Bought my wife a Jaguar XKR - Thinking Involved

[James331]

When did they do away with the inboard rear brakes?

Always thought that was kinda cool

 

[Ted]

When did they do away with the inboard rear brakes?

Always thought that was kinda cool

1988 for the salloons (the boxy XJ6 known amongst Jaguar folks as the XJ40) was the start of outboard rear brakes. For the XJS, it was either 1993 or 1994, I forget which.

The inboard rears were a cool and unique feature that may have made sense early on, but I think long term caused more problems than they solved and severely limited potential on upgrades. Plus as the styles moved towards more open wheels that showed off brakes, the hubs looked weird in back. My '82 XJ-S had 5-spoke 17" wheels on it that really had kinda an odd look with the inboard brakes. I got many comments of "Those are the tiniest drum brakes I've ever seen!" "Those ain't drums..."

 

[JOhnH]

Wow. Cool car. It looks almost as good as a Tesla!

 

[asicer]

You know, I did look for an Aston Martin DB7 from the mid 90s. That had the Jaguar 4.0L supercharged I6 with a manual transmission (which is a better drivetrain and preferable). It was more or less a blend of the XJS at the time and what became the XK8. Unfortunately they do fetch a pretty penny and are extraordinarily rare. I found this right up the road, win win!

For those not in on my joke, the Aston Martin DB7 and the Jaguar XK were both developed at a time when Ford owned them both and hence they share a platform among other things.

 

[Sac Arrow]

For those not in on my joke, the Aston Martin DB7 and the Jaguar XK were both developed at a time when Ford owned them both and hence they share a platform among other things.

Thanks for clearing that up. I'd love to post a used Aston Martin advertisement, but that would get the ban hammer cocked.

 

[Stan Cooper]

I owned a red '63 E-Type 3.8 roadster in the mid-sixties, and loved the way it handled. Sadly, it spent most of the time in the shop and kept me broke, so I sold it and swore I'd never have another Jag.

 

[Ted]

Funny thing is these people who had what they considered bad luck with Jaguars then bought airplanes!

 

[Checkout_my_Six]

It wasn't like they were turbines....or anything.

 

[Chip Sylverne]

Funny thing is these people who had what they considered bad luck with Jaguars then bought airplanes!

Yeahbut, pull back on the wheel nothing much interesting happens, even in a Jaguar.
(Unless it comes off !)

 

[MIFlyer]

Not sure what you're saying here. Luxury vehicle depreciation, as a percentage, is almost universally worse than on non-luxury vehicles. If you are just saying you get a "nicer car" for the same price as a new non-luxury car, sure. I'm not sure that is really relevant other than to say you can get into a nice luxury vehicle for the same money as long as you don't mind it having 3-4 years of use on it already. Audi still has a poor reputation about maintenance/repairs being needed once they get over that 60K mark, so the mantra still seems to be "lease an Audi". I'd probably have less reservations about buying a used Audi than I would a Jaguar though, be it unfounded or not.

it's been a while since I did a TCO calc on an older 3-5 year old luxury car, but when I've done it in the past, the TCO has been only marginally more than most boring cars. new, they're murder, but 3-6 years old can be had in absolutely 100% maintained beautiful condition for pennies

 

[asicer]

Luxury vehicle depreciation, as a percentage, is almost universally worse than on non-luxury vehicles.

Luxury vehicles tend to be sedans and sedans tend not to be very collectible.

 

[James331]

it's been a while since I did a TCO calc on an older 3-5 year old luxury car, but when I've done it in the past, the TCO has been only marginally more than most boring cars. new, they're murder, but 3-6 years old can be had in absolutely 100% maintained beautiful condition for pennies

Buying cars new is crazy talk.

 

[DaleB]

it's been a while since I did a TCO calc on an older 3-5 year old luxury car, but when I've done it in the past, the TCO has been only marginally more than most boring cars. new, they're murder, but 3-6 years old can be had in absolutely 100% maintained beautiful condition for pennies

When they get down into my price range (I paid under 20% of original list for mine, with under 50K miles on it), TCO isn't really a factor. I know this Benz will cost me more to own and operate than, say, the F150 or my wife's XC60. But I didn't buy it because is was going to be cheap to own. I bought it because it's affordable to own, at least by my current standard, and it's... well... if you haven't driven one, imagine the nicest, most ridiculously luxurious car you've ever been in... make it twice as comfy... now imagine it'll snap your head back onto the headrest when you put your foot in it, and wipe the floor with most cars on the road. Depreciation is way down the curve, and yeah, you're going to spend more on the maintenance and upkeep, it's just part of owning one of these cars.

Luxury vehicles tend to be sedans and sedans tend not to be very collectible.

Depends on the sedan, but yeah -- a lot of people have no idea what a high end sedan can do.

Buying cars new is crazy talk.

You got that right.

 

[Ted]

When they get down into my price range (I paid under 20% of original list for mine, with under 50K miles on it), TCO isn't really a factor. I know this Benz will cost me more to own and operate than, say, the F150 or my wife's XC60. But I didn't buy it because is was going to be cheap to own. I bought it because it's affordable to own, at least by my current standard, and it's... well... if you haven't driven one, imagine the nicest, most ridiculously luxurious car you've ever been in... make it twice as comfy... now imagine it'll snap your head back onto the headrest when you put your foot in it, and wipe the floor with most cars on the road. Depreciation is way down the curve, and yeah, you're going to spend more on the maintenance and upkeep, it's just part of owning one of these cars.

When you read through your description, it's remarkably similar to the logic that most of us use for buying airplanes.

Luxury vehicles tend to be sedans and sedans tend not to be very collectible.

Less collectible, agreed. But still has collector value. Look at some of the older Jaguar salloons, 4-door Mercedes, etc.

 

[SoonerAviator]

it's been a while since I did a TCO calc on an older 3-5 year old luxury car, but when I've done it in the past, the TCO has been only marginally more than most boring cars. new, they're murder, but 3-6 years old can be had in absolutely 100% maintained beautiful condition for pennies

Right, that's mostly to be expected. I mean, short of major component failures (engine internals, transmission, fancy suspensions) the rest of the maintenance for a luxury car is the same for a generic vehicle, the parts just cost a bit more. It's when you have to pay the high-end repair shop that specializes in Jag/Merc/Porsche/etc. that it tends to get really pricey. Sometimes luxury vehicle makers try to get so fancy with electronics/sensors that they create a nightmare when the electronics and harnesses start to age. So when you have a Bimmer with a bunch of error/warning messages flashing at you about a taillight bulb being out (when it's fine), you either pay for a shop that knows what they're doing or you just drive with the warning lights on forever, lol.

Luxury vehicles tend to be sedans and sedans tend not to be very collectible.

Well, that's true, but not really the point. Luxury vehicles are priced high and their owners buy them new largely because of the prestige of being seen in a high-end automobile. That prestige is what justifies the high initial price. After 4-5 years when they "can't be seen in a 5yr old car", the value falls rapidly because the buyers who pick them up second-hand and are more price-sensitive and the prestige has largely worn off because it's not the latest and greatest Mercedes S-class model anymore. I did add the qualifier "almost" in my original statement because I'm sure there are certain models of luxury cars that depreciate slowly (or even appreciate), I just couldn't think of anything off-hand. Not a luxury car, but the mid-2000's Ford GT (supercar, not the Mustang) sells for more today than it did when purchased new.

 

[asicer]

Not a luxury car, but the mid-2000's Ford GT (supercar, not the Mustang) sells for more today than it did when purchased new.

Sports cars are a whole different realm from luxury cars. And don't forget the saying about convertibles: "When the top goes down, the price goes up."

 

[Chip Sylverne]

Sports cars are a whole different realm from luxury cars. And don't forget the saying about convertibles: "When the top goes down, the price goes up."

I'm not sure any of the newer electronics laden cars will ever be classics like the E-type, or XK 120, or Aston Martin's, Ferrari GTO etc a. Displays, computers etc. will eventually age and become unobtanium. Analogue is forever, if you have the requisite skills.

 

[asicer]

I'm not sure any of the newer electronics laden cars will ever be classics like the E-type, or XK 120, or Aston Martin's, Ferrari GTO etc a. Displays, computers etc. will eventually age and become unobtanium. Analogue is forever, if you have the requisite skills.

Time will tell. People still collect and restore 40 year old arcade games, so I wouldn't completely count out electronics.

 

[kayoh190]

And don't forget the saying about convertibles: "When the top goes down, the price goes up."

You can say the same for women!

 

[Ted]

I'm not sure any of the newer electronics laden cars will ever be classics like the E-type, or XK 120, or Aston Martin's, Ferrari GTO etc a. Displays, computers etc. will eventually age and become unobtanium. Analogue is forever, if you have the requisite skills.

Time will tell. People still collect and restore 40 year old arcade games, so I wouldn't completely count out electronics.

It'll be interesting to see what happens. I tend to agree with Chip on this one. As it is the specialty shops and dealers are the only ones who kinda understand these cars along with very, very few enthusiasts. The electronics have gotten much less serviceable, and much more complicated.

Maybe a new generation of kids who understand all the various CAN bus and other digital busses will take an interest in diagnosing and repairing these sorts of things. There are some people who've managed it and done some pretty insane conversions that have taken an incredible amount of technical work as well as mechanical work. The Ring Brothers had a Cadillac on Jay Leno's Garage that I think was a 48 Cadillac with the full drivetrain from a new ATS.

I think what's more likely to happen, though, is that many of these cars will become economically unviable, and unlike the enthusiasts who could keep previous generation cars alive, it will get to the point where you need both mechanical and electrical know-how (and advanced electrical know-how at that) to keep one on the road. More likely is that some people will keep them in collections as art pieces, rather than as driving art. To me that's sad, but maybe some will find ways around it. I sure hope they do.

 

[SoonerAviator]

Sports cars are a whole different realm from luxury cars. And don't forget the saying about convertibles: "When the top goes down, the price goes up."

I realize that, and stated as such. I said I couldn't think of any luxury cars that might have slower than typical depreciation or even appreciation off-hand, but cited a similar example from rare sports cars. There could be some Aston Martins DB11's or similar that have held their value well, I just don't have the data.

 

[asicer]

I think what's more likely to happen, though, is that many of these cars will become economically unviable, and unlike the enthusiasts who could keep previous generation cars alive, it will get to the point where you need both mechanical and electrical know-how (and advanced electrical know-how at that) to keep one on the road.

The X- factor is the evolution of tools, processes and techniques. There may be things available in the far future that simplify enough to make it economically viable. But, predicting the future is never easy.

 

[MIFlyer]

Right, that's mostly to be expected. I mean, short of major component failures (engine internals, transmission, fancy suspensions) the rest of the maintenance for a luxury car is the same for a generic vehicle, the parts just cost a bit more. It's when you have to pay the high-end repair shop that specializes in Jag/Merc/Porsche/etc. that it tends to get really pricey. Sometimes luxury vehicle makers try to get so fancy with electronics/sensors that they create a nightmare when the electronics and harnesses start to age. So when you have a Bimmer with a bunch of error/warning messages flashing at you about a taillight bulb being out (when it's fine), you either pay for a shop that knows what they're doing or you just drive with the warning lights on forever, lol.



Well, that's true, but not really the point. Luxury vehicles are priced high and their owners buy them new largely because of the prestige of being seen in a high-end automobile. That prestige is what justifies the high initial price. After 4-5 years when they "can't be seen in a 5yr old car", the value falls rapidly because the buyers who pick them up second-hand and are more price-sensitive and the prestige has largely worn off because it's not the latest and greatest Mercedes S-class model anymore. I did add the qualifier "almost" in my original statement because I'm sure there are certain models of luxury cars that depreciate slowly (or even appreciate), I just couldn't think of anything off-hand. Not a luxury car, but the mid-2000's Ford GT (supercar, not the Mustang) sells for more today than it did when purchased new.

I've owned a few and found there was a lot more fiddling accessory and electrical issues. Examples include fancy air suspensions, etc. Also, the parts tend to be a lot more expensive than for GMs.

 

[Ted]

The X- factor is the evolution of tools, processes and techniques. There may be things available in the far future that simplify enough to make it economically viable. But, predicting the future is never easy.

That is very true, although my guess is it will never be easy.

Of course, 20 years ago when I was a kid, the old timers (like what I am now) were saying similar things about the cars I was working on and tackling without issues. These days there are fewer kids interested in cars than when I was a kid, but then again when I was a kid fewer kids were interested in cars than the previous generation.

So we'll see, maybe it will be fine after all.

 

[mondtster]

I'm not sure any of the newer electronics laden cars will ever be classics like the E-type, or XK 120, or Aston Martin's, Ferrari GTO etc a. Displays, computers etc. will eventually age and become unobtanium. Analogue is forever, if you have the requisite skills.

The electronics laden cars are aging better than I expected, but I agree. I’ve built my entire career on vehicle electronics and at the electronic manufacturing end of that there are electronic component obsolescence problems, even with things still in current production. Add in the manufacturer created software for the device and you’re looking at something next to impossible to support in 30 years or maybe even sooner. We’re headed down this path with airplanes too; displays for the GNS530 are not available so you’re SOL. Just wait until the G1000 units aren’t supported...

What I do find interesting is that the European cars seem to be better supported outside the factory, from an electronics standpoint. I think this is partly due to the Europeans being more apt to tinker with things and the cars being their home market vehicles.

 

[SoonerAviator]

I've owned a few and found there was a lot more fiddling accessory and electrical issues. Examples include fancy air suspensions, etc. Also, the parts tend to be a lot more expensive than for GMs.

Yup, that's why there are a number of aftermarket conversions to put them on standard springs/shocks. Had a neighbor (who works as a mechanic) convert a 90's model Mercedes over to traditional suspension because air-system was going to be a few thousand in parts to fix which was about what the car was worth, lol. More than a few Caddy's/Lincolns/etc. running around with the back-end dragging the ground because the air suspension is shot to hell.

 

[mondtster]

Maybe a new generation of kids who understand all the various CAN bus and other digital busses will take an interest in diagnosing and repairing these sorts of things. There are some people who've managed it and done some pretty insane conversions that have taken an incredible amount of technical work as well as mechanical work. The Ring Brothers had a Cadillac on Jay Leno's Garage that I think was a 48 Cadillac with the full drivetrain from a new ATS.

Those are the kind of swaps I think are fun, because it is a challenge. It’s about all I do anymore, although lately I’ve been thinking an old school car project might be fun again because the other projects keep getting more elaborate.

 

[DaleB]

What I do find interesting is that the European cars seem to be better supported outside the factory, from an electronics standpoint. I think this is partly due to the Europeans being more apt to tinker with things and the cars being their home market vehicles.

I think it's also due to very different regulations in Europe and the rest of the world regarding what you can and can't do with electronics and software. If you're going to diddle with factory electronics and software in the US, it's trivially easy to run afoul of copyright, patent, and DMCA issues, to the point where it's really not commercially viable in most cases. It seems that in other parts of the world, if you own it and the manufacturer won't support it, you're more free to do whatever it takes to support it yourself. Regulations elsewhere seem to be much more oriented toward protection of the individual than of corporate control.

 

[SoonerAviator]

The electronics laden cars are aging better than I expected, but I agree. I’ve built my entire career on vehicle electronics and at the electronic manufacturing end of that there are electronic component obsolescence problems, even with things still in current production. Add in the manufacturer created software for the device and you’re looking at something next to impossible to support in 30 years or maybe even sooner. We’re headed down this path with airplanes too; displays for the GNS530 are not available so you’re SOL. Just wait until the G1000 units aren’t supported...

What I do find interesting is that the European cars seem to be better supported outside the factory, from an electronics standpoint. I think this is partly due to the Europeans being more apt to tinker with things and the cars being their home market vehicles.

The GNS530 is a just a GPS that can be swapped out for whatever the flavor of the month is. The aircraft can still be flown even if the 530 goes TU. The G1000 is a bigger issue since you lose a bunch of engine instruments and radios which are needed for MEL. That said, I'm sure a newer model of that stuff can be swapped in. The problem with autos is that as more things get integrated into the touch screens and ECUs, buying newer (updated) components isn't an option to fix an ECU from earlier models. Can't take an ECU for a 2008 F-150 and put it in a 2003 F-150 and expect it to even start. HVAC controls, stereos . . . or in the case of Telsa, damn near every system in the car is locked into a unit that may fail 20-30 years down the road, and it's questionable that the aftermarket will have a solution for that.

 

[mondtster]

I think it's also due to very different regulations in Europe and the rest of the world regarding what you can and can't do with electronics and software. If you're going to diddle with factory electronics and software in the US, it's trivially easy to run afoul of copyright, patent, and DMCA issues, to the point where it's really not commercially viable in most cases. It seems that in other parts of the world, if you own it and the manufacturer won't support it, you're more free to do whatever it takes to support it yourself. Regulations elsewhere seem to be much more oriented toward protection of the individual than of corporate control.

What I’m talking about is primarily open source project stuff. I haven’t found anywhere near the interest with US or Japanese marques, which I believe is mainly because of the mentality demographic that typically owns them.

Want to know about Bosch moronic ECUs, tuning, swaps, etc. on your BMW, Audi, or whatever? No problem, there is tons of stuff out there and you can flash your ECU with a $12 cable and free software.

Want to know about tuning your Ford, GM, or Dodge diesel? There’s next to nothing for open source projects.

I just bought a brand new Italian motorcycle, which is a brand new model. Guess what? I can already read and write the ECU, and tune it if I want. The model has been out for less than 6 months. I don’t think you’re going to find the same luxury with many American or Japanese bikes.

 

[Ted]

Those are the kind of swaps I think are fun, because it is a challenge. It’s about all I do anymore, although lately I’ve been thinking an old school car project might be fun again because the other projects keep getting more elaborate.

It's all based on what you enjoy. As you've said, you've made your career out of these sorts of electronics, so for you I'm sure it's more fun. I'm a mechanical engineer because I like hammers. I'd much rather fabricate brackets and things like that than mess with wiring. I hate wiring. Hence why I'm building the Cobra and next I'm thinking GT40 or XJ13.

What I’m talking about is primarily open source project stuff. I haven’t found anywhere near the interest with US or Japanese marques, which I believe is mainly because of the mentality demographic that typically owns them.

Want to know about Bosch moronic ECUs, tuning, swaps, etc. on your BMW, Audi, or whatever? No problem, there is tons of stuff out there and you can flash your ECU with a $12 cable and free software.

Want to know about tuning your Ford, GM, or Dodge diesel? There’s next to nothing for open source projects.

I just bought a brand new Italian motorcycle, which is a brand new model. Guess what? I can already read and write the ECU, and tune it if I want. The model has been out for less than 6 months. I don’t think you’re going to find the same luxury with many American or Japanese bikes.

Now that part is very interesting. I suppose I'll have to look into the Jaguar aspect stuff, or if you have any suggestions I'd be all ears. Those things weren't (to my knowledge) available 15 years ago when I was working on these cars, but that's not surprising, either.

 

[mondtster]

It's all based on what you enjoy. As you've said, you've made your career out of these sorts of electronics, so for you I'm sure it's more fun. I'm a mechanical engineer because I like hammers. I'd much rather fabricate brackets and things like that than mess with wiring. I hate wiring. Hence why I'm building the Cobra and next I'm thinking GT40 or XJ13.



Now that part is very interesting. I suppose I'll have to look into the Jaguar aspect stuff, or if you have any suggestions I'd be all ears. Those things weren't (to my knowledge) available 15 years ago when I was working on these cars, but that's not surprising, either.

Ironically, I’m more of a mechanical guy myself. I’m an aircraft mechanic by trade, I just am really good at electronics and vehicle electrical system design and I like it. It is probably the result of growing up with a father that is an EE and has a background with vehicles as well.

I’ve never looked at Jag tuning but I assume it is typical european stuff. Your car is old enough that I imagine there will be decent support for it. Although it is primarily targeted at Audi’s, you might start by figuring out what ECU is in your car and searching on the nefmoto board to see what has been discussed. It may take a bit to figure out what is going on but the information is out there if you look hard enough.

The great thing about european cars is that parts are relatively cheap. When I start working on an unfamiliar ECU I usually buy a spare so I can get the car running again in short order if i brick it. I haven’t bricked an ECU yet (knock on wood) and am pretty adventurous with what I try though, so it is probably not necessary.

 

[Ted]

Ironically, I’m more of a mechanical guy myself. I’m an aircraft mechanic by trade, I just am really good at electronics and vehicle electrical system design and I like it. It is probably the result of growing up with a father that is an EE and has a background with vehicles as well.

I’ve never looked at Jag tuning but I assume it is typical european stuff. Your car is old enough that I imagine there will be decent support for it. Although it is primarily targeted at Audi’s, you might start by figuring out what ECU is in your car and searching on the nefmoto board to see what has been discussed. It may take a bit to figure out what is going on but the information is out there if you look hard enough.

The great thing about european cars is that parts are relatively cheap. When I start working on an unfamiliar ECU I usually buy a spare so I can get the car running again in short order if i brick it. I haven’t bricked an ECU yet (knock on wood) and am pretty adventurous with what I try though, so it is probably not necessary.

Having the electrical background I think is key. Even though I've spent most of my career dealing to some extent with the electronics relating to aircraft it's been more at a high level or configuration level, rather than at a hardcore bits and interface level. I played around with electronics a bit as a kid but never as more than a parts swapping sort of deal. So I can read wiring diagrams fine and if you give me the configuration tools I can use those, but some of the complex stuff I see being issues in the future, nope, not happening.

I'll do some digging. Logging into JaguarForums.com now...

 

[charheep]

So to keep up with my "thinking" threads, here's the next one.

As some of you who keep up with Ted's Garage know, we have a 2003 Mercedes E55 AMG that I bought as my daily driver about 3.5 years ago. It had 190k miles on it when I bought it and at the time I figured "Maybe I'll get 1-2 years and 10-20k miles out of it." Basically the intent was to keep it as a disposable car.

In the end, we got around 40k miles out of it. For the first year and a half or so it was my daily driver, and then my wife drove it (mostly reliably) to Wichita multiple times a week with her previous job before her current jet gig. Since starting flying the jets, the miles put on it have gone down severely to only around 5k per year, maybe less.

However, the Mercedes was getting to the point where it needed a lot of little items. Turn signals didn't cancel correctly, interior was starting to show its wear (although still remarkably good for 231k miles), mysterious coolant disappearing (which I still haven't figured out the exact cause of), and random electrical issues. It got to the point where it was still a really fun car, but a car that didn't work for a role of something that my wife needed to drive to the airport reliably to catch her plane.

I'd been planning on getting her a "new" car for this purpose for some time, but had intended on trying to time it with some major milestone. Over the weekend the instrument cluster started acting weird (although then reset itself) and I decided that was the last straw. I'd been browsing CraigsList, Facebook, and AutoTrader for a while looking for the "right" car that was local. I had a few different cars in mind, and then came across a 2001 Jaguar XKR with 59k miles.

As some know, I'm a recovering Jaguar nut and haven't owned a Jaguar myself in nearly 10 years, my last one being a 1992 Jaguar XJS V12 with a 5-speed manual transmission. I loved the XKR when it came out and it was a car that I have always loved. In my opinion, it was probably the best looking Jaguar of modern times, modern being defined as the era following the E-type (last built in the 70s). I still think this era XKR looks better than the subsequent XKRs.

This has a good history with almost all dealer service since new, a local car, rust-free from what I've found. A few minor problems, but nothing unexpected. In fact fewer things than I would have expected. I saw the car yesterday, made a deal, and picked it up this morning. Laurie came home from work today and we met for lunch, she was surprised and thrilled. This evening she drove it and decided she likes it way better than the E55, so I made a good call. Best of all, it has her favorite color combination - black on black (this was a must for any car I got for her).

So now I have to put the E55 up for sale, and see what I get for it.

Dont know if you watch them, but the show Wheeler Dealers just did a show on a 2002 AMG E55. Bought it for 4 grand and fixed a bunch of stuff and sold it for $7500. I like that show and learned a lot about that car.

 

[Ted]

Dont know if you watch them, but the show Wheeler Dealers just did a show on a 2002 AMG E55. Bought it for 4 grand and fixed a bunch of stuff and sold it for $7500. I like that show and learned a lot about that car.

Yeah, I had heard about that and was advised to wait until the show aired and put it on Bring-A-Trailer or the best sale price. I did submit the car to B-A-T but they declined.

At any rate, the car sold yesterday. I got some interest but someone who'd been chasing these cars all over the country trying to find one that met his wants and happened to live locally. He understood it was high miles but was looking for one as a daily driver, and understood that I had taken care of some of the big dollar (and very common) failures on it, so he knew what he was getting into. He made me an offer that accounted for some of the work it needed. I thought it was fair, accepted the offer, and the car sold yesterday. Good buyer.

Unfortunately he's already had an issue. On the drive home the rubber between the crankshaft pulley center and outer pulley let go, and the pulley came from together. This took out the belts. Fortunately he has all the parts. He asked if I had thoughts about finding a new one, gave him a couple of suggestions.

Either way, the E55 is sold, and now I'm focusing on the XKR.

This morning I bought fluids for the XKR. New oil, transmission fluid, and differential fluid. The differential is going to be a real pain as there's no drain plug and you can't just pull the cover off the back because of where it's located. There's only a fill plug, it's up against the metal for the trunk/spare tire well, and there's no access port for that. Some people drill an access port which I may do, but I need to look at it further.

 

[Matthew]

There's only a fill plug...

Maybe it's like my lawnmower - to drain the oil you turn it upside down and pour it out the fill hole.

 

[DaleB]

Some people drill an access port which I may do, but I need to look at it further.

Here's your opportunity. Drill a drain hole in the bottom, drain the oil. Tap the hole with NPT threads and thread in a plug. Now your car can develop a slow drip in the garage, like a proper British car should have.

 

[Ted]

Maybe it's like my lawnmower - to drain the oil you turn it upside down and pour it out the fill hole.

It was advertised as "sealed for life" from the factory, so Jaguar decided there was no need to provision for such things. The transmission was advertised this way, too.

What people end up doing is sucking out old fluid using some sort of vacuum pump through the fill port. The obvious problem with this is that it will only get the fluid out and won't get out any metal shavings or the like that you typically get from a magnetic drain plug or that you can do by pulling the cover off the back and seeing what's in the bottom. Plus you're limited to what angle you can get the tube in so it's questionable whether you'd really be able to get it all out. Some people will be pretty particular about measuring the fluid to make sure it has the correct amount removed (1.95L as I recall) but that also assumes that the differential is filled.

Here's your opportunity. Drill a drain hole in the bottom, drain the oil. Tap the hole with NPT threads and thread in a plug. Now your car can develop a slow drip in the garage, like a proper British car should have.

I did think about doing that, and may still choose to do so if I can't convince myself of the ability to drain it well via the above method.

 

[Matthew]

Do you have a borescope you can snake inside?

 

[Ted]

Do you have a borescope you can snake inside?

I do not.