIG safety margin.

Piston planes as small as an RV-3 have done the South Pacific route. Generally anything 210/A36 class or above can do it in "comfort" with just the crew.
 
Where are you going to find room to put 150 gallon tanks in a 182? Have you ever seen a 50 gallon barrel? They are huge!
 
As long as you don't mind an overweight flying gas can, sure.
 
FloridaPilot said:
from Los Angeles to Hawaii?
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By the way, they don't go from Los Angeles, they normally take off from Santa Barbara since it is the airport that offers shortest distance to Hawaii, in those situations when every mile counts. Had this poor guy mentioned above flown from Santa Barbara instead of Monterey he would have made it.
 
N801BH said:
From EAA:
“It’s been quite a long week for Bill Harrelson, EAA 257277, of Fredericksburg, Virginia. Long-distance, that is. On February 24, he flew nonstop in his modified Lancair IV (N-6ZQ) from Grissom Air Reserve Base, Indiana, to Honolulu, Hawaii, a 22.5-hour flight of about 4,000 nautical miles. On February 26, he flew from Honolulu to Guam – 17.6 hours, 3,000 nm. Then on March 1 (February 28 on this side of the international date line) he set an unofficial record for a nonstop flight – from Guam to Jacksonville, Florida – totaling 38 hours, 29 minutes aloft over a distance of 7,051 nm!”
Click to expand...

What was not reported was that after landing, Mr. Harrelson spent 6 hours, 47 minutes in a public restroom stall in the FBO. He set an unofficial record of using 3 complete rolls of toilette paper and two full cans of air freshner. When asked of his time in the restroom, it was reported that he said, "I'll never eat a burrito and drink RC Cola in Guam again". :no::lol:
 
FloridaPilot said:
Can any single or a dual engine piston go from Los Angeles to Hawaii? (Nautical Miles is 2562 nm)
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In 1986 a piston twin took off from KEDW and flew over Hawaii without refuelling. It didn't land, though, it continued west and landed back at KEDW 9 days after departing, unrefuelled for the duration of the flight. ;)

Nauga,
and his 1.5 bladder
 
nauga said:
In 1986 a piston twin took off from KEDW and flew over Hawaii without refuelling. It didn't land, though, it continued west and landed back at KEDW 9 days after departing, unrefuelled for the duration of the flight. ;)

Nauga,
and his 1.5 bladder
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And without their winglets! :wink2:
 
Here's a Commander all decked out for a ferry flight from California to Australia by way of Hawaii. There's a ferry tank in the cabin, and a temporary HF antenna leading from the "co-pilot" window to the vertical tail, to the right wingtip. Duct tape protects the windows and paint from the antenna wire whipping around in the slipstream.

N88VK_120128_02.jpg
 
Pretty much the only GA aircraft that can do it without any modifications (not getting ferry tank, FAA exemption and certification and all that extra work) is a Mooney. I forget if it's the Ovation or the Acclaim S with the factory aux tanks that can go 2400nm non stop. That's just about enough if don't encounter horrible headwinds.
 
stratobee said:
I forget if it's the Ovation or the Acclaim S with the factory aux tanks that can go 2400nm non stop.
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Nope, the best you can do is about 1700 nm on factor aux tanks. Bill Cox of Plane & Pilot wrote extensively about both Acclaim and Ovation - he delivered quite of few of them around the world, he always needed an additional ferry tank (and special permits) for a trip to Hawaii.
 
ClimbnSink said:
He did say go not fly. The 152 I soloed in NY is listed as being in HI. Doubt they flew it there.
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Not likely, no lol. We used to containerized a lot of planes going across the Pacific, especially Sri Lanka. A 40' container will load 2 15x -18x for less than the ferry expenses. With an other guy, I can load the container in a long day and have it ready to ship. Container rates are at all time lows.
 
Bravo said:
How did it takeoff?
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You can imagine how such takeoffs might look like if you read Peter Garrison's (FLYING) accident analysis after a Swiss pilot died in 2007 when attempting to takeoff in Express 2000 ET (gross weight 3400 lbs) carrying 450 gallons of fuel at 5600 lbs. Hans Georg Schmid attempted to commemorate Lindbergh's flight and fly nonstop from Switzerland to Oshkosh (30 hrs.), he was a former Swissair captain with over 16,000 hrs on MD-11 and other aircraft, he flew around the world twice in his own Long-EZ that he built himself, he held multiple records, he was so 'decorated' he was even a member of Swiss accident investigation board. The takeoff did not go well due to raising terrain and some other minute factors (like CG was a bit too much aft) that Garrison discusses in his superb article that you can read online but it was only a 'hair' of a difference and he could have succeeded.
 
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olasek said:
By the way, they don't go from Los Angeles, they normally take off from Santa Barbara since it is the airport that offers shortest distance to Hawaii, in those situations when every mile counts. Had this poor guy mentioned above flown from Santa Barbara instead of Monterey he would have made it.
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That's interesting. Great circle to Hilo(closest to mainland) from KSBA is 2066.4. Great circle from KMRY is 2014.5. Maybe wind was more favorable from the south?

Hmmmmm
 
docmirror said:
That's interesting. Great circle to Hilo(closest to mainland) from KSBA is 2066.4. Great circle from KMRY is 2014.5. Maybe wind was more favorable from the south?
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Yes, you are right. I misspoke. It took me a while to locate Bill's exact words and you find his discussion on the topic on page 20 below. Winds are better when launching from the South hence Santa Barbara or Camarillo will improve your chances. BTW, someone determined the shortest distance to Hilo is from Half Moon Bay airport (2003 nm) but the airport may not have best facilities to launch on such a trip.

http://pilatusowners.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/POPA-Fall-20131.pdf
 
I believe this woman flew between California and Hawaii both east and west directions. East direction was in the C-180 pictured. Not sure what she flew in the other direction.

WEB10660-2007_640.jpg
 
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