Becoming a professional new pilot at 50

Todd Barbee

Filing Flight Plan
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Todd Barbee
Ok, I saw a post about this but couldn't find it so I'm here. I want to become a pilot and actually make money at it. It does NOT have to be a killing, $60000 a year would be plenty. Question is, starting from ground zero at 50, is it a useless venture. I am open to all advice.

Thanks
 
Sure, 2 years and enough money you can be at the regionals. Spend 30-40 grand get your comm and CFI instruct for 1.x years go do the regional thing.

Will family factor in. Can you afford to be out of work, can you pass the medical, are you willing to move to instruct if not near a place you can get hrs. Do you even like flying, theres gonna be a ton of work doing that accelerated.
 
Seems like you would need to have a lot of cash saved up and spend a couple years really not earning much, unless you are lucky (really, REALLY lucky!) enough to live near an area that has an adequate volume of student pilots to keep instructors flying regularly enough to earn a living. If you have a spouse that earns a decent wage that allows you to live on a single income for a while that would work. If you need to take out any loans to pay for flight training I think most everyone here, including me, will advocate against it. If money is not an option then consider yourself fortunate that you can even consider this career change. Moving one step beyond that good fortune, many will tell you to take the $$$ you would spend earning your Commercial rating (with an IR, because the comm ticket alone ain't gonna earn you much of a living, generally) and buy your own airplane and just go have fun aviating around. If you're set on a career path in the wild blue, then go for it! Have fun, write lots of posts here, and keep us all informed of your progress. You wouldn't be the first guy to do it, so it's definitely possible. Good luck!!!
 
The money you are going to spend ,to get ,your ATP rating,is some serious money.also starting at ground zero can take a bit of time, if you plan on going to the airlines,it will be a short career before forced retirement.
 
Can you pass a first class medical? If not...

Doesn't need a Class 1 to make 60K. I make close to 6 figures on a Class 2. Just needs to determine what segment of "professional flying" he wants to go into.
 
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Ok, I saw a post about this but couldn't find it so I'm here. I want to become a pilot and actually make money at it. It does NOT have to be a killing, $60000 a year would be plenty. Question is, starting from ground zero at 50, is it a useless venture. I am open to all advice.

Thanks

I don't think so. Depending on how quickly you achieved the required certificates/ratings, what type of flying job you're seeking, and acquiring the needed hours are the main factors. Plenty of Part 91 jobs (corporate, charter, etc) where age is not a factor (allegedly), and if your goal is the airlines (Part 121), the retirement age is 65, or even flight instructor, you won't get rich, they're all achievable.
 
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O I want to become a pilot and actually make money at it.

Thanks

Lots of options there - flying cargo, delivering planes, crop dusting, air photography, tourist rides, airline pilot, instructing, etc. I'm sure you can find one of those that could work for you, as long as you're open minded.
 
The money you are going to spend ,to get ,your ATP rating,is some serious money.also starting at ground zero can take a bit of time, if you plan on going to the airlines,it will be a short career before forced retirement.
1) ATP is not a rating.
2) the requirements are more experience related, not training.
 
I don't think so. Depending on how quickly you achieved the required certificates/ratings, what type of flying job you're seeking, and acquiring the needed hours are the main factors. Plenty of Part 91 jobs (corporate, charter, etc) where age is not a factor (allegedly), and if your goal is the airlines (Part 121), the retirement age is 65, or even flight instructor, you won't get rich, they're all achievable.
Right... if your income needs are $60k, it will take several years to get there. Many of those years you are in the hole.
You may not “average” $60k between now and retirement.
 
I got a friend who retired from the FAA as a controller who hired on a bit over a year ago flying RJs for one of the AA feeders. Some of them are pretty desperate.
 
I have a friend who went to the airlines at around 50. The difference was that he had already been flying recreationally for a number of years before he decided to go commercial. He also had his own nicely IFR equipped Piper Lance to train in. Once he committed to the commercial route, he got his CFI ticket and taught students while he built time and got additional ratings. If I recall, he did that for about 2 years before he applied and got a job with Sky West. I will say this, Bobby was a fairly wealthy business owner when he took this on. He basically had built his business up to a point that somebody else could run it while he focused on flying. The airline job was purely for fun. Not saying it can't be done another way, just saying that he was able to get done what needed to be done in a timely manner because he didn't need to worry about time or money.
 
Your timing is great.......first things first.....do a demo flight if you haven't already and see if you like the air......then ideally you are in perfect health....the FAA will make your life hell over some little odd health things......talk to an AME BEFORE you go in for real.....
 
My PPL CFI did that. He's doing pretty well as a charter pilot right now.
 
I got a friend who retired from the FAA as a controller who hired on a bit over a year ago flying RJs for one of the AA feeders. Some of them are pretty desperate.

They must be desperate if they'll hire a former FAA guy! (Isn't that your implication?) LOL
 
What do you mean starting from zero? If you haven't at least taken a few lessons, gotten bumped around, had an in-flight issue with an aircraft, or been yelled at by ATC I'd suggest you go out and do those things first. If you still want to fly after that and can pass a 1st class medical you're set, unless a health issue arises down the road.
 
Doesn't need a Class 1 to make 60K. I make close to 6 figures on a Class 2. Just needs to determine what segment of "professional flying" he wants to go into.

That.



And despite what all the private pilots tell you, there's tons of money and better lifestyles OUTSIDE OF THE AIRLINES too lol

If you really want it, you get the experience, I'd say with a couple thousand hours 60k a year wouldn't be hard to hit, numbers would go up from there and your experience goes up, most places just want someone with experience and who is easy to get along with, much like any profession.
 
Before we do some basic analysis realize this is a huge lifestyle change and commitment.

The numbers are basically this.

If you want the regular ATP certificate you’ll need 1500 flight hours. (We’ll leave out PIC vs non PIC and minutae for the rough numbers here for simplicity.)

If you paid for 100% of that time and managed to average $100/hr for aircraft and instructors needed throughout the course of the entire 1500 hours, that’d be $150,000.

If you have that much cash available and no job and plenty of free time, no weather, and you can fly every day for slightly over 4 hours, you’ll be done in a year.

Heh. Okay obviously that’s not workable or even close to it for most people. Let’s change it a bit. But that’s the raw numbers. $150,000+ and a year with no lost time on ANY day, seven days a week.

To knock off most of the price tag, you’ll probably instruct. Teaching is by far the most common way to gain additional hours for cheaper or “free”.

Technically you’re also getting paid (debates on how much to charge for ground/flight and any expenses you incur to do it, notwithstanding) to fly.

But how much will you be making? Let’s use round numbers again for ease of math. You’re charging $50/hr and only charging for flight time. You get just under eight hours in the air every week for a total of 400 hours a year.



(This Number was chosen because it is higher than some of the instructors here on this board said they got when instructing full time.)

That’s $20,000/annually.

So let’s do that math. You paid a bit over $25,000 to get to 250+ hours Commercial and CFI ratings.

You then take a job making about $20,000 a year and need to do that for 3.2 years at that pace, minimum, to make 1500 hours.

Can you work in other aviation jobs prior to 1500? Yes. Sure. They can even be decently paid but not stellar.

I’m just using the ATP as the baseline assuming you’re interested in airline flying.

So... you’re now 54, three years of instructing and you’re job hunting.

Your timing IS good but the industry pay is still (and probably always will be) poor.

You’ve managed to live well below poverty line for three years after shelling out $25,000 from your pocket.

Now you get hired by a regional airline.

MOST (and this gets fuzzy but I’ll just plow on) regional airlines claim to pay about $60K for beginning First Officers right now. BUT. And it’s a big but... if you’re coming from any other profession you’ll find their “accounting practices” interesting.

That $60,000 number at MOST regional airlines right now (take with a grain of salt or a pound as you see fit) is a base salary closer to $35,000, a signing bonus that isn’t paid out in full up front but is either a lump after you’ve stayed for a while or a series of chunks over a longer period of time.

And then they count things like the maximum 401K match and paid sick time or PTO as part of that $60,000 “total compensation” number. Some even include what they pay you for their portion of your medical insurance as part of this “You’ll make X dollars!” sales pitch about your first year. Just be aware of this. They have this stuff on their websites.

Compared to most other professions, where these things would be on top of salary offered and considered perks, they sell it to you as part of the number of your “total compensation” package. It’s an “all inclusive” number. Just be aware this is common. If they say $70,000 to start, get the breakdown of that. It’s likely NOT $70,000 pre-tax in your pocket like any other job offer usually would be.

Okay... so you basically got a $10K raise from Instructing, and medical bennies (unlikely you had much of anything as an instructor), and a 401k which you can’t afford to put anything into, to get that match, unless your household has other income besides yours.

Each year as an FO you’ll get a small raise and if the airline is growing you’ll probably be able to upgrade to Captain fairly quickly. Quickly meaning at least a couple of years perhaps three.

And that’s screaming fast in this biz compared to some decades, and common right now with massive hiring going on for various reasons. (I won’t go into it there’s news articles everywhere about it. Search “pilot shortage”.)

Bonuses aren’t guaranteed in any biz. Careful of those. Also upgrades aren’t guaranteed anywhere either and seniority is literally your life after your hired. One bad contract gone astray with a bigger carrier and regionals have and do disappear in a cloud of debt and furloughs. And you get to hit the streets and start over at another airline. Be careful again here.

Choose wisely. Or at least know it has happened in airline history. A lot. Not so much right now during big growth. But it has happened.

This is hard numbers. You can find better and way worse. You can find Commercial flying gigs that aren’t airline pilot jobs. You can really enjoy the hell out of a lot of things including the flying at any Aviation job, if you’re the agreeable sort.

But the money and specifically the low pay, makes this a lifestyle more than a profession. Not that you shouldn’t consider yourself the consummate professional while doing any of it. I mean in terms of comparison to other professions.

In our hypothetical you’re 54-57 and finally Captain upgraded. Probably closer to 54. And it assumes you can drop everything and go blow $25,000 in a year or a little longer.

To get to Commercial minimums so you can then learn to instruct and take that checkride you’d need to fly just under an hour and a half per day for all 365 days of that first year.

So that’s probably a bit blown. Math is tight on that and if flew a LOT you could keep up with that average. You probably don’t have time for a full time job doing that but maybe. If you and your instructor(s) are hard goal focused and both available all the time. And you have that cash ready to go.

Hopefully this helps put the timeline and numbers in a little perspective. You can make it longer than 4-5 years but it’s hard to make it lower without wads and wads of cash.

Got that $150,000 in the bank? Get to the airport and get to flying. Very rare but some people do it that way. Most need a “time builder” job after the first $25,000 spent. Assuming $100/hr.
 
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