background checks for EAA Young Eagles pilots?

Since the Chinese stole all my security info from OPM on all the background checks I've went through from 50 years of Classified Work, not to mention the countless credit card hacks everywhere, I haven't cared about protecting my info since there's nothing to protect.:rolleyes: One more in the system means nothing to me and if it's required by EAA, OK by me.

Cheers
 
Lindberg said:
So it won't catch all of the scumbags looking to prey on kids, only some of them. If there was a 100% solution, I'm sure they would deploy that instead. But there isn't.
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There is a 100% solution. But that would end the program.

flyingron said:
So, the fear of litigation obviates the need for the EAA to be responsible to protecting the privacy of the volunteers. I guess the risk of being sued in the remote case of a child molestation is a lot bigger concern than the risk of them being sued when someone steals my identity from their fly-by-night, unidentified background check site.
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Yep. Wonder if the lawyers are driving this, or the insurance companies.
 
weilke said:
Right, but those are 'could' scenarios, not actual events.

EAA provides insurance foe the YE program. I bet this is insurance lawyer driven. They think in 'could' scenarios a lot.
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We do many things in aviation that are 'could' scenarios. We don't fly until 8 hours after drinking even though we probably wouldn't crash if we cheated on that.
 
I had to pass a background check to serve hot lunch at my kids school.
 
In Georgia you can have exactly what you described. Use your Georgia Concealed Carry Permit card. This govt issued permit should be enough of a back ground check for anyone.



ksandrew said:
If I could just get one background check and then carry a card in my wallet that would be OK. It could be as secure as my drivers license with a picture.

Ken
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LT4247 said:
In Georgia you can have exactly what you described. Use your Georgia Concealed Carry Permit card. This govt issued permit should be enough of a back ground check for anyone.
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Background checks to work in child and eldercare facilities include items that are not looked at for a CWP. E.g. having been removed from the staff of a child or eldercare facility due to neglect would not disqualify you from a CWP, it would disqualify you from providing foster care or working in a nursing home.
 
I won't bother to participate. If my plane my gas, my time is not enough, I do not care to play the game. Everytime I turn around it is more crap like this. Our chapter is supposed to do an YE evnet for the Girl Scouts, but the den mother won't return our calls to set up a date. Nobody seems to care anyway.
 
weilke said:
Background checks to work in child and eldercare facilities include items that are not looked at for a CWP. E.g. having been removed from the staff of a child or eldercare facility due to neglect would not disqualify you from a CWP, it would disqualify you from providing foster care or working in a nursing home.
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I guess that would depend on your state. Felonies disqualify you just about anywhere (you can't carry guns) and in my state, more than one misdemeanor will stop you as well.
 
flyingron said:
I guess that would depend on your state. Felonies disqualify you just about anywhere (you can't carry guns) and in my state, more than one misdemeanor will stop you as well.
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They look at criminal convictions. If you get fired from a nursing home for posting to facebook while you were supposed to check on the residents, you won't necessarily catch any criminal charges, but you probably shouldn't work in another nursing home either.
 
flyingron said:
And the EAA will have to convince me their office and contracted background check organization can be trusted with the personal information that short form asks me for. We've been through the identity theft thing here already and we're not going to do it again just so we can volunteer.
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Agreed.....

Example...


I let my membership lapse ...


I was a CAP member till a couple crashes caused by sheer stupidity killed 4 people.... I went through their entire background check the first time,,, Finger prints and all.. Even though there is not a Cadet with 200 miles...:rolleyes:...

So, a few years later and what seemed like the local chapter was evolving into a more sane batch of people... I was invited and attended one of their monthly meeting and decided to rejoin..

So,,, They give me the " card" to take to the local sheriff for prelim background check, two forms of picture ID and more finger printing.... I even joked with the officer who printed me... You have already ran me through NCIC,, confirmed my true identity, now explain how my finger prints will be different this time around..:confused::confused:..:dunno:

We both laughed...:rolleyes::rolleyes:
 
The problem isn't getting a background check. The problem is the SSN and the security of the info with EAA and the background vendor.
Additionally the requirement for all volunteers is impractical at best. Even my wife who does the registration and prints the certificates would have to be checked. They just haven't thought this through with respect to the YE program specifically.
Read the requirements, additional adult present when buckling in a kid. Specific permission to fly in a 2 place aircraft, over and above the waiver. Parents can't help, additional "watchdogs" and on and on.
I want to protect children, but the way the EAA is going about it certainly isn't transparent nor practical.
 
combahee said:
The problem isn't getting a background check. The problem is the SSN and the security of the info with EAA and the background vendor.
Additionally the requirement for all volunteers is impractical at best. Even my wife who does the registration and prints the certificates would have to be checked. They just haven't thought this through with respect to the YE program specifically.
Read the requirements, additional adult present when buckling in a kid. Specific permission to fly in a 2 place aircraft, over and above the waiver. Parents can't help, additional "watchdogs" and on and on.
I want to protect children, but the way the EAA is going about it certainly isn't transparent nor practical.
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Maybe that stuff is a product of being inexperienced with this kind of thing. :dunno:
 
yep, count me out. I was already on the fence about doing another YE, regarding the wear and tear on my airplane for little return considering the demographics of the area, but this one does it. No thanks. Nice program in theory, but if people are interested in my charity they're gonna have to accept that life entails opportunity costs. To each their own.
 
Like several here I've had an SSBI investigation done every 5 years for the last 22 years... Couple that with the OPM mishap and I'm not particularly concerned with who has my info.

However I can see how people would become uninterested in filing out paper work to volunteer. Don't compare this to CAP- the motivation to fly Young Eagles is merely to share aviation with kids. Make it a hassle and people won't do it. I for one won't do it because I don't want to expose my family to litigation if something happens. I do take kids of friends on rides... So doing my part!
 
My motivation to fly Young Eagles is a hope to get the interested in aviation and keep that interest by having them come back once a quarter and fly again and get them involved in our youth program. We currently have 6 -10 young folks showing up every Saturday learning how to build an airplane. We have a half dozen who show up on a monthly basis for a free ground school.

I know of a half dozen young adults currently with certificates and in college in aviation programs that started with us as Young Eagles. I'd say it is quite worthwhile for me to take a few minutes answering some questions at the web site and them filling in the form at the end.
 
It looks to be a poorly thought out CYA response. Having had my identity and my wife's compromised 3 times by commercial operations and now by the government, I'm not willing to chance it. I will steer clear of anything YE related from now on. Our Chapter has always had a good turnout for YE events, but I believe that is going to come to a halt this year. We have one YE event that we do with an international organization and everyone is background checked for that, but it's done by a single individual, via a local PD and it doesn't require SSNs or DL numbers. This policy may kill that event too.
 
combahee said:
The problem isn't getting a background check. The problem is the SSN and the security of the info with EAA and the background vendor.
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Bingo.

SSN's are not needed to determine a person's criminal history.
 
I wonder if the form can take a random set of 1's and 0's for the SSN?

I'd be curious if I would get approved if I did that.
_________________________________________________

I still don't see how they are going to enforce this when the different YE events happen.

I've seen a few events with walk in helpers who we were glad to have. And others with a local CAP troop with older cadets who helped with ramp escort and marshalling duties. Are these walk-ins, cadets, and their adult leader supposed to submit to what YE is asking for before the event coordinator can accept their help?
 
weilke said:
I dont see how any of these cases could have been prevented with a background check. They were all first arrests.
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Background checks do keep convicts away to begin with, however.

No background check can prevent first offense crimes or misbehavior. But requiring multiple adults to be present would mitigate the first-offense issue unless BOTH adults are *******s or perverts or whatever.
 
Morgan3820 said:
I won't bother to participate. If my plane my gas, my time is not enough, I do not care to play the game. Everytime I turn around it is more crap like this. Our chapter is supposed to do an YE evnet for the Girl Scouts, but the den mother won't return our calls to set up a date. Nobody seems to care anyway.
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When did the GS change the policy? I thought the GS only did ground, they weren't allowed to fly (discriminatory!) We fly girls who "just happen" to be GS but not at an official GS activity.
 
murphey said:
When did the GS change the policy? I thought the GS only did ground, they weren't allowed to fly (discriminatory!) We fly girls who "just happen" to be GS but not at an official GS activity.
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That is how you have to do it with GS. Each parent comes with their GS and fills out the app and signs and it becomes a non GS sanctioned flight.
 
Used to be all you had to worry about with Girl Scouts was Boy Scouts.


If you're looking for adventure of a new and different kind,
and you come across a Girl Scout who is similarly inclined,
don't be nervous, don't be flustered, don't be scared...BE PREPARED.

(note that this was pretty risque for Tom Lehrer back in the 1950's when he wrote it...but it was actually a toned down version of his original lyrics which was of a more homosexual nature).
 
petrolero said:
Background checks do keep convicts away to begin with, however.
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Uh, no they don't. Gun control background checks prove otherwise.

No background check can prevent first offense crimes or misbehavior. But requiring multiple adults to be present would mitigate the first-offense issue unless BOTH adults are *******s or perverts or whatever.
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this
 
Would logic indicate that, given the large number of children on the grounds at AirVenture, volunteers at that event should be similarly vetted? KidVenture stands out as the obvious example. Just sayin'....

I suspect that would effectively kill EAA volunteer-ism, unfortunately.

Jim

Edit... and yes, I'm intentionally agitating :rolleyes2:
 
And what happens if your SSN has been stolen & used by other? I wave a long story in that regard
 
Looks like this policy runs even deeper than the YE program. It appears from the policy info to even include Chapter meetings. So now a kid has to have a permission slip from a parent to attend a meeting and the Chapter has to keep up with all of this paperwork for a minimum of 3 years after the signing date. Sounds like someone at headquaters is really wanting to kill of bringing a new generation into aviation and the EAA.
 
EppyGA said:
For anyone interested, this is the company behind the mysterious background checks

http://americanchecked.com/
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If you believe that. Unfortunately, the EAA form goes to some anonymous site called 8F7.COM. Neither that domain nor the security certificates used to lull the users into a false sense of security are traceable to that company, which frankly even if you take it at its face looks dubious as hell anyhow.
 
I guess that if we are flying the C-172, two seats must be occupied by EAA screened supervisors. And leave the doors open?

Effective Supervision
Supervision is essential to protect youth and provide a safe and positive experience for EAA’s youth participants. There are four guidelines pertaining to supervision.

1. Two-Deep Leadership. This is a term that means that a minimum of two adults who have completed the EAA’s youth protection screening process must be in attendance as supervisors at all times. “Attendance as supervisors” requires that the person must be present and actively circulating through the areas in which services are being provided, in order to monitor all activities for appropriate behavior.

2. Staff-to-Youth Ratio. For participants under the age of thirteen (13), two staff members or volunteers must be present for every ten (10) Youth participants. For groups of participants thirteen (13) years of age and older, two staff members or volunteers must be present for every twenty-four (24) Youth participants.

3. Open Door Policy. Many claims of molestation or abuse stem from instances when adults are in isolated areas with Youth. When using smaller rooms or enclosed areas for EAA-related programs for Youth, staff and volunteers must ensure that the doors are left open at all times, for the protection of both parties.

4. Flight Programs. Due to the nature of some of EAA-related programs (e.g., two-seat Young Eagles aircraft rides), there are times when it will be impossible for two adults to be present in an activity involving a Youth. In such cases, the staff member or volunteer should take particular care to ensure that the Youth and their parents are aware of the circumstances.

Next
 
AuntPeggy said:
I guess that if we are flying the C-172, two seats must be occupied by EAA screened supervisors. And leave the doors open?

Effective Supervision
Supervision is essential to protect youth and provide a safe and positive experience for EAA’s youth participants. There are four guidelines pertaining to supervision.

1. Two-Deep Leadership. This is a term that means that a minimum of two adults who have completed the EAA’s youth protection screening process must be in attendance as supervisors at all times. “Attendance as supervisors” requires that the person must be present and actively circulating through the areas in which services are being provided, in order to monitor all activities for appropriate behavior.

2. Staff-to-Youth Ratio. For participants under the age of thirteen (13), two staff members or volunteers must be present for every ten (10) Youth participants. For groups of participants thirteen (13) years of age and older, two staff members or volunteers must be present for every twenty-four (24) Youth participants.

3. Open Door Policy. Many claims of molestation or abuse stem from instances when adults are in isolated areas with Youth. When using smaller rooms or enclosed areas for EAA-related programs for Youth, staff and volunteers must ensure that the doors are left open at all times, for the protection of both parties.

4. Flight Programs. Due to the nature of some of EAA-related programs (e.g., two-seat Young Eagles aircraft rides), there are times when it will be impossible for two adults to be present in an activity involving a Youth. In such cases, the staff member or volunteer should take particular care to ensure that the Youth and their parents are aware of the circumstances.

Next
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An airplane flight would fall under #4.

The rules aren't really any different than other organizations that work with children, whether it's CAP or BSA or anything else. It's just a common sense approach to protecting yourself.

Of course, another common sense approach is just not to work with children.
 
bflynn said:
An airplane flight would fall under #4.
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Dear Parent, we can't put two adults in the plane with your kid while he gets a free ride in an airplane that would normally cost him upwards of $100. Be assured that our pilot can be trusted even though he's not allowed to be within 100' of a school or a Chuck E. Cheese.
 
flyingron said:
Dear Parent, we can't put two adults in the plane with your kid while he gets a free ride in an airplane that would normally cost him upwards of $100. Be assured that our pilot can be trusted even though he's not allowed to be within 100' of a school or a Chuck E. Cheese.
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Heh..yeah as if it wasn't hard enough to convince parents to sign the waiver for the kids to actually get in the plane.

Someone I work with has a grandson that is really interested in flying at one of these, but his parents won't sign the waiver.

Even after that add in "Are you sure, because ..blah blah" and anyone will start to think twice about letting their kids ride.

I said it over on the red board, I think this is a good thing (background checks) for EAA, should have been done earlier. BUT it does seem rather rushed and it appears they didn't really think through the execution.

More like a ready, fire, aim situation...
 
flyingron said:
Used to be all you had to worry about with Girl Scouts was Boy Scouts.


If you're looking for adventure of a new and different kind,
and you come across a Girl Scout who is similarly inclined,
don't be nervous, don't be flustered, don't be scared...BE PREPARED.

(note that this was pretty risque for Tom Lehrer back in the 1950's when he wrote it...but it was actually a toned down version of his original lyrics which was of a more homosexual nature).
Click to expand...

New math, New math.
It's so simple,
So very simple,
That only a child can do it, do it, do it....
 
murphey said:
When did the GS change the policy? I thought the GS only did ground, they weren't allowed to fly (discriminatory!) We fly girls who "just happen" to be GS but not at an official GS activity.
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I do not know about GS policy, but our chapter has been participating in alternating annual events with the GS and BS for a while now. Our next event is with the GS in April which is before EAA's May deadline so I may participate then. But I already wrote the EAA telling them that I will not participate in the future. No doubt there are plenty of new pilots with planes ready to replace me.

I friend is active in GS and she complains how restrictive they have become.
 
bflynn said:
An airplane flight would fall under #4.

The rules aren't really any different than other organizations that work with children, whether it's CAP or BSA or anything else. It's just a common sense approach to protecting yourself.

Of course, another common sense approach is just not to work with children.
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My C-172 has 4 seats. The exception stated in #4 is 2-seats.
 
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