Boeing 737 Crash in Iran...

[AKBill]

yup....bless their hearts....

you do realize that some need to be treated and housed like animals.....and possibly even exterminated? Those are not able to understand your kindness.

Understood, it will most likely take another 1000 years for things to change. But it has to start somewhere

 

[Velocity173]

For good reasons, especially after the Patriots splashed a GR4 and a Hornet. At one point, I recall a SEAD Viper comment “If that Patriot spikes me again, I’m going to shoot it.”

Next words from the Viper were “Mud Spike, Magnum” and that’s how we lost a MPQ-53. It also helped drive the decision that Patriot could no longer operate autonomously against air breathers.


ETA: if you’re familiar with Patriot doctrine, they were operating with as their own HEU. I did the RADAR assessment on the GR4 incident and know why it occurred, though it should not have and would not have had they not been autonomous.

Fortunately I arrived to the party late in Iraq so I didn’t have to deal with Patriots. First flight in country though, I got lit up by an SA-8 “searching” and a fixed wing “lock!”

 

[AKBill]

Fortunately I arrived to the party late in Iraq so I didn’t have to deal with Patriots. First flight in country though, I got lit up by an SA-8 “searching” and a fixed wing “lock!”

Sounds exciting, NOT
Thanks for your service..

 

[TCABM]

Fortunately I arrived to the party late in Iraq so I didn’t have to deal with Patriots. First flight in country though, I got lit up by an SA-8 “searching” and a fixed wing “lock!”

I left for my second OEF deployment in November 2002. For Christmas, we got a “student body right” and redeployed to KKMC through May 2003. Interesting time, to say the least.

 

[Velocity173]

Sounds exciting, NOT
Thanks for your service..

Oh they were both false indications. The only guys who had to deal with real word hostile radar spikes were the ones who flew in the first few weeks of OIF. After awhile, we would actually turn the volume down on the RWR as to not hear him yapping at us. Small arms and light weapons fire were our primary threats. Basically things that can’t be detected until it hits ya.

 

[Warlock]

Iranian explanation of event
https://twitter.com/memrireports/status/1216702540710064134?s=21

 

[Heftiger]

 

[Tantalum]

"I got a DUI because you kept pouring drinks, this is your fault!"

What an utterly primitive viewpoint.

 

[Warlock]

I have lost friends to IED's and had my good friend lost to a Manpad in June of 2005 probably all sourced from Iran...that's a really sad screen shot....

 

[Tantalum]

...because chanting "death to X" is not a provocation

I wonder what it's like to have a such an asinine, illogical, and morally corrupt view of the world.

jk/ I don't actually wonder.

 

[Velocity173]

I have lost friends to IED's and had my good friend lost to a Manpad in June of 2005 probably all sourced from Iran...that's a really sad screen shot....

Well some came from Iran. A lot of MANPADS were Iraqi stockpiles that they got from Russia or China. There were however clear cases of weapons and training to the Shia Militia from Iran (QUDs). I remember thinking at the time, I thought these guys were enemies?

 

[Velocity173]

They got lucky. Like the one guy said, the mortars and small rocket attacks are one thing, medium / long range ballistic missiles are no joke. Couldn’t imagine the violence of 12 of those raining down on my head.

https://news.yahoo.com/u-troops-describe-miraculous-escape-193732882.html

 

[Warmi]

I have lost friends to IED's and had my good friend lost to a Manpad in June of 2005 probably all sourced from Iran...that's a really sad screen shot....

Yes, savages will practice savagery but the real question is why your fiends ended up being stuck on the other side of the world trying to sort out what are ultimately meaningless differences between various flavors of medieval ideologies.

 

[Velocity173]

Yes, savages will practice savagery but the real question is why your fiends ended up being stuck on the other side of the world trying to sort out what are ultimately meaningless differences between various flavors of medieval ideologies.

Ours is not to reason why...

 

[wilkersk]

USS Stark was Iraq’s doing. The little known naval battle (Praying Mantis) with Iran that occurred during 1988, was started by the USS Samuel Roberts hitting a mine. I was actually promoted to WO1 by a pilot who received an Air Medal for destroying an Iranian speedboat during that year.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Praying_Mantis

Did not know you and I were in the same op area at around the same time. We were providing SAR coverage for the CH-53 mine-sweepers Oct '87 to Apr '88.

 

[wilkersk]

Yes, savages will practice savagery but the real question is why your fiends ended up being stuck on the other side of the world trying to sort out what are ultimately meaningless differences between various flavors of medieval ideologies.

Same kind of stuff a lot of people were sayin on December 6th, 1941. We all know how that turned out.

 

[Warmi]

Same kind of stuff a lot of people were sayin on December 6th, 1941. We all know how that turned out.

That’s not even remotely comparable - in fact it is so far off that I will just stop here.

 

[Velocity173]

Did not know you and I were in the same op area at around the same time. We were providing SAR coverage for the CH-53 mine-sweepers Oct '87 to Apr '88.

Oh I wasn’t there. The CW5 that promoted me to WO1 was there. He was flying OH-58s. Not sure if it was during Praying Mantis or Prime Chance. Just know he had an Air Medal for destroying an Iranian Speedboat.

 

[denverpilot]

Did not know you and I were in the same op area at around the same time. We were providing SAR coverage for the CH-53 mine-sweepers Oct '87 to Apr '88.

And dad was over there doing the same minesweeping crap in the Suez fifteen years earlier.

Same ****, different decade, as he used to say. LOL. Never ends.

 

[gkainz]

I was "there" (Gulf of Oman) in 79/80 on GONZO station in response to the US Embassy takeover and Iran holding them hostage. Spent a lot of time dashing into and back out of the Straits of Hormuz until Operation Eagle Claw, high alert for Iranian PT boats in and among the LA Freeways type traffic in those shipping lanes. Precise identification and tracking of all that traffic for self-preservation.
So, yeah - same stuff different era ... but it continues and continues

 

[wilkersk]

I was "there" (Gulf of Oman) in 79/80 on GONZO station in response to the US Embassy takeover and Iran holding them hostage. Spent a lot of time dashing into and back out of the Straits of Hormuz until Operation Eagle Claw, high alert for Iranian PT boats in and among the LA Freeways type traffic in those shipping lanes. Precise identification and tracking of all that traffic for self-preservation.
So, yeah - same stuff different era ... but it continues and continues

I was there as well. On a 2 plane detachment aboard the USS Niagara Falls. We VERTREP'd the battle groups, running back and forth between GONZO and Masira.

 

[wilkersk]

That’s not even remotely comparable - in fact it is so far off that I will just stop here.

Here's a good read: https://www.amazon.com/Strategic-Vi...1_3?keywords=Brzezinski&qid=1579016869&sr=8-3

 

[gkainz]

I was there as well. On a 2 plane detachment aboard the USS Niagara Falls. We VERTREP'd the battle groups, running back and forth between GONZO and Masira.

I don't recall the Niagara Falls ... I do recall White Plains ... I think they were making the run between the Battle Group (Nimitz, Texas, California) and Oman, where we had some airport privileges. I was on Nimitz with VAW-112.

Edit - major bunny trail but this is POA so ... comments about VERTREP and Supply chain and googling same brought up this interesting (to me, at least) newsletter.

https://books.google.com/books?id=-...Gonzo Station Nimitz Texas California&f=false

 

[wilkersk]

I don't recall the Niagara Falls ... I do recall White Plains ... I think they were making the run between the Battle Group (Nimitz, Texas, California) and Oman, where we had some airport privileges. I was on Nimitz with VAW-112.

Edit - major bunny trail but this is POA so ... comments about VERTREP and Supply chain and googling same brought up this interesting (to me, at least) newsletter.

https://books.google.com/books?id=-io5JhEC3IsC&lpg=RA8-PA5&ots=RrgewSgcqf&dq=1979 battle group on Gonzo Station Nimitz Texas California&pg=RA8-PA8#v=onepage&q=1979 battle group on Gonzo Station Nimitz Texas California&f=false

Hell, maybe it was White Plains, all those AFS dets kinda get blurred together in my memory. Old age and such. Now, I'll have to go and check my microfiche.

 

[gkainz]

Hell, maybe it was White Plains, all those AFS dets kinda get blurred together in my memory. Old age and such. Now, I'll have to go and check my microfiche.

Roger that! Things tend to blur a bit looking through the way-back glasses ...

 

[midwestpa24]

Seeing videos coming out now confirming two missiles launched and probably struck the aircraft. Same video also shows the aircraft managed to stay aloft even after that until bursting into flames.

 

[RyanShort1]

Seeing videos coming out now confirming two missiles launched and probably struck the aircraft. Same video also shows the aircraft managed to stay aloft even after that until bursting into flames.

The implication of the carnage inside that tube in the sky before they even hit the ground is truly gut-wrenching, revolting, and sickening.
Man’s inhumanity to man.

 

[Warlock]

With a SA15 engagement we always assumed a multi missile launch...sort of s.o.p for that type of system...

 

[weilke]

Seeing videos coming out now confirming two missiles launched and probably struck the aircraft. Same video also shows the aircraft managed to stay aloft even after that until bursting into flames.

Just to reinforce any stereotype folks outside the country may have, Iran has now arrested the guy who shot the video. Can't have citizens mess up a perfectly good propaganda lie.

 

[jonvcaples]

Their confession blew me away! I wonder what behind the scenes activity occurred. Several factors that make me wonder what forced them to confess.
1-How much did the presence of Canadians play?
2-What evidence do we have? As a former intel officer and contractor I can reasonably guess at possible National Technical Means that could have been used. In addition to these surely HUMINT was a big contributor.
3-Given their track record of never admitting responsibility or liability what was different this time leading to their admission this time?

 

[jonvcaples]

Typically SAMs are fired in pairs. This is a common practice as it results in a significant increase of Pk (probability of kill). As an example, assume the SAM has a Pk of .5 for one missile. By launching 2, near simultaneously, the Pk increases to .75.

 

[Velocity173]

Very lucky in this one. Not to downplay the TBIs but it could’ve been much worse.

 

[NordicDave]

What an utterly primitive viewpoint.

LMAO, you have a way with word expression.