Aviation Workforce Shortage?

N918KT

N918KT

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KT
Just wondering, but is there a shortage of aviation personnel? Not only do we have a shortage of pilots and aircraft maintenance technicians but also looks like ATC and TSA officers are needed, at least in the U.S. Do you think there will be a demand for aviation personnel in the future?

Do you think that a career in aviation is still interesting for many people or are many young adults are turning away from a career in aviation?
 
I got out of aviation maintenance because after working 22 years in Navy aviation I got out and went to work in the civilian sector. I was quickly fed up with getting crapped on then laid off, then rehired, .....and repeat! If there's a shortage, its their own damn fault! I hope it gets better for future prospects. But, I do aviation now just for fun!
 
wilkersk said:
I got out of aviation maintenance because after working 22 years in Navy aviation I got out and went to work in the civilian sector. I was quickly fed up with getting crapped on then laid off, then rehired, .....and repeat! If there's a shortage, its their own damn fault! I hope it gets better for future prospects. But, I do aviation now just for fun!
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Reading the vitriol on the forums regarding maintenance reminds me every day...
 
TSA is not aviation and with so many quitting each year, I would not even consider it as a job choice. RED FLAG!

No shortage where I live of CFI's. I can't get much in the way of students and have to work another job. Considering quitting since it nearly bankrupted me this year. Can't get an airport job, operations or even lineman despite a degree. No experience=no job around here. Working in a warehouse packaging prescriptions now. Ashamed to admit that. Aviation industry sucks!
 
I took early retirement from the airline after 35 years because I was tired of the pay cuts, and the budget cuts were making it impossible for me to deliver what I considered the minimum standard of customer service essential for customer satisfaction.
 
flhrci said:
TSA is not aviation and with so many quitting each year, I would not even consider it as a job choice. RED FLAG!
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Just wondering, but why don't you consider TSA part of aviation? TSA officers work in airports right?
 
N918KT said:
Just wondering, but why don't you consider TSA part of aviation? TSA officers work in airports right?
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True, but I consider them security and not a direct part of the aviation industry. Airport Police are what I would consider aviation industry personnel. That's just how I see it.

David
 
TSA are not aviation, in fact if anything they hurt the image of aviation.
 
N918KT said:
Just wondering, but why don't you consider TSA part of aviation? TSA officers work in airports right?
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So do janitors, ticket counter personal, restaurant workers, etc. I don't consider someone checking my bags or any I mentioned above as being in the aviation field. You have to narrow your question down to a specific segment to get any clear answer.

Aviation (pilot, ATC, mech) as a whole is healthy right now and I don't think it'll be slowing anytime soon. The company I work for has grown by 30% in the 4 short years I've been with them and we always have openings. Getting the experience to get hired in aviation is the problem.
 
Velocity173 said:
So do janitors, ticket counter personal, restaurant workers, etc. I don't consider someone checking my bags or any I mentioned above as being in the aviation field. You have to narrow your question down to a specific segment to get any clear answer.
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For me, I would consider ticket counter personnel an aviation job. They work for the airline.
 
N918KT said:
For me, I would consider ticket counter personnel an aviation job. They work for the airline.
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Well like I said, narrow it down. Basically the way your question is worded is that anything involved in the airport is aviation related. In that case, yeah, if you're working anything at a major airport then it's a pretty secure job right now.
 
Velocity173 said:
Well like I said, narrow it down. Basically the way your question is worded is that anything involved in the airport is aviation related. In that case, yeah, if you're working anything at a major airport then it's a pretty secure job right now.
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Well I guess what I meant to say that a job that is related to aviation would be anything that directly involves or affects the operation of aviation. Other jobs in the airports or for airlines are just overhead or support jobs probably.
 
This is all semantics. The OP attempted to equate the hiring dynamics of pilots as having any correlation with ancillary jobs that happen to fall under the umbrella of the aviation industry. That's a fallacy, no relationship exists. Pilot hiring is separate and apart. No relationship can be drawn to ground hiring. They are effectively different industries altogether. If that offends the gate agents and rampers, oh well. Reminds me of NASA engineers going on about the astronaut program. Yep, you work on the Space Shuttle program. Nope, still not an astronaut I'm afraid.
 
N918KT said:
For me, I would consider ticket counter personnel an aviation job. They work for the airline.
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Indeed. And they must be trained on aviation matters such as hazmat, weight & balance, security, driving jetways, interacting with flight crew, baggage tracing and repair, limits of liability, Air Carrier Access Act and acceptance of handicapped individuals, use of ARINC, reroutes and cancellations, and a ton of other stuff.
 
N918KT said:
Just wondering, but why don't you consider TSA part of aviation? TSA officers work in airports right?
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Are airport janitors considered an aviation career? They are just janitors. Being at the airport doesn't change the fact they are just janitors. Tsa is definitely not an aviation career.
 
For paying passengers, aviation is almost a commodity industry now, with heavy gov't oversight, and all that entails; slender margins, parasitic bureacracy, difficult to control costs, and high barriers to entry.

I can't see a stable, well paying future in there, except for some niche areas. It's become a pressurized bus service, with not much to distiguish one provider from another, except for the foreign flag carriers subsidized by thier gov'ts.

Other than aircrew and maintenance, the other jobs are not really aviation specific, so I don't see much direct connection to aviation in them.
 
No shortage of ATCers. Last time the FAA posted for 40 positions they got over 10,000 applicants.
 
Sundancer said:
Other than aircrew and maintenance, the other jobs are not really aviation specific, so I don't see much direct connection to aviation in them.
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Some folks might disagree. Dispatchers, rampers who deice aircraft, ticket agents who check baggage for hazmat and prohibited items and work weight & balance, airline meteorologists, Jet-A fuel specialists, management in many areas, trainers of all types, even the guys who dump the lavs - requires special training and knowledge to prevent the dreaded blue ice.
 
Mason said:
Indeed. And they must be trained on aviation matters such as hazmat, weight & balance, security, driving jetways, interacting with flight crew, baggage tracing and repair, limits of liability, Air Carrier Access Act and acceptance of handicapped individuals, use of ARINC, reroutes and cancellations, and a ton of other stuff.
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None of the ticket counter personnel that worked for the airlines that I have worked for were trained in more than a couple of those areas.

You may be over emphasizing what they do in regards to some or most all of them.

Sure they weigh the bags at check-in but they do not do any W&B calculations. Most would not know where to begin doing a W&B.

Very few deal with flight crews besides issuing them a boarding pass.

Driving gateways is done by the gate agents not ticket counter folks. Those are different jobs.

Dealing with the handicapped? Besides ordering them a wheelchair and making sure they are not assigned an emergency exit seat, else is there?

Use of ARINC? Never seen that done at the ticket counter.

Reroutes and cancellations? Well, yeah they may have to issue new tickets to the passengers for a different flight or help them with a hotel but that is about it. They do not do decide to cancel the flight and do not do reroutes. That is someone else's job.

You seem to be confusing a ticket agent's job with dispatch, routing, ramp ops, gate agents and a few other positions.
 
Wow, talk about splitting hairs.

From my perspective, if you work in the airline or aviation industry, you're an "aviation worker." Most aviation industry workers would have a least some knowledge specific to the industry--even in IT.

If companies can afford to be selective to only those candidates with experience, there isn't a shortage of them.


JKG
 
Y'all are crazy crazy! But I enjoy reading the uh, well the postings. :yikes:
 
As far as shortages in the industry.... On the day of first powered flight there was one plane with one seat and two pilots. Not much has changed since.
 
flhrci said:
Why do we have to be crazy? What if you are really crazy and we are all normal? If the shoe fits....
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Oh the shoe does fit in for me, for sure. I'm just chuckling at all the arguments of who and who isn't working in aviation. What about the dude who changes those bulbs on obstructions? There's my contribution. You're welcome. :D
 
Ticket Counter and Gate agents must receive annual training on the Air Carrier Access Act, pass a test, and have a training record. It is a lot more involved than just ordering up a wheelchair. Do you know how to handle a passenger who needs an attendant? Who supplies the attendant? How much does their ticket cost? What kind of wheelchair batteries are acceptable? How must they be packed? What can happen if you make a mistake?

At the airlines where I worked, gate agents and ticket counter agents were one work group and bid the positions by seniority. Load control agents were a specialized subset, again by seniority bid.

All agents had to take and pass annual security and hazmat training.

There is a lot more to the Customer Service Agent job than meets the eye.

As a retired General Manager responsible for the entire city operation at six different cities over 35 years, I think I know what I am talking about. Granted, many things have no doubt changed since I retired.
 
Dispatchers and fright attendants have certificate's identical to the ones we sky Gods have btw. Don't recall if mechanics do or not.
 
There are plenty of pilots out there, it's just a good amount had the door get closed on them when the 1500 hr ATP rule went into effect. The pool is far more limited then it was 5+ years ago. Before, 250+ hours would get you into the right seat of an RJ. Building time as a CFI wasn't as much of a need after graduating from a 4 year aviation college as it now. It's a good change, but it's also a curse.
 
SkyDog58 said:
Yeah but saying TSA is an aviation job is like saying the mall cop works in retail.
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TSA isn't in the aviation industry, they're in the security industry, and they provide that service for multiple forms of transportation.


JKG
 
N659HB said:
How does one get a dispatcher job?
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Basically pass the ATP written, or take a weekend course. Maybe take a practical (like a check ride) I think too. Then apply once you pass. Think that's how it works as far as you know. :D
 
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